IBM Intros Power5 Server

[MacRumors]

IBM announced the first in a line of servers powered by the Power5 processor today.

The new server, the eServer i5, is aimed at small and mid-sized businesses.

The eServer i5 systems are powered by IBM's next-generation POWER5 microprocessor, the most advanced 64-bit chip in the world. POWER5 features an impressive 276 million transistors per processor, and is manufactured with IBM's 0.13-micron copper wiring and SOI (Silicon-on-Insulator) technologies. In addition to providing communications acceleration and chip multiprocessing, POWER5 offers simultaneous multithreading (SMT), which transforms a single processor into two processors, essentially allowing the chip to run two applications at the same time and reducing the time it requires to complete a task.

The new server/Power5 will become available starting on June 11, 2004.

Early rumors had hinted that future PowerPC chips may be derived from the Power5 processor.

[joelypolly]

Good for apple if thereis one

[P-Worm]

Sounds pretty impressive to me, but we'll see how thing play out in the real world.

IBM is a great company and I'm glad Apple has a good relationship with them.

P-Worm

[Veldek]

Originally Posted by P-Worm

IBM is a great company and I'm glad Apple has a good relationship with them.

I just hope they don't become to Motorola-like. The latest news didn't sound too good. Let's hope these new processor will evolve (soon) to a desktop version for Apple. Imagine 3.5GHz processors with SMT...

Edit: Does anyone wonder why these chips are manufactured by 0.13-micron and SOI-technology and not 0.09 and SSOI?

[wdlove]

It's impressive. Now for this to be used in our beloved Apple Products. The IBM VP said last year with the G5 release, "We are already working on the next generation chips." I wonder if this was what he meant?

[wrldwzrd89]

Originally Posted by Veldek

I just hope they don't become to Motorola-like. The latest news didn't sound too good. Let's hope these new processor will evolve (soon) to a desktop version for Apple. Imagine 3.5GHz processors with SMT...

Edit: Does anyone wonder why these chips are manufactured by 0.13-micron and SOI-technology and not 0.09 and SSOI?

It's good to see the Power5! I think that SMT will make it into the derivatives Apple uses in their machines. In regards to your other question, there are two reasons: Firstly, IBM's 90nm/SSOI manufacturing process is not very mature yet and needs to have some kinks worked out of it. Secondly, doing the same thing with the Power5 that was done with the Power4 saves development costs, at least initially - plus it leaves room for the Power5 to improve once 90nm manufacturing becomes stable.

[idkew]

Originally Posted by Veldek

Imagine 3.5GHz processors with SMT...

i would imagine that this would be left out, in order to make the chip smaller, less complex and less expensive... i believe they did a similar thing with the power4/g5

[Mac-Xpert]

Well this processor is fabed at 130 nm. So this news probably doesn't say anything about the state of the 970fx. I do still hope we will see the 3.0 Ghz G5's in June, but with recent news I won't be surprised if the rev-B's would go any higher than 2.5 Ghz.

[D*I*S_Frontman]

WaHoo!!! G5 PowerBook is on the way!!!

(just thought I'd say it--you know SOMEONE had to!)

[wrldwzrd89]

Originally Posted by idkew

i would imagine that this would be left out, in order to make the chip smaller, less complex and less expensive... i believe they did a similar thing with the power4/g5

No - the Power4/PowerPC G5 (970) did not have SMT support at release. IBM may have planned earlier to include it, but decided to hold off until the Power5 to use SMT.

[adamfilip]

Im sure when IBm makes the G5 replacement processor it will have SMT.
and i bet it will come next summer.

My Prediction for Summer of 2005 at WWDC

Dual 4.5 Ghz G5 Pro with SMT (equal to 4 virtual processors)

[wrldwzrd89]

Originally Posted by adamfilip

Im sure when IBm makes the G5 replacement processor it will have SMT.
and i bet it will come next summer.

My Prediction for Summer of 2005 at WWDC

Dual 4.5 Ghz G5 Pro with SMT (equal to 4 virtual processors)

That would be a huge step forward for the Mac world if it happened. Do you think Apple will dub IBM's Power6 the G6 and introduce it in 2006, for added effect?

[adamfilip]

well in Order to keep pace with intel and AMD.

they need too

The P4 will be at 4ghz by year end. and already has a form of SMT
and a better version of SMT i believe is expected year end.

so Apple/IBM has no choice

[Veldek]

Did Apple (or someone else) tell us when they went to IBM, so that we can calculate how long it took IBM to make the 970? Then we had an estimation how long it takes until we see a Desktop version of this chip.

[Veldek]

Originally Posted by wrldwzrd89

That would be a huge step forward for the Mac world if it happened. Do you think Apple will dub IBM's Power6 the G6 and introduce it in 2006, for added effect?

Well, it's the Power5, so we might even see it next year...

[pjkelnhofer]

This can only be good news for Apple. If the Power5 becomes a widely used chip the cost per chip will probably go down. I have always believed that one of the reasons of Mac's high costs is the high cost of a CPU that very few people are using.

One thing though, I read the entire press release, but could not find any mention of how fast the Power5 chips used in the eServer i5 actually runs.
Any ideas?

Also, could some one refresh me on the difference between the chip that is currently the "G5" and the Power5 chip in the IBM server. I thought that one is a derivative of the other, but I am not really sure.

[Veldek]

Originally Posted by pjkelnhofer

Also, could some one refresh me on the difference between the chip that is currently the "G5" and the Power5 chip in the IBM server. I thought that one is a derivative of the other, but I am not really sure.

The G5 (or 970) is a derivative of the Power4 AFAIK.

[idkew]

Originally Posted by wrldwzrd89

No - the Power4/PowerPC G5 (970) did not have SMT support at release. IBM may have planned earlier to include it, but decided to hold off until the Power5 to use SMT.

sorry, maybe i was thinking of the dual cores then.?.

[wrldwzrd89]

Originally Posted by Veldek

Well, it's the Power5, so we might even see it next year...

I think Apple might just call the Power5 an enhanced G5 and save the G6 moniker for the Power6. It would be nice to see a G6 next year, but it doesn't fit with Apple tradition. Look at what Apple did with the 603/603e/604/604e (all considered "G2") and Motorola's 74XX series (all of them are called "G4" by Apple) for examples.

[wrldwzrd89]

Originally Posted by idkew

sorry, maybe i was thinking of the dual cores then.?.

Yes - you were thinking about the dual cores. These were present in some Power4 models, but did not make it to the PowerPC 970.

[adamfilip]

The G5 is based on the Power 4 Architecture , 970

its basicly the kid brother of the Power 4. much smaller die. but runs at higher clock speed.

same will happen with the Power 5

[Billy_ca]

Who on earth could rate this as negative?!!!

IBM is really the king of the hill as far as top end server processors go...they are leaving HP, Sun, Intel and the others in the dust! The others still haven't found a match for the POWER4 let alone the POWER5.

Only AMD is looking good at the lower end of the server spectrum with the Opteron. But the Opteron isn't in the same class of processors as the POWER5.

This is really good news for Apple. IBM is really motivated to keep pushing the envelope with its process technology for the POWER line...and Apple will stand to benefit with the PowerPC 9x0 line!

Hurrrray!

[Veldek]

Originally Posted by wrldwzrd89

I think Apple might just call the Power5 an enhanced G5 and save the G6 moniker for the Power6. It would be nice to see a G6 next year, but it doesn't fit with Apple tradition. Look at what Apple did with the 603/603e/604/604e (all considered "G2") and Motorola's 74XX series (all of them are called "G4" by Apple) for examples.

Ah, I see what you mean, but I think the Power6 is still more than a year off, so I doubt we will see a Power6 derivative in 2006. Of course, I like to be surprised...

[JFreak]

always remember that there are severe differencies with server class hardware and workstation class hardware, the reliability being the most important. it is actually ok to allow workstation to make calculation mistakes and have some amount of downtime, but in server hardware both of the two are severe mistakes.

server class hardware always has mature technology, not the latest and greates. so that's why no 90nm and no ssoi.

ibm technology looks very good. i'm really looking forward what apple can bring out within next six months. something's up, that's certain

[wrldwzrd89]

Originally Posted by JFreak

always remember that there are severe differencies with server class hardware and workstation class hardware, the reliability being the most important. it is actually ok to allow workstation to make calculation mistakes and have some amount of downtime, but in server hardware both of the two are severe mistakes.

server class hardware always has mature technology, not the latest and greates. so that's why no 90nm and no ssoi.

ibm technology looks very good. i'm really looking forward what apple can bring out within next six months. something's up, that's certain

You are right, but don't forget about the problems IBM's been having getting reasonable yields from their 90nm manufacturing process. These problems surely were a factor in making the decision to go 130nm initially with the Power5, no?