Apple in Mobile Music Negotiations... for WWDC?

[MacRumors]

NYTimes' Technology blog reports that Apple is currently in active negotiations with music labels about providing more mobile music content on their iTunes store.

One executive quoted specifically states that "[Apple wants] a big launch in June", presumably referring to the Worldwide Developer Conference (WWDC) scheduled to start on June 9th 2008. However, since negotiations only started a few weeks ago, the deals may not be in place in time for a WWDC announcement.

Apple reportedly wants to expand its Ringtone library and introduce the sale of "Answer Tones". Answer Tones are customized sounds played to callers instead of the traditional ringing sound.

Another area of negotiation is the distribution of iTunes songs over the cellular network. For now, the iPhone allows you to purchase iTunes music only over Wi-fi networks. This had been thought to be a limitation of the slower EDGE data network, but it appears this mobile music distribution must be specifically negotiated with the record labels. Traditionally, these over-the-air cellular music sales have carried a premium over the traditional internet distribution, and the music labels are requesting a higher price for these sales. The expected addition of faster 3G data service on the upcoming iPhone will certainly increase consumer demand for over-the-air iTunes downloads.

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[PLiK]

So is Big Music going to charge me more for a CD if I drive my own car to a music store instead of taking the bus?

What difference does it make to Big Music if I download a song over wi-fi or a cell network?

[TonyHoyle]

I don't see how answer tones are going to work - it's not your phone that produces the ringing sound, it's the phone operator (normally your own, as the line isn't active until the other end answers).

Only two possibilities I can think of:

1. The iphone answers the call immediately and begins playing muzak down the line, costing the caller money even if you don't answer. Doesn't work if the iphone is switched off or out of range of course. End users will hate this.. I certainly wouldn't call someone with such a system as I don't see why I should pay to have crap played at me.
2. The operator has special answer system for iphones, which would be expensive for them to setup and presumably only work within a single operator (otherwise you'd have all the cross licensing stuff to deal with). Can't see what the financial incentive for them to implement this would be, and precisely why they would limit it to iphones.

[MacFly123]

Originally Posted by PLiK

So is Big Music going to charge me more for a CD if I drive my own car to a music store instead of taking the bus?

What difference does it make to Big Music if I download a song over wi-fi or a cell network?

AMEN!!! They are such greedy idiots, all they think about is money and now they are going to jeopardize what would be a massive success.

From what I have heard the iTunes WIFI store has already done very well, if they made it work anywhere with 3G as well it would be even better. I have been waiting for this, and not only music, but later adding all video, movies, podcasts etc. to the iTunes (mobile) store. Come on Apple, don't let these greedy morons ruin everything!

[ArtOfWarfare]

Uhhh...

how do you set up an answer tone?

...

And does a ring tone take priority over an answer tone or do they both play at once or what?

...

It seems like people could prank call without even needing the other person to pick up... they just set their answer tone to be something ridiculous and call away...

Rick Roll everyone and they can't do anything about it.

[zedsdead]

The "Answer Tones" seems pretty cool. Also, the EDGE information is interesting, but if Apple sets it up with higher prices, then it is terrible.

In regards to the music industry, I really wish Apple would finish the iTunes Plus nonsense. They are the #1 distributer of music in the US, and it is time to use that leverage to force Universal and Time Warner on board.

[jonnylink]

Answer tones have been around for a while, folks. I don't have a clue how they work, but they are a fact. Why the heck would you even doubt something like that? Because you can't figure it out you think that Apple and AT&T can't either?

If you don't believe me get access to Google's GrandCentral or make some calls to Japan. Or call people in the US where it is also available on some cell phones.

The thing that people have hit on though, they are annoying. It's like being put on hold right away a fed some one's annoying taste in music.

[sishaw]

Originally Posted by jonnylink

Answer tones have been around for a while, folks. I don't have a clue how they work, but they are a fact. Why the heck would you even doubt something like that? Because you can't figure it out you think that Apple and AT&T can't either?

If you don't believe me get access to Google's GrandCentral or make some calls to Japan. Or call people in the US where it is also available on some cell phones.

The thing that people have hit on though, they are annoying. It's like being put on hold right away a fed some one's annoying taste in music.

Yeah, my cellular provider has them also. It's not such a big deal, but I guess there's a market for them. I have yet to encounter any myself.

[genshi]

Originally Posted by TonyHoyle

I don't see how answer tones are going to work - it's not your phone that produces the ringing sound, it's the phone operator (normally your own, as the line isn't active until the other end answers).

Only two possibilities I can think of:

1. The iphone answers the call immediately and begins playing muzak down the line, costing the caller money even if you don't answer. Doesn't work if the iphone is switched off or out of range of course. End users will hate this.. I certainly wouldn't call someone with such a system as I don't see why I should pay to have crap played at me.
2. The operator has special answer system for iphones, which would be expensive for them to setup and presumably only work within a single operator (otherwise you'd have all the cross licensing stuff to deal with). Can't see what the financial incentive for them to implement this would be, and precisely why they would limit it to iphones.

Originally Posted by ArtOfWarfare

Uhhh...

how do you set up an answer tone?

And does a ring tone take priority over an answer tone or do they both play at once or what?

It seems like people could prank call without even needing the other person to pick up... they just set their answer tone to be something ridiculous and call away...

Rick Roll everyone and they can't do anything about it.

Answer from http://www.wireless.att.com/learn/ri...p#answer_tones

Q. Are Answer Tones different than Ringtones?
A. Yes, Answer Tones are different than Ringtones.

Ringtones are what you hear from your phone when someone calls you. Answer Tones are what your caller hears when they call your phone, in place of the standard ringing sound.

Ringtones are downloaded to your phone and stored within the handset. Answer Tones are stored on the AT&T network in a personal "library" that you can access and manage via the web or Media Net. And because your Answer Tones are stored on AT&T's servers (rather than downloaded to your handset), you can move your SIM card to another phone and your callers will still hear the Answer Tone you've selected for them.

Each Answer Tone will have an expiration date associated with it. As an Answer Tone's expiration date approaches, we will alert you via a free text message so that you may re-purchase another Answer Tone.

Because the Answer Tones service is provided on the AT&T network (unlike Ringtones), there is a monthly fee for service.

It's funny to see this article today as I had never heard of Answer Tones until reading this, but I experienced it for the first time last night:

I called a new friend I had never called before and instead of her phone ringing, it immediately started playing music (really, really bad music) so I assumed it just went straight to voice mail, so I hung up (because I didn't want to leave a message) and called back and it went right to the bad music again. So this time I waited (again, assuming it was going to voicemail) to leave a message and after about what seemed a full minute, she answered! I was very confused. I told her that her phone didn't ring it just went straight to some music and she said "oh, that IS my ring!" That REALLY annoyed me. I won't be calling her again.

[Drewstin77]

answer tones (wile annoying) are already available for iPhone users, i know because my friend and i both bought ours a few months ago & everytime i call him i hear that stupid "beautiful girls" song playing.

[Peace]

ummm. Wouldn't the answer tone kind of defeat the purpose of a ringtone ? They seem to counter each other.. I like to control my own phone thank you very much.

[genshi]

Originally Posted by Peace

ummm. Wouldn't the answer tone kind of defeat the purpose of a ringtone ? They seem to counter each other.. I like to control my own phone thank you very much.

What!? You must have not read the whole thread otherwise you would have seen my post:

Q. Are Answer Tones different than Ringtones?
A. Yes, Answer Tones are different than Ringtones.

Ringtones are what you hear from your phone when someone calls you. Answer Tones are what your caller hears when they call your phone, in place of the standard ringing sound.

Ringtones are downloaded to your phone and stored within the handset. Answer Tones are stored on the AT&T network in a personal "library" that you can access and manage via the web or Media Net. And because your Answer Tones are stored on AT&T's servers (rather than downloaded to your handset), you can move your SIM card to another phone and your callers will still hear the Answer Tone you've selected for them.

Each Answer Tone will have an expiration date associated with it. As an Answer Tone's expiration date approaches, we will alert you via a free text message so that you may re-purchase another Answer Tone.

Because the Answer Tones service is provided on the AT&T network (unlike Ringtones), there is a monthly fee for service.

[Baron58]

I would love 'answer tones' if I could record my own....

See, I don't want to carry two phones, so I refused a work-issued one and use my own. I also keep my desk phone forwarded to my cell, so I'm (a) not tied to my desk, and (b) nobody can figure out exactly where I am when they call.

However, there's a company policy that your outgoing message has to be "This is <your name> at <company name>. Thank you for calling. I'm sorry I can't take your call blah blah yadda yadda..... Please visit our website at <URL>". I REFUSE to put that crap on my outgoing message on my personal cell, I don't even have my name there, I just use the default AT&T outgoing.

If I had the answer tones feature, I could assign the "company" outgoing message to the company caller ID (for calls forwarded from my desk) and to my boss's cell number, so it would create the illusion of having that as my outgoing message!

[GQB]

I can't envision the pressing need to download songs directly to my iPhone.

Could someone please explain for me the scenario by which I really need this capability? I seriously don't get it.

I'm somewhere away from my computer (i.e. iTunes) and I hear a song that I just HAVE to have. I apparently didn't hear it on my iPhone, despite that's where most of my content comes from. Instead of just jotting down or noting the name of the song and artist and downloading it when I get home, I just HAVE to have it RIGHT NOW (despite the fact that I JUST HEARD IT.)

Why does this feel like a feature aimed at 9 year olds who just HAVE to hear that song 10 times in a row?

Seriously don't get this.

[MacFly123]

Originally Posted by GQB

I can't envision the pressing need to download songs directly to my iPhone.

Could someone please explain for me the scenario by which I really need this capability? I seriously don't get it.

I'm somewhere away from my computer (i.e. iTunes) and I hear a song that I just HAVE to have. I apparently didn't hear it on my iPhone, despite that's where most of my content comes from. Instead of just jotting down or noting the name of the song and artist and downloading it when I get home, I just HAVE to have it RIGHT NOW (despite the fact that I JUST HEARD IT.)

Why does this feel like a feature aimed at 9 year olds who just HAVE to hear that song 10 times in a row?

Seriously don't get this.

Welcome to the American lifestyle lol.

Your lack of vision is not allowing you to see that the iPhone is the future of mobile platforms and that virtually EVERYONE will have a mobile computing device like the iPhone soon that will fill many needs that a computer once did. So if you think it is not important to have media content distribution established on such a platform and devices then you seriously need to open your eyes a bit!

[GQB]

Originally Posted by MacFly123

Welcome to the American lifestyle lol.

Your lack of vision is not allowing you to see that the iPhone is the future of mobile platforms and that virtually EVERYONE will have a mobile computing device like the iPhone soon that will fill many needs that a computer once did. So if you think it is not important to have media content distribution established on such a platform and devices then you seriously need to open your eyes a bit!

I'd agree if we were indeed at a point where the mobile platform was your sole platform.
But I'll suggest that my 'lack of vision' has more to do more with my total lack of interest in contemporary music (and any trace of need for immediate gratification) than my lack of technological vision.

I'll claim possession of taste rather than lack of vision.

[Lixivial]

Originally Posted by GQB

Could someone please explain for me the scenario by which I really need this capability? I seriously don't get it.

There are a lot more potential usages for this other than superfluous instant gratification (though that certainly doesn't hurt sales).

I can envision a system that integrates radio from the car into the iPhone allowing you to purchase or pull cover art/lyrics from iTunes on the fly. Maybe stream ahead, or backward a couple of songs. Or perhaps cross referencing the song you listened to on the radio, rating it, and throwing you 5 other songs you might enjoy from the iTunes store. Likewise, any other public place that plays music, such as bars, clubs, etc.

And that's really just scratching the surface of music, let alone other sorts of media/information.

Convergence of these once disparate systems into a mobile model is the key here, as opposed to fitting this new technology into the current business model.

[/dev/toaster]

"Answer tones" are by far the most annoying thing on the planet. I have a few friends of mine that I won't call their cell because of it. Most people who use these features have strange tastes in music, and end up having something that gives me a headache.

Actually, there is 1 thing that is more annoying then "answer tones". Those people who seem to think I am intrested in their conversation, so they make sure everyone in the room can hear it. Yes, I am talking about Nextel users. Not the contractor types ... but the people who are talking about lasts nights game so everyone can hear it. I have witnessed people who have long 10 minute conversations over the Nextel after the plane has landed. The best part is, the conversations are pointless.

[twoodcc]

well it seems it would be hard for this to happen by WWDC, but i hope that it does

[seashellz]

remastered BEATLES

[Ha ze]

I love that people can download from iTunes "over the air" if it's via wifi, but if it's via 3G or some other mobile phone network it should be more expensive?

Makes no sense. The download is still coming from an Apple/iTunes server and the connection is being made with at&t (or whoever) service, so in what part f that does the record company deserve more? I'd think at&t would deserve a slight per song cut more then the record company.

[megfilmworks]

Originally Posted by Ha ze

I love that people can download from iTunes "over the air" if it's via wifi, but if it's via 3G or some other mobile phone network it should be more expensive?

Makes no sense. The download is still coming from an Apple/iTunes server and the connection is being made with at&t (or whoever) service, so in what part f that does the record company deserve more? I'd think at&t would deserve a slight per song cut more then the record company.

It's not the record label but the pipe. Att, in this case, may want a piece of the action if you are using their network.
What does that have to do with the record labels??

[Ha ze]

Originally Posted by megfilmworks

It's not the record label but the pipe. Att, in this case, may want a piece of the action if you are using their network.
What does that have to do with the record labels??

Thats exactly my point. The articles I have read have said that the record companies will be using this as a negotiating point because they typically charge higher amounts for OTA downloads.

[Dmac77]

What is with people in America and our instant gratification fetish? Why must everything happen now, for christ sake, why would could i not wait a few hours until i get home to download a song off of itunes? especially when I am going to be charged extra not just by the pigs at the labels and by AT&T for bandwidth use?

[aznkid25]

I hope this will happen.