I was wondering if anyone knows whether the LCD panel used in the new Apple LED cinema display is H-IPS or S-PVA? I'm having an extremely hard time deciding between this display and the HP LP2475W (around $700CAD and is H-IPS). I know previous Apple Cinema Displays used IPS panels, but since this display is targeted more for consumers (rather than professionals) and uses more expensive LED backlighting, could Apple have used S-PVA in this display to offset the costs of the LED backlighting? Perhaps, Apple will save the H-IPS displays for future displays targeted more towards for professionals with a matte screen. Both S-PVA and H-IPS have wide viewing angles compared to cheap TN panels (so it's definitely not TN) and similar rated response times, so I can't really tell from the specs. Also, S-PVA would produce very good black levels so Apple could put S-PVA in there without consumer noticing. $999CAD for LED backlighting and H-IPS would be a bargain and this is Apple, so I'm not sure if this is even possible. I'm interested in what people think about this.
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Apple LED Cinema Display H-IPS or S-PVA?
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zer0tails
macrumors 65816
I think a lot of us here on macrumors would like to know as well. The truth of the matter however, is that at this moment no one knows. I bet even the Apple store specialists wouldn't know.
It might be possible though for you to check the display model at an Apple store.
It might be possible though for you to check the display model at an Apple store.
I've been under the impression that it's the same H-IPS panel (LG manufactured IIRC) unit used in the 24" iMac. It would certainly make economic sense. 😛
Considering that the Apple Cinema Display 23 inch sold for $899CAD (which uses CCFL backlight, uses S-IPS, doesn't have iSight or speakers), I'm just not sure Apple would sell H-IPS and LED backlight for $999CAD. Like I said before, this panel is targeted towards consumers who may not be that interested in extreme colour accuracy (benefit of H-IPS) and the S-PVA panel actually has better black levels (which arguably is more important for the consumer crowd). I don't know...the decision is agonizing without proper information!
The panels used in the current 24" iMac and the 23" Cinema Display aren't the same. 23" vs. 24", S-IPS vs. H-IPS, matte vs. glossy... There's other differences that may be harder to discern, as Apple hasn't published the specs. Such as the 24" is likely an 8 bit panel. The 23" ACD panel is likely higher, and this is common with professional monitors. I see this in reviews of other products, and sometimes the spec section on the manufacturers' website.
Personally, I'm equating the current HP L2475W to the new 24" LED backlit ACD. 24" H-IPS 8 bit panel, and W-CCFL backlighting. Seems a good comparable consumer target, IMO. Cheaper too, as the HP can be had for ~$600. 😱 😉 Both seems squarely aimed at the consumer market, and an 8 bit panel is quite adequate. 🙂
The panel used in the 23inch Cinema Display is LG Phillips LM230W02, which is S-IPS 8bit. The panel used in the 24inch iMac is LG LM240WU2, which is H-IPS 8bit and newer than the panel used in the 23inch cinema display (obviously). The HP uses an even newer H-IPS 8 bit panel from LG which is LM240WU4. Although I haven't seen the HP personally, I have seen the 24inch iMac and I had a Dell 2005fpw (has a S-IPS panel same as 20 inch Cinema display), and both displays have very good colour and virtually zero colour shift...so I can trust IPS panels although my Sony Bravia is S-PVA, and it is also very good in terms of black levels and viewing angle. Although the Apple's LED Cinema Display is very elegant design-wise, has LED backlighting and uses a high quality panel (be it H-IPS or S-PVA), now I'm personally leaning towards the HP it is very configurable, is more flexible (in terms of not restricting myself to mini DisplayPort) but most importantly, in Canada is $200-300CAD cheaper than the LED Cinema display. Plus, I need a high quality display now since the display on my MacBook (my primary computer) doesn't really cut it (although it is 9C8C, it's still a cheap TN panel with narrow viewing angles, especially vertically).
I put my money on H-IPS panels.
It would be really messed up if Apple used S-PVA to drop the cost on the 24" led monitors (samsung and other led 24" monitors are still $2500).
It would be really messed up if Apple used S-PVA to drop the cost on the 24" led monitors (samsung and other led 24" monitors are still $2500).
I hadn't seen the panel p/n's used in any of Apple's monitors. One part of me is surprised the 23" uses an 8 bit part, as it's a professional unit, but OTOH, this is Apple we're talking about. 😛
The H-IPS panel by LG (LM240WU4) seemed a likely suspect to me, for both the 24" iMac and the new 24" LED ACD (again, I didn't have the specific panel p/n's), as the HP. Perhaps the newer ...U4 panel is used in the new 24" LED ACD. At this point, it seems likely the LM240WU4 is an update to the LM240WU2, and might make its way into the iMac. I'm not sure of LG's EOL on their panels. 😱
As for S-PVA, the best I've ever seen has been in an Eizo Nanao. Too expensive now, IMO. Even with the fact I've owned a few, and never had a complaint.
Like you, I think the HP offers a lot of quality, and for a good price. The additional inputs just makes it that more attractive. 😀
Thanks for the ACD panel p/n's BTW. 🙂
Where did you locate them?
No problem, it's just information I gathered from my research into which monitor to buy. Indeed, there is nothing wrong with S-PVA...both S-PVA and H-IPS have their advantages. I found the ACD panel model numbers from just googling...it's pretty well known but only after people get it in their hands, because Apple never tells this of information (no surprise). I just confirmed the specs by looking at this website: http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/panel_parts.htm.
😎
Thanks for the link. 🙂
I could find the older stuff,but not what I was looking for, and just gave up. Perhaps too easily. 😱 Perhaps searches like "apple lcd panel specification" might have been the problem. 😱
Well if you click on the "23 - 24" inch section, the only two panels that mention LED are the following:
LGD H-IPS LM240WU5 1920x1200 6ms G2G 1000:1 250 178/178 133% (LED)
Samsung S-PVA LTM240CS02 1920x1200 6ms G2G 1000 : 1 250 178/178 8-bit 111% (LED)
Since Apple loves LG panels, I would guess that their LED screen has the LM240WU5 panel. Which also means that it's not the same as the panel in the 24" iMac (LM240WU2). Until someone can confirm by disassembling one or running software that will pull the panel model, all of this is just wild guessing.
LGD H-IPS LM240WU5 1920x1200 6ms G2G 1000:1 250 178/178 133% (LED)
Samsung S-PVA LTM240CS02 1920x1200 6ms G2G 1000 : 1 250 178/178 8-bit 111% (LED)
Since Apple loves LG panels, I would guess that their LED screen has the LM240WU5 panel. Which also means that it's not the same as the panel in the 24" iMac (LM240WU2). Until someone can confirm by disassembling one or running software that will pull the panel model, all of this is just wild guessing.
shoopaman
macrumors 6502
Considering 
used cheap ass speakers for the 24 L.E.D. My money bets on H-IPS, they needed to compensate by using cheap everything else for the expensive panel😀
used cheap ass speakers for the 24 L.E.D. My money bets on H-IPS, they needed to compensate by using cheap everything else for the expensive panel😀
Unfortunately, that likely includes the electronics used as well. 🙄 🙁Considering
It's been out for a week now and still no confirmation on this?? We need someone to dissect this thing.
Crazy how Apple doesn't make this information available...
Crazy how Apple doesn't make this information available...
If the differences between the panels were actually that great, wouldn't it be very easy to simply look at one and know what kind it is?
If IPS is really so superior to xyz, shouldn't any trained eye have already confirmed that it is in fact technology 'X' ?
-Allen
If IPS is really so superior to xyz, shouldn't any trained eye have already confirmed that it is in fact technology 'X' ?
-Allen
That is a good point. But, as consumers, we deserve to know what we're buying. One reason would be resale value--if IPS is generally more expensive than xVA, and this display turns out to be xVA, the resale value might also be significantly lower.
very curious about this as well, along with the panel technology used in the newer MacBook Pro (15") and the 17" panel with the "anti-glare" option.....?
blackhand1001
macrumors 68030
Unfortunately its TN. PVA and IPS panels used to be found in some rare laptops but its seems that all of them have disappeared and are no longer available.
I'd expect the panel cost may have had something to do with it. 🙄 😉
Cheap b******s. 😱 😛
blackhand1001
macrumors 68030
A tn display is by far the easiest type to indentify. Just look at the vertical view angle below. The colors will invert. On pva and ips screens this is not the case.
I know that. They do not seem to invert on either my unibody MBP or my 24" LED, hence the question. They do invert on another monitor at home that has a TN panel. Have you actually seen a panel from MBP with a model number on it that indicates it's TN?
blackhand1001
macrumors 68030
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3262/3174672462_28bccdd7d0_o.jpg
View angle is quoted as 140 and 120. PVA and IPS monitors would be quoted as 178 or 176. Also if it was a PVA laptop the contrast ratio would be much higher. However your led cinema should not invert as its apparantly an IPS from what I here. Even if it was a PVA its still miles better than TN and i could see why apple would switch to it. In my opinion for high definition video watching, which the led cinema display seems more geared towards than previous apple displays, S-PVAs perform better since they have less brightness shift horizontally, the contrast ratios can be in practice twice as much as IPS and the gamma shift they have on the horizontal is not too noticeable in movies although can be quite bad for printing work.
blackhand1001
macrumors 68030
Sorry to bring this back but was looking at reviews and came across this. Both the pro and macbook definitely have tn displays.
Also i hope that the macbooks display does really suck that much cause I thought some of the HP's were bad but that looks worse.
Hmm, that does look like TN. Apparently, the MBP is still much better. Keep in mind that during regular use, you won't notice this much, if at all. You'll be looking straight at the screen.