Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard: Cocoa Finder and 64-Bit Changes

MacRumors · 05:55 PM

With the broad seeding of Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard, a few more details have been revealed about the direction Apple is going with Snow Leopard. According to the seed notes, Apple is migrating more towards Cocoa (rather than Carbon) and continues the transitioning of Mac OS X to 64-bit operating system. AppleInsider recently explored some of the details surrounding the changes.

Apple states that almost all user-facing applications in Mac OS X have been written in Cocoa with Finder being the notable exception. Apple will finally be migrating Finder to Cocoa in Snow Leopard. Despite Cocoa having a reputation amongst end-users that it is "better" than Carbon, AppleInsider notes that both will continue to coexist.

Quote:

For users, the move to Cocoa means that applications will have more consistent appearance and behavior. Apps that make use of standardized interface controls rather than building their own will not only be more familiar, but users will also benefit from the code exercise and reuse, which removes bugs and allows for centralized optimizations. In other words, Apple can address user interface problems that in turn impact all apps.

Apple is, however, focusing on Cocoa and is now requiring 64-bit applications to make the switch from Carbon. This new requirement announced at the 2007 WWDC caught some developers off-guard and is why Adobe's Photoshop CS4 remains a 32-bit application, while Windows CS4 already offers 64-bit support.

According to AppleInsider, Snow Leopard will deliver the first 64-bit kernel for Mac OS X. The benefits of 64-bit support are most apparent for applications that require large amounts of memory, and likely do not directly affect the majority of consumers. Apple's Mac OS X has already been able to provide support for 64-bit applications.

Article Link: Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard: Cocoa Finder and 64-Bit Changes

themoonisdown09 · Oct 28, 2008, 04:36 PM

I'm so ready for Snow Leopard to come out!

Quote:

Originally Posted by AppleInsider

On Mac OS X Leopard and in Snow Leopard, Apple designed the kernel to run both 32 and 64-bit software natively with no compatibility layer running, and all supporting files and libraries can be organized in the same application bundle. That means developers can distribute a single installer that works on any Mac, and that users won't need to make sure they've obtained the correct binary for their machine. This promises to go a long way in making the transition to 64-bit Mac software very smooth and virtually invisible to most users.

I think this is something that will make Snow Leopard so awesome. Having only one installer that works for any Mac will make the transition so much easier. If you take an average consumer, they wouldn't know if they're running a 32-bit version, 64-bit version or whatever. So when they go to install an application, they have no clue what version to use.

plumbingandtech · Oct 28, 2008, 04:40 PM

All this Snowy goodness is getting me to look forward to the update even more.

smokestack · Oct 28, 2008, 04:40 PM

yeah. it will likely be great.
but you know what i'm really in to? free updates that make my computer run better! come on 10.5.6!

benthewraith · Oct 28, 2008, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smokestack

yeah. it will likely be great.
you know what i'm really in to? free updates that make my computer run better! come on 10.5.6!

Snow Leopard isn't 10.5.6...

Eidorian · Oct 28, 2008, 04:41 PM

I'm more concerned about GPU hardware acceleration and decoding of video right now.

h.264 showed up n Tiger with a lot of fanfare but we're still on our CPUs to decode it.

flottenheimer · Oct 28, 2008, 04:42 PM

Can't wait for this.

thesheep · Oct 28, 2008, 04:47 PM

I don't really understand the difference between having a 64 bit kernel, and just allowing some applications to run as 64 bit... what difference will it make?

Quote:

Snow Leopard isn't 10.5.6...

He knows that. Snow Leopard won't be free either. I think he's just waiting for the next Leopard update.

iMacmatician · Oct 28, 2008, 04:50 PM

This can only be good news.

I hope to see more details - maybe a few that are obvious to the end user? - at MWSF 2009.

840quadra · Oct 28, 2008, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eidorian

I'm more concerned about GPU hardware acceleration and decoding of video right now.

h.264 showed up n Tiger with a lot of fanfare but we're still on our CPUs to decode it.

I am interested in that and support for 8GB of RAM for all generations of Core2 MacBook Pro.

Eidorian · Oct 28, 2008, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 840quadra

I am interested in that and support for 8GB of RAM for all generations of Core2 MacBook Pro.

The hardware supports it so what's causing the problems? It works on the Mac Pro with the same copy of OS X too.

sprice25 · Oct 28, 2008, 04:57 PM

snow leopard has been running well for me. great build, good future ahead. running a mac pro 2.8 8-core over here.

dizastor · Oct 28, 2008, 04:57 PM

Hopefully they'll manage to throw something new and flashy on top of all of these stability improvements.

Maybe they'll just create features out of the improvements... like "Exposé 2.0 or Finder X"

They have to give something for the marketing machine to work with after all...

Here's hoping they start taking more of John Siracusa's advice on systemwide ui improvements as well.

nick9191 · Oct 28, 2008, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 840quadra

I am interested in that and support for 8GB of RAM for all generations of Core2 MacBook Pro.

That has absolutely nothing to do with the OS.

Its a hardware limitation. Leopard already supports 100+ gb of RAM.

koobcamuk · Oct 28, 2008, 04:59 PM

I use wavemetric's IGOR Pro and that is a memory hog. 64 bit would have helped hugely. I know I am in a minority, but this just gives Windows users the edge and frankly, pisses me off!

snejj · Oct 28, 2008, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by themoonisdown09

I'm so ready for Snow Leopard to come out!
I think this is something that will make Snow Leopard so awesome. Having only one installer that works for any Mac will make the transition so much easier. If you take an average consumer, they wouldn't know if they're running a 32-bit version, 64-bit version or whatever. So when they go to install an application, they have no clue what version to use.

Um, all of that already exists in Leopard! If you have a recent Core 2 Duo Mac, you're probably running 64-bit apps right now without realizing it :-)

The only new bit in Snow Leopard (according to this report) is that the kernel itself will be 64-bit. That probably will not make any noticeable difference to apps, apart from improved speed of the overall OS.

Sky Blue · Oct 28, 2008, 05:00 PM

sounds liek a survice pak ...........wil it b freeee?

morespce54 · Oct 28, 2008, 05:00 PM

Sweet... building up expectations...

akac · Oct 28, 2008, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 840quadra

I am interested in that and support for 8GB of RAM for all generations of Core2 MacBook Pro.

You won't ever see that. Only for the new gen. This is because the hardware chipset on older MBPs simply do not support more than 4GB. The new gen MBP has a chipset that supports 8GB, but at the moment it seems the OS driver for that chipset is not setup for it.

koobcamuk · Oct 28, 2008, 05:02 PM

My 2.16Ghz Core2Duo MBP will never see more than 3GB RAM, correct?

I am looking forward to Snow Leopard for my Mini and MBP, but my PowerBook is being left out here... might even downgrade to 10.4.11 as that was the most stable OS I have ever used.

mkrishnan · Oct 28, 2008, 05:02 PM

Since Finder lock-ups, beachballs, and crashes are not quite yet a thing of the past, who knows? Maybe, whether it has anything to do with Cocoa or not, the re-write will mean Finder will be more robust than it is now.

EDIT: And yes, correct, there's nothing the OS can do that will allow older chipsets to see more memory.

Eidorian · Oct 28, 2008, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akac

You won't ever see that. Only for the new gen. This is because the hardware chipset on older MBPs simply do not support more than 4GB. The new gen MBP has a chipset that supports 8GB, but at the moment it seems the OS driver for that chipset is not setup for it.

Read this first...

I suggest that everyone does.

snejj · Oct 28, 2008, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dizastor

Hopefully they'll manage to throw something new and flashy on top of all of these stability improvements.

Not likely. The whole rationale of Snow Leopard, as repeatedly stated by Apple, is to prioritize improvements under the hood, instead of adding any new user-visible features. New features are great but they destabilize the OS and take resources away from other important tasks, so I think it's great that Apple is taking one release cycle to do this.

Marketing may be tricky; but consider the example of System 7.6, which was also all about performance and stability without any new features, and sold like hot-cakes anyway.

Blue Velvet · Oct 28, 2008, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by morespce54

Sweet... building up expectations...

Just wait. On release day, this place will be jam-pack filled with threads saying that Snow Leopard hosed their Mac and that their apps don't work.

Mindflux · Oct 28, 2008, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blue Velvet

Just wait. On release day, this place will be jam-pack filled with threads saying that Snow Leopard hosed their Mac and that their apps don't work.

So nothing new?

Oct 28, 2008, 04:40 PM	#3
plumbingandtech macrumors 68000 Join Date: Jun 2007	All this Snowy goodness is getting me to look forward to the update even more. __________________ The Palm Pre is the new Sarah Palin.

Oct 28, 2008, 04:41 PM	#6
Eidorian macrumors G3 Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Indiana	I'm more concerned about GPU hardware acceleration and decoding of video right now. h.264 showed up n Tiger with a lot of fanfare but we're still on our CPUs to decode it. __________________ MRoogle it! hikari T7500 2.2 GHz / 4 GB / 320 GB / GMA X3100 / 10.5.8 chobimaru Core i5 750 2.66 GHz / 4 GB / 640 GB / 4830 / Windows 7

Oct 28, 2008, 04:42 PM	#7
flottenheimer macrumors regular Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Denmark	Can't wait for this. __________________ 33.8688 MHz Playstation SCPH-7502 / 32bit-RISC / 2mb RAM / Dual Analog Controller Nintendo G&W / Dual Screen / Donkey Kong / Oil Panic / Safe Buster

Oct 28, 2008, 04:50 PM	#9
iMacmatician macrumors 68040 Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: The world of Macmatics, flying with my calculator…	This can only be good news. I hope to see more details - maybe a few that are obvious to the end user? - at MWSF 2009. __________________ babyj: "One day, all Apple products will be running the iPhone OS …"

Oct 28, 2008, 04:57 PM	#13
dizastor macrumors 6502a Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Los Angeles	Hopefully they'll manage to throw something new and flashy on top of all of these stability improvements. Maybe they'll just create features out of the improvements... like "Exposé 2.0 or Finder X" They have to give something for the marketing machine to work with after all... Here's hoping they start taking more of John Siracusa's advice on systemwide ui improvements as well. __________________ ejc on Twitter

Oct 28, 2008, 04:40 PM	#4
smokestack macrumors member Join Date: Feb 2008	yeah. it will likely be great. but you know what i'm really in to? free updates that make my computer run better! come on 10.5.6!

Oct 28, 2008, 04:57 PM	#12
sprice25 Banned Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Chicago, IL	snow leopard has been running well for me. great build, good future ahead. running a mac pro 2.8 8-core over here.

Oct 28, 2008, 04:59 PM	#15
koobcamuk macrumors 68020 Join Date: Oct 2006	I use wavemetric's IGOR Pro and that is a memory hog. 64 bit would have helped hugely. I know I am in a minority, but this just gives Windows users the edge and frankly, pisses me off! __________________ \|\| Get Dropbox! \|\| Photos \|\| My Ph.D \|\|

Oct 28, 2008, 05:00 PM	#17
Sky Blue macrumors 68040 Join Date: Jan 2005	sounds liek a survice pak ...........wil it b freeee? __________________ "The case is so square that it easily stands at attention as if begging for treats."

Oct 28, 2008, 05:00 PM	#18
morespce54 macrumors 6502a Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Around the World	Sweet... building up expectations... __________________ ..:.::.:.:.::..:.: Oh, I get it. It's very clever :.:.::.:.:.::.:..:.::..:.::.:..:.::.:.::.:.::.. DO NOT OPERATE YOUR COMPUTER UNDER THE INFLUENCE!

Oct 28, 2008, 05:02 PM	#20
koobcamuk macrumors 68020 Join Date: Oct 2006	My 2.16Ghz Core2Duo MBP will never see more than 3GB RAM, correct? I am looking forward to Snow Leopard for my Mini and MBP, but my PowerBook is being left out here... might even downgrade to 10.4.11 as that was the most stable OS I have ever used. __________________ \|\| Get Dropbox! \|\| Photos \|\| My Ph.D \|\|

Oct 28, 2008, 05:02 PM	#21
mkrishnan Demi-God (Moderator) Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Grand Rapids, MI, USA	Since Finder lock-ups, beachballs, and crashes are not quite yet a thing of the past, who knows? Maybe, whether it has anything to do with Cocoa or not, the re-write will mean Finder will be more robust than it is now. EDIT: And yes, correct, there's nothing the OS can do that will allow older chipsets to see more memory. __________________ Mohan

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