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Old Nov 12, 2009, 12:07 PM   #101
inlovewithi
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Originally Posted by Evangelion View Post
Just because it has large windows does not have to mean that it's expensive to heat. In Finland we have triple and quad-plated windows, and they keep the house warm even if it's -30c outside. Then you can have heat-pumps that extract heat from the air (or ground), and those can provide you with cheap and green heating. Then you can also heat the floor, which would make the occupants feel warm (you feel warm if your feet are warm), even if the actual air-temperature was 1-3c lower than normally.
They're not complaining about the heating because of the glass walls, they're complaining about the heating because of the wasted area inside. If anything the glass wall helps in cooling because of the sun. Though I imagine the sun could be annoying during the day, and make the store very very hot.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 12:22 PM   #102
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RE: the critical posts.

You are all missing the point. The photographer had to step so far back to fit the entire store in the frame that it makes everything in the store look tiny. But if you were standing at the window, the store looks awesome. There is plenty of room to walk around, shop comfortably, and then get out without too much trouble.

Also, with the amount of traffic this store will generate, I don't think the heating issue will take place. Bodies generate heat. This store will have a lot of bodies.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 12:22 PM   #103
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Originally Posted by inlovewithi View Post
They're not complaining about the heating because of the glass walls, they're complaining about the heating because of the wasted area inside. If anything the glass wall helps in cooling because of the sun. Though I imagine the sun could be annoying during the day, and make the store very very hot.
So... Unless this store is going to be opened 24/7, then the time when it'd need to be heated is going to be when it's shut? Otherwise, it'll have the primary source of heat being that it's a huge greenhouse filled with heat-exhausting computers, and a large trapped body of air to keep it at a stable temperature in the evenings. (Doors at ground level. No openings in the top for air to escape.)

The coldest it's going to get in there that it might need a lot of heating will be when it opens in the morning.

The concern is going to be cooling it in summer, not keeping it warm in winter.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 12:24 PM   #104
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I bet that thing costs a small fortune on a daily basis to heat and cool.

I wonder if Al Gore knows what the carbon footprint of that palace is ?

More than his limo and yacht, but less than his jet ?



I wonder if his jetski can go down the slide ?
That would be fun.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 12:28 PM   #105
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So much glass.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 12:42 PM   #106
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What have you done as an individual to make your life green? Don't accept plastic bags when you shop? Bring your own cloth bags? Do you recycle your trash? Have fluorescent bulbs through your house? Turn off all lights at night? Shut down your computer when not in use? Traded in your huge SUV for a fuel efficient car? Sold your car and take public transportation or ride your bike to work? Do your laundry during off peak electric hours?

Just a few questions to see what your doing in your life to be greener!
Don't mind these bloody hypocrites. What the heck have any of them done to be criticizing anybody about being green.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 12:44 PM   #107
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Two immediate impulses:
1. "It's so sterile!" - from that very specific The Simpsons episode.

2. It's another huge glass front consume cathedral from the Holy Church Of Apple with an IKEAn interior design.

The more I think about it, the less comfortable I am with having spent so much money on the products of this company that's more like a sect than a producer of technology.
You hate Apple and never say anything positive about them but yet you choose to buy their products and post on a forum about Apple. I guess Apple is putting a gun to your head right?
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 12:45 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by inlovewithi View Post
They're not complaining about the heating because of the glass walls, they're complaining about the heating because of the wasted area inside. If anything the glass wall helps in cooling because of the sun. Though I imagine the sun could be annoying during the day, and make the store very very hot.
Actually the complaint is, Apple has recently become public with their stances on social and environmental issues. This store is in conflict. Apple complained that the US Chamber of Commerce wasn't doing enough to regulate climate change, so they walked out. Here you have a highly visible building that represents the gutting and scrapping of a relatively new building with a highly inefficient architectural statement.

There are so many incongruences with this new store to Apple's image as a green company, it's almost offensive to our intelligence. Even the little things like an airlock or a revolving door have been ignored. The lack of any form of thermal breaks from the interior to the exterior are puzzling. There are so many heat bridges that you can see clearly. The lack of awnings or shading devices. This is an eastern facing fašade, so even in winter with all the other buildings around, there will be very little solar heat gain.

And yes, the designers of this new store, Bohlin Cywinski Jackson, are LEED certified. However, none of their Apple stores fall under their sustainable projects listings. I was correct about the structural curved glass being designed in Europe and made in China. That is just how the current system works.

http://www.bcj.com/

http://www.eckersleyocallaghan.com/
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 12:58 PM   #109
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So, basically Apple should close down all their retail-stores, and rely on online-store only. After all, that would be the greenest thing to do. Yet for some reason the greenies are not demanding that.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 01:07 PM   #110
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*snip*
I love your android avatar :]
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 01:28 PM   #111
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Jawdropping

All I have to say is "freaking awesome"!
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 01:33 PM   #112
hushpuppy212
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Welcome to the neighborhood!

I've never been a Mac person. Although my partner loves his Macbook, I've always been happy with PCs. So the only time I've been in an Apple store is when he needs something and I'm tagging along. I been in the store on Fifth Ave and in the Ginza and I've played the role of a bored husband while he bought whatever it was he needed.

So when it was announced that Apple was opening across the street from my apartment, I wasn't thrilled or dismayed, I just thought it would be better than the Victoria's Secret it was replacing (cute Apple guys shopping v pictures of implanted models hanging in the window, the Apple guys win every time). For the past year the whole neighborhood has been suffering with the disruptive construction, just wishing for it to be over.

So I was pleasantly stunned when I came out of the subway last night to see the store unveiled, shining like a beacon from over a block away. As you get closer, the magnificent details are revealed as in a movie close-up. Up close and in person, it is truly stunning. Bold and modern, it adds glamour and excitement to an already exciting thoroughfare. This weekend will be crazy with all the people coming to see the new store, but once the crowds die down, I look for the Apple store to establish itself as a vibrant and valuable part of our neighborhood.

Welcome!
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 01:57 PM   #113
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Originally Posted by Winni View Post
Two immediate impulses:
1. "It's so sterile!" - from that very specific The Simpsons episode.

2. It's another huge glass front consume cathedral from the Holy Church Of Apple with an IKEAn interior design.

The more I think about it, the less comfortable I am with having spent so much money on the products of this company that's more like a sect than a producer of technology.
The Microsoft stores, partly due to use of color, are much more inviting than Apple stores.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 02:17 PM   #114
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Amazing... Apple is definitely one of the most innovative, successful companies in the world.

PS: All you hippies complaining about energy wasted must shut it now. If you are so concerned about being green why don't you just take off all your clothes and go live in the jungle?

Last edited by dextertangocci; Nov 12, 2009 at 02:22 PM.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 02:20 PM   #115
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It's not a very attractive store is it.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 02:50 PM   #116
parkds
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I happened to be walking by last night as the last piece of the "curtain" decal was peeled away from the windows of the UWS store. The photos really do not do justice to how stunning this building is. It certainly is better looking than I expected and a huge improvement over the deteriorating Victoria's Secret building that was there previously. A great and beautiful addition to the neighborhood.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 02:51 PM   #117
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day-ummmmmmmm

they wasted millions on this!!!!

could have been 3 floors or so...
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 02:55 PM   #118
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What have you done as an individual to make your life green? Don't accept plastic bags when you shop? Bring your own cloth bags? Do you recycle your trash? Have fluorescent bulbs through your house? Turn off all lights at night? Shut down your computer when not in use? Traded in your huge SUV for a fuel efficient car? Sold your car and take public transportation or ride your bike to work? Do your laundry during off peak electric hours?

Just a few questions to see what your doing in your life to be greener!
What am I doing? I am using the resources necessary to sustain my own existence on this planet. Wherever I can, and where it's convenient, I opt for energy-saving and eco-friendly options. I live in a reasonable townhouse, I drive a reasonable car.

But what does this have to do with being critical of Apple?

To take your own analogy further, I look at photos of that store, I look at the description of how it's going to be a "beacon of light from blocks away" and I see a man living in a 50,000 square foot mansion made with rainforest timbers, with 30-foot tall glass ceilings and a 5-million gallon outdoor swimming pool that's heated 24/7 to 90 degrees F, with a fleet of stretch Hummer limousines and private helicopters, every one of them fuelled and idling at all times, ready to take him wherever he pleases at a moment's notice. Absolutely, totally excess and unnecessary and not in the least bit being responsible or in the spirit of "consuming what is needed".

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Don't mind these bloody hypocrites. What the heck have any of them done to be criticizing anybody about being green.
I would only be hypocritical if I was the man living in the mansion above. All I'm advocating here is "consume what you need, and no more".

Edit: Look at the front page story. It says that this store could fit 11 5th Avenue NYC Apple Stores inside it. Literally enough empty space for Apple stores 10 times over! Sure, it's a spectacle, it's magnificent, but how can anyone say that's not excessive?
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 02:55 PM   #119
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This is not a shop, it's a cathedral!
Maybe the extra space was needed for the worshippers voluminous egos.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 02:56 PM   #120
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very interesting, not sure I'd want to pay the utilities on it, but interesting design choices were made for sure.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 03:05 PM   #121
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Maybe the extra space was needed for the worshippers voluminous egos.
+1
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 03:07 PM   #122
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Unfortunately, to myself and to many people here, this is exactly what appear Apple is saying with this store: "Screw it and start being as wasteful as possible!"
You're hilarious! Have you even been to NY or to any designer shop? This is how they are all like. This totally fits in with Apple's philosophy of minimalism. Go look at the old photos of Jobs. In one you will see him in a large room with no furniture.

The store is absolutely perfect. Elegant, minimalist, and to the point. The only thing that will attract you to the store is the Apple stuff. There is no Crazy Eddie-like personality on a 107" screen enticing you to come into the store.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 03:16 PM   #123
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Whether you're a fan or not, anyone who thinks Apple didn't build this with the env't in mind is on crack.

What's wrong with using glass? Glass is one of the most recycled materials on the face of the earth. It's also a great insulator. Oh did I mention, it requires minimal maintainance and will outlast any piece of Sheetrock? This means less paint and other chemicals, thus further minimizing its carbon footprint.

Apple has a reputation of being one of the greenest companies in the US...give them a break. The same people who rank on this building probably think they're "doing their part" by driving a prius or some other hybrid...ever consider the enviormental impact of those batteries?
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 03:17 PM   #124
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What am I doing? I am using the resources necessary to sustain my own existence on this planet. Wherever I can, and where it's convenient, I opt for energy-saving and eco-friendly options. I live in a reasonable townhouse, I drive a reasonable car.

But what does this have to do with being critical of Apple?

To take your own analogy further, I look at photos of that store, I look at the description of how it's going to be a "beacon of light from blocks away" and I see a man living in a 50,000 square foot mansion made with rainforest timbers, with 30-foot tall glass ceilings and a 5-million gallon outdoor swimming pool that's heated 24/7 to 90 degrees F, with a fleet of stretch Hummer limousines and private helicopters, every one of them fuelled and idling at all times, ready to take him wherever he pleases at a moment's notice. Absolutely, totally excess and unnecessary and not in the least bit being responsible or in the spirit of "consuming what is needed".



I would only be hypocritical if I was the man living in the mansion above. All I'm advocating here is "consume what you need, and no more".

Edit: Look at the front page story. It says that this store could fit 11 5th Avenue NYC Apple Stores inside it. Literally enough empty space for Apple stores 10 times over! Sure, it's a spectacle, it's magnificent, but how can anyone say that's not excessive?
You are being way too critical. Would you have liked to see a ton more Macs in there to consume more energy? The reason the store is so large is that even the 5th Ave. store is incredibly crowded as it is. Who else would you have liked to see buy the this expensive piece of property during a recession? They weren't going to split the property into two places lol. With just the bare essentials Apple IS being more green and more efficient. That is the point of minimalism. BTW you also fail to mention the 10,000 added jobs it brings to the store and taxes that are collected by NY state with all the cash Apple makes there.

This is a company that grosses more per sq. than any other company in the world. Trust me, they are putting that property to good use.
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 03:23 PM   #125
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Quote:
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What have you done as an individual to make your life green? Don't accept plastic bags when you shop? Bring your own cloth bags? Do you recycle your trash? Have fluorescent bulbs through your house? Turn off all lights at night? Shut down your computer when not in use? Traded in your huge SUV for a fuel efficient car? Sold your car and take public transportation or ride your bike to work? Do your laundry during off peak electric hours?

Just a few questions to see what your doing in your life to be greener!
actually, yes, on all counts above (except the bus/bike thing - I work at home now). And add to that automated thermostats around the house that control the temp to comfy levels only when people are actually in the house.
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