Apple, PPC 980, and Upcoming G5s

[MacRumors]

An unconfirmed report spelling out some interesting future possibilities about Apple and their PowerPC progress and development:

"Following the microprocessor forum, IBM presented Apple with a handful of PPC 980 alpha samples to begin work on the next generation Powermac due out in 9-12 months. Initial compiler tests showed specfp base 2000 of 1400 and specint of 1200 at 3Ghz. The PPC 980 will have double the L2 cache of the 970, and will still not have an L3 cache option, owing to the fact that the 980 will have a 1x, 2x, 3x, and 4x bus multiplier, which will allow an FSB to run at the chip clock speed if need be, but the plans are to stick to a 2x multiplier, which would mean a 1.5Ghz FSB. The reason why the 980 is appearing only 12 -16 months after the 970 is that Apple chose to engage in parallel development with the Power 5, rather than wait 12-18 months after the fact. The 980 samples that were given to Apple were 90nm chips, as opposed to 130nm chips for the PPC 970 and the Power 5.

For the G5, the next revision is well under way. The bugs on IBM's 90nm process have been squashed, and ramp up will begin within 6 weeks, with intention of having enough chips ready for the next revision G5's due in February. 2.5 - 2.8 Ghz is probably going to be the ceiling of the new revision Powermac G5's based on test yields obtained recently. If everything goes well, 2Ghz may drop out of the equation entirely, and 2.2 Ghz may become the low end, a jump of 500-600 Mhz this revision is realistic, and should be expected. As for the Powerbook G5, only a general timeline is given with a range from April 2004-September 2004 is given, the only obstacle being finding an appropriate cooling technology."

[x86isslow]

good to hear! i personally wont be able to afford the 3Ghz, but hey, mebbe the 1.6Ghz will drop down to a comfy price

[DTphonehome]

Things are speeding up in Macland

[x86isslow]

and this should put an end to all the nonsense about the amd chips beating g5s.

[1macker1]

"Next generation powermac" What product will this be. I'm gearing to buy a powerbook late December early Feburary. I dont want them to drop a newer PB right after I get one. I couild wait as long as 9 months if need be. Anyone care to guess what the next gen powermac will be?

[dongmin]

For the G5, the next revision is well under way. The bugs on IBM's 90nm process have been squashed, and ramp up will begin within 6 weeks, with intention of having enough chips ready for the next revision G5's due in February. 2.5 - 2.8 Ghz is probably going to be the ceiling of the new revision Powermac G5's based on test yields obtained recently. If everything goes well, 2Ghz may drop out of the equation entirely, and 2.2 Ghz may become the low end, a jump of 500-600 Mhz this revision is realistic, and should be expected.

This is incredible, if true. Increase of 30-40% in only 4 months (from when they started shipping in early Oct.)!!! Now I'm glad I held off on the first round.

Could we see:
Fast: 2 ghz single
Faster: dual 2.4 ghz
Fastest: dual 2.8 ghz?

that would blow people away, as much as they were the first time around.

[ZildjianKX]

Don't get your hopes up...

This would be a very different Apple trend, but it would be nice if comes true.

[Catfish_Man]

2GHz 970 = 800/840
3GHz 980 = 1200/1400

change in clock frequency = 1.5
change in SPECint = 1.5
change in SPECfp = 1.666

overall: supralinear scaling with clock frequency (wouldn't be possible without other enhancements)

comments: Excellent, if it's true. Also, I doubt that significant changes have been made if it's being developed in parallel with the POWER5. It sounds as though they're just rushing it to .09 micron as quick as possible (doubling the cache with a process shrink is pretty easy. Other changes are harder). I would guess that the revision after this one would incorporate POWER5 changes.

[Makosuke]

These numbers sound so good I'm skeptical, but then again they're not out of the realm of possibility now that Apple's working with IBM.

I sure hope they're true (although I'll be bumming about my "measly" 2.0 if we see a dual 2.8s in Feburary).

[1macker1]

Dual Processor Powerbooks!!!!! That's has to be next. The g5 chip isn't coming to the PB anytime soon.

[x86isslow]

i think if you re-read the article, it says that the next revision of the G5 is different from the 980, so i doubt speeds up to dual 2.8 by feb.

[T.Rex]

Originally posted by x86isslow
and this should put an end to all the nonsense about the amd chips beating g5s.

It is hardly nonsense; while the G5's put Apple back in the game, it was hardly the knockout punch that we were led to believe. Right now, if I were in need of the absolute fastest machine for a workstation, there would be an AMD chip inside - be it the Athlon64-fx or more likely, an Opteron.

And I don't care what anyone says, such a computer would be cheaper, too.

[mvc]

Man, I'd be happy just if the dual 2Ghz became the mid range machine - cos then I could maybe afford it come february.

Isn't it refreshing to even consider a 500 mhz speed increase as being plausible. Seems we were stuck around the magic 1.2 - 1.4GHz for so long, now it looks like we may actually see our raw processor speed double in a year.

Moores law lives, at least in Mac land!

[Genie]

Seems plausible, but you never know. I'm happy with the one I have now.

[mvc]

Originally posted by T.Rex
It is hardly nonsense; while the G5's put Apple back in the game, it was hardly the knockout punch that we were led to believe.…

Hey T.Rex, stop talking like a dinosaur.
The G5 was a mass extinction event for most of the Mac Haters out there.
Evolve or Die!

[Steven1621]

let the new rumors commence!!!!!!

[mvc]

Originally posted by Steven1621
let the new rumors commence!!!!!!

Absolutely, it's been nothing but hard facts on this board for days now. Where have all the dubious rumours gone?

We need more grist for the speculative mill and the pointless G5 powerbook flame wars!

I blame Apple, how can a poor rumour site survive when they keep actually launching new hardware, software and services at this current rate!

[arn]

Take with usual skepticism for unconfirmed rumors.

arn

[tpjunkie]

even so....

*drool*

A FSB that could run at processor speed? As Keanu Reeves would say, "Whoa."

[Oirectine]

Originally posted by mvc
Hey T.Rex, stop talking like a dinosaur.
The G5 was a mass extinction event for most of the Mac Haters out there.
Evolve or Die!

That was so clever it made me want to vomit.

Good job

[manu chao]

Originally posted by 1macker1
Dual Processor Powerbooks!!!!! That's has to be next. The g5 chip isn't coming to the PB anytime soon.

I'll be the first one to buy one when they come out. The only time when I really need more power is when, I'm doing several things in parallel. Installing a new security patch for Windows in VPC, listening to music, and editing a document in Illustrator, and my 1Ghz Powerbook slows to a crawl.

[Freg3000]

Happy, happy, joy, joy!

This is wonderful. Big Blue = Big Speeds.

[NNO-Stephen]

oohhh, how nice. dual processor PowerBooks aren't gonna happen though. would require too much space and would be even hotter. I do think we could see a 2.0Ghz or so PowerBook G5 though with a die shrink to 90nm. they would have to have some sort of liquid cooling system though, which IBM already has in some Think Pads. IBM for processors, as well as the cooling technology, why not? makes perfect sense. but man, a dual 2.8Ghz G5 by February! good greif. sign me up for that one

[wrylachlan]

Originally posted by Catfish_Man
2GHz 970 = 800/840
3GHz 980 = 1200/1400

change in clock frequency = 1.5
change in SPECint = 1.5
change in SPECfp = 1.666

overall: supralinear scaling with clock frequency (wouldn't be possible without other enhancements)

comments: Excellent, if it's true. Also, I doubt that significant changes have been made if it's being developed in parallel with the POWER5. It sounds as though they're just rushing it to .09 micron as quick as possible (doubling the cache with a process shrink is pretty easy. Other changes are harder). I would guess that the revision after this one would incorporate POWER5 changes.

This seems fishy in that its kind of underwhelming. Not the overall speed increase, but the spec scores per clock. If the 980 is based on the Power5 then there should be a more significant per clock increase in spec scores as the Power5 is a significant increase on the Power4 which the 970 is based on. And the original article implies that the 980 is using the Power5 as a base just working in parallel development instead of waiting for the Power5 to be finished...

[Frobozz]

This all sounds plausible. I have a Quicksilver DP 1 Ghz machine and it feels snappier than when I bought it, thanks in part to Panther. I figured that my next machine would be a Dual 3.0 Ghz G5, and it looks like next June will be the timeframe. Perfect... right after I get married... no more wedding expenses. :-)

Apple could hardly be doing anything better these days. I really have to give it to them: it seems like their CPU problems are *finally* resolved. I would like to see the PB G5, or a snappier PB G4, however.