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Fat Activists!

virividox

virividox

macrumors 601
Original poster
http://www.cnn.com/2004/HEALTH/diet.fitness/08/02/fat.activism.ap/index.html

im struggling to understand them. Okay im no rock hard body, i got my love handles 🙂 but still in great shape...what i dont understand is why they are getting ofended the government and industry is trying to improve peoples health; reduce diabetes, heart disease, hypertension, if they want to continue being fat then so be it; but please, attack the governemtn for trying to increase the national health standard get real; this is a cause for the sake of a cause
 
do people really think that this is attractive?

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i personally dont find fat people all that attractive, but thats not the point, i think these people are getting riled up for no good reason, whats being done is for health reasons not cosmettic; and lets be serious here people, of course fat people get discriminated against, there wont ever be a time where some person who looks different wont be discriminated against, the governemnt isnt discriminating against fat people, they are promoting a healthier lifestyle, they are saying its not healthy to be obese because of these health risks, not that its wrong or makes u a worse person if you are obese
 
Part of the problem that this group is fighting against is the idea that there is a perfect body type that everyone can achieve. At one point in my life I worked out every day for about an hour (under the guidance of a trainer), ate for the most part sensibly, in addition to all that walked 2-3 miles a day just getting around. I was 70 pounds above what the weight charts had as my ideal and 35 pounds above what they said was the maximum healthy weight.
 
MongoTheGeek said:
Part of the problem that this group is fighting against is the idea that there is a perfect body type that everyone can achieve. At one point in my life I worked out every day for about an hour (under the guidance of a trainer), ate for the most part sensibly, in addition to all that walked 2-3 miles a day just getting around. I was 70 pounds above what the weight charts had as my ideal and 35 pounds above what they said was the maximum healthy weight.
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I did pretty much the same thing. Worked out 4 days a week, rode my bike to work and back, yadda, yadda. I was at 200 lbs, 13 % body fat, and all the insurance charts said I had to weight something like 170, which I hadn't seen since I was ain 7th grade. Now, I'm supposed to weight 189, which I haven't seen since high school. 🙄 Whatever.
 
I think fighting idealized beauty standards is a good thing, but I think there are times when NAAFA goes beyond that and has tried to justify sizes that are actually unhealthy. There's a difference between being 50lbs overweight and being 250lbs overweight.
Dan Savage (yes, the sex advice columnist) has an excellent chapter in his book "Skipping Towards Gomorrah" on his experiences at a NAAFA convention. I recommend the whole book, but especially that chapter. He is a bit harsh at times, but he has some good observations.
My favorite: He points out that NAAFA likes to refer to the renaissance paintings that idealized the fuller form, but that those were idealized when people were starving, and that now that food is more plentiful, people are more likely to idealize a form that can turn down food.
Its interesting, very thought provoking.
 
There's something in american food that makes people get so fat... Why don't they just stop eating junk food instead of staying there and being ugly.
Fatasses...
 
MongoTheGeek said:
Part of the problem that this group is fighting against is the idea that there is a perfect body type that everyone can achieve. At one point in my life I worked out every day for about an hour (under the guidance of a trainer), ate for the most part sensibly, in addition to all that walked 2-3 miles a day just getting around. I was 70 pounds above what the weight charts had as my ideal and 35 pounds above what they said was the maximum healthy weight.
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i realize that the weight is the easiest indicator to judge by, but to a degree, it's healthy to be active, no matter the weight. even if you absolutely couldn't lose any more weight, you should still remain active.

this obesity epidemic is very prevalent in the US and mostly only in the US. first world countries elsewhere, like in europe and japan, are starting to see the trend, not so surprisingly correlated with the increase in the availability of "American" style food. but at this moment, it's the biggest problem in the US and not anywhere else. the epidemic is NOT genetic. (individually, it could be genetic. but the entire "epidemic" certainly isn't genetic.) it's the lifestyle. no other culture in the world features 20 oz. sodas and 1 pint ice creams so prominently in the diet.

i also don't buy this crusade against unreasonable "idealized" body shape/weight. if you are in reasonable shape, most people will have healthy esteem and won't care what the media pushes upon them as "ideal." mostly the ones that are far off the scale tend to pay the most attention and complain about it, i think.
 
its true some people just arent built to look like models, but it doesnt mean that this group shoudl promote people to be obese to the point its unhealthy, these people are 2 or 3 times larger than the average person, and it snot in muscle but fat. that can also cause knee and back problems, as well as skin problems.
 
Megaquad said:
There's something in american food that makes people get so fat... Why don't they just stop eating junk food instead of staying there and being ugly.
Fatasses...
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it's mostly because people don't realize how much calories/fat are in the fast food.

for example, big mac, fries and soda combined are about 1000+ calories. that's half of what most people need in a day.

if the statistics of one out of 4 americans visiting macdonalds once a week is true and there are many of us who won't go there even once a month, care to calculate how many times other people may be going?
 
jxyama said:
i also don't buy this crusade against unreasonable "idealized" body shape/weight. if you are in reasonable shape, most people will have healthy esteem and won't care what the media pushes upon them as "ideal." mostly the ones that are far off the scale tend to pay the most attention and complain about it, i think.
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i remember the school survey what our school doctor made when we were in the last grade...

she started with the survey because she thought that many kids will be to 'fat' but after all surveys were taken it showed that _half_ of all school children are a big chunk below the recommended weight and 20 % above it
and about 30% of all school kids already made diets at the age of 13-14
 
jxyama said:
it's mostly because people don't realize how much calories/fat are in the fast food.

for example, big mac, fries and soda combined are about 1000+ calories. that's half of what most people need in a day.
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You're right. Most people don't realize how much energy is in food. I remember in a Chemisty class in high school my teacher put a cheeto (sp?) into a test tube full of oxygen and it burst into flames.
 
Overweight Americans

We Americans hate to admit it, but we're some of the laziest people in the world. The simple fact is that while there is a portion of the population that through genetics is pre-destined to be overweight, the vast majority of overweight Americans are overweight by choice. And I might have to duck here, but the problems starts at home with the parents. McDonald's in and of itself isn't bad -- it's the parents that allow their children to eat McDonald's on a regular basis that are to blame. There are plenty of healthy ways to feed children without caving to the Happy Meal. Don't give me the crap about needing two incomes, it's tough to be a parent, blah, blah. I can respect that it's tough, but parents CHOOSE to live in a neighborhood with high priced homes, CHOOSE to drive two nice cars (do you really need that giant SUV to haul around two kids?), and so on. Then we complain and moan when it becomes inconvenient to maintain a lifestyle of excess. Don't like gas prices over $2.50/gal? Fine, buy a car that gets better mileage -- this is EXACTLY what helped launch the Japanese auto industry in this country in the late-70s. The point is that we as a country frequently CHOOSE to do things that are detrimental to our health or overall well-being and then have the nerve to complain about the effects! Don't get me wrong, I love the fact that we live in a soceity with so many choices, but go nuts when people want to shift blame when things don't go well. One of my cars gets about 25 MPG and the other only gets about 15 and requires premium gas which I accept as a cost of driving that kind of performance car. When I can't accept it any longer, I should sell the car, not complain to my congressman about a gas price investigation.

We also don't kick our kids in the a** to get outside during the summer, but instead let them sit inside and play video games or screw around on the Internet. I'm 35, so I was a kid in the late-70s and early-80s and vividly remember my mother throwing us out of the house after breakfast and not letting us back until dusk. We played all day.

I also remember seeing something in Morgan Spurlock's "Super Size Me" about voluntary obesity becoming the #2 killer behind another voluntary vice, smoking cigarettes. His point is that why is it OK to publicly ridicule smokers, but not obese individuals? I wonder what will happen when voluntary obesity overtakes smoking as the number one cause of preventable death in the US. Will it become OK to riducle overweight people? Sure, there's no comparable second-hand smoke argument, but the burden on society through diabetes, higher medical costs, etc. might impact America more significantly than people realize.....

😕
 
Umm...

This is like smokers getting mad that the government (surgeon general) is making smokers look bad.

Uh, yeah, it's kind of, um, extremely unhealthy? It's your choice to smoke or not smoke, it's your choice to have a healthy diet and exercise routine, but don't get mad just because someone points out that it IS in fact unhealthy.

I agree it is unhealthy for this sex-/image-driven society to promote unreasonable standards of physical beauty. I think it is unhealthy to have any standards of physical beauty, except those that are your own. Is protesting, however, really the way to change that? Media conglomerations aren't going to care, as long as Britney Spears and Paris Hilton keep selling. I myself have a far from perfect body, I am rail thin even though I try to bulk up and eat by eating a very well-rounded diet. No matter what though, I am thin and seen as "weak" by people. Does it bother me? Sometimes, but I don't go out blaming the media for it, claiming they say guys should be muscle-bound brutes. I am who I am and I was given what I have, I eat healthy and try to do the best with what I've got. I know I'm healthy and I'm happy with that. You just have to be comfortable with who you are. If you think you're fat, by all means eat healthy and exercise. If after that you are still "overweight", be content that you ARE healthy and that's just how it is. Anyone who lets outside definitions of what is good or beautiful effect them that much is going to be unhappy.

<Edit> Well said, Sharksfan.</Edit>
 
SharksFan22 said:
The simple fact is that while there is a portion of the population that through genetics is pre-destined to be overweight, the vast majority of overweight Americans are overweight by choice.
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Well, sort of. It's not like anyone gets up in the morning one day and says, "Gee, I'd like to be fat. I think I'll put on about 50 pounds." For a lot of people, it happens slowly, about 10 lbs. a year, and the more weight you put on, the harder it is to lose it.

SharksFan22 said:
And I might have to duck here, but the problems starts at home with the parents. McDonald's in and of itself isn't bad -- it's the parents that allow their children to eat McDonald's on a regular basis that are to blame. There are plenty of healthy ways to feed children without caving to the Happy Meal.
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Happy Meals are the least of it. Take a child to practically any restaurant with a kid's menu and you'll find the same choices: Chicken fingers, grilled cheese, hot dog, maybe a chicken quesadilla or burger or spaghetti. Needless to say, nothing that's healthy. Worse, many parents feed their kids these same things at home, even if the rest of the family is eating something else that's more healthy, because those fried thingamajiggers make easy-to-manage finger food for the toddlers. Scarcely a good start on eating healthy.

SharksFan22 said:
His point is that why is it OK to publicly ridicule smokers, but not obese individuals?
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Because you can go through your entire life without ever picking up a cigarette, but you have to eat. It's easier to avoid cigarettes than the over-refined, processed, chemical-laden substitutes we call food here in America.

I stumbled on this article today, which was a very interesting view on fat. Basically, the further you go beyond the normal range of fat build-up that was our ancestors' response to starvation, the more screwed you are:

Fat controls brain, new research finds
 
Choices

It's not like anyone gets up in the morning one day and says, "Gee, I'd like to be fat. I think I'll put on about 50 pounds." For a lot of people, it happens slowly, about 10 lbs. a year, and the more weight you put on, the harder it is to lose it.
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Agreed. No one wishes they were fat. Everyone wishes they could eat whatever they want and not worry about getting fat. But everyone also knows that is not the case. People know that the food they eat effects their body, their weight, etc. I guess it isn't like there is a plethora of health food cook books, stores, restaurants and movements going on. Oh, wait.

Take a child to practically any restaurant with a kid's menu and you'll find the same choices: Chicken fingers, grilled cheese, hot dog, maybe a chicken quesadilla or burger or spaghetti.
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Then you're taking your kids to the wrong restaurants. And if there aren't any ones with healthy alternatives you like near you, don't eat out as much. Sure, that may be an inconvenience, but so is being fat. And nobody said that healthy diets are easy. They are possible, however, and it is your choice to have one or not.

Because you can go through your entire life without ever picking up a cigarette, but you have to eat. It's easier to avoid cigarettes than the over-refined, processed, chemical-laden substitutes we call food here in America.
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Yes, it's easier, but it is still your choice what you put into your body. The fact is that there is no one cramming unhealthy food down your throat except you. If you can just say no to smoking, you can just say no to crap food. Not as easy, no, but if you want to eat healthy, eat healthy.
 
apple2991 - Thank you for the compliment! My adult weight has varied anywhere from a high of 240 to a low of 190. I'm currently about 215 but am most comfortable at about 205. I come from a midwest-based family of "big food" eaters and while there are some thin ones, the diet much of my family chooses to eat contributes to their weight.

rueyeet - Thanks for the response. I understand and agree that people don't just wake up in the morning and decide to gorge themselves, but instead it's a long-term phenomenon. In fact, I can't cite the source, but I recall a tidbit that said a person's eating habits are pretty much cemented by the time they're six. This is part of the reason that fast food companies target kids with their Happy Meals and other kid-oriented promos. Get 'em hooked young and they're a customer for life. Excellent point about the prevalence of bad food on kids menus. I've managed two restaurants and thought the same thing. Restaurants provide this to kids for a number of reasons - (1) it's cheap and easy to prepare, (2) most kids freak out at restaurants or won't eat when presented with a healthy meal, and (3) it keeps them quiet in a restaurant. All three reasons suck, but that's what the restaurants do. I also agree about your statement that it's easier to avoid cigarettes than bad food. It is much harder to find a healthy meal than it is to avoid smoking during one's teenage years, but it is possible. I guess the closest analogy is that people choose to smoke, but they might not be so choosy when it comes to eating, because we must eat, but we don't need to smoke.
 
Hey

I guess the closest analogy is that people choose to smoke, but they might not be so choosy when it comes to eating, because we must eat, but we don't need to smoke.
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Speak for yourself, there, buddy 😀
 
stoid said:
do people really think that this is attractive?

fat.gif


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That is quite sad. Although he does seem to be happy. Is that by any chance the 5 or 6 year old that social services took away from his parents. They had accused them of causing his obesity.
 
Now that's just ignorant.

Yes, people with an unrealistic and unhealthy body ideal of some bony supermodel really cheese me off, and they should go eat something that contains actual calories before they starve to death.

And yes, if you really enjoy being 150 pounds overweight and don't care about things like the ability to walk more than 100 yards, diabetes, or dying of a heart attack at 50, then I suppose you're a burden on society as a whole, but at least you're not taking anybody with you (except maybe your kids), so that's your right.

But when people go and say something that is irrefutably true: "Being grossly overweight, particularly when your genetics weren't built for it, is unhealthy.", and there are people in the world who get up in arms over it, that's a sign of either denial or stupidity.

Being too skinny is unhealthy. Being too fat is unhealthy. Sitting on your butt all day and never getting any excercise is probably more unhealthy than either, and can contribute to both. There's a big range in the middle that's more healthy, and it's only reasonable to tell people about that.

Big boned or genetically chunky is one thing, but a tub of lard is another. I really feel for a friend of mine fighting with this--he's probably twice what he should weigh, and suffers from it in the form of fatigue, joint problems, and general discomfort--and the last thing he needs is people telling him "It's an unrealistic ideal of beauty to be 'thin' [as in, not 150 pounds overweight], you're ok just like you are." No, he's fat, he knows it, he's trying to do something about it, and there's a damn good health reason for it.

Speaking of unrealistic ideals, where did this Atkins fanaticism come from? Yeah, being morbidly obese is unhealthy, but avoiding a substance that is the staple food of nearly every culture on Earth to maintain a reasonable weight is probably worse. What ever happened to just eating a little less and getting out a little more?
 
Makosuke said:
What ever happened to just eating a little less and getting out a little more?
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i realized after going on a mild diet this year (went from 170 to 150 in 6 months) that eating less is relatively less beneficial than exercising. ideally, you'd combine both, but i think it's better to eat the same but exercise more instead of the other way around.

i've noticed that my metabolism must be getting higher due to more frequent running/swimming this year. even if i put on a few pounds (for example, i went to a conference last week -> paid meals out, three times a day -> quick gains in weight), i can shed them very quickly because my body is leaner and naturally consumes more calories...

also, substituting soda with water/tea/unsweetened coffee did wonders.
 
We also have to remember that not doing something about weight related health issues will bankrupt medicare, and cost everyone more money in the future. That's one reason why Texas has taken measures to try to prevent obesity at an early age, by getting rid of foods with no nutritional value at school, and limiting fried foods candy, and soft drinks...

I'm no adonis by far, but I watch what I eat, and get out more, because I don't want to have the health issues that obese people have later on in life...
 
It is good for people to be HEALTHY. Does this mean some skinny anorexic person? No. But does it mean some fat person? Again, no. The body needs a certain amount of fat in order to be healthy, but too much can be really be for a large number of reasons. I dislike people talking about how its hard or their predisposed to being large or anything like that. Yes, it may be hard to attain or keep a healthy body weight. Yes, it may be harder for some than for others. This does not change the fact that you need to do it, or there will be serious medical consequences. While I hate to point something out as obvious as this, people seem to forget that fat has to come from somewhere, and that exercise breaks it down. I don't care how predisposed to being obese you are, if you eat less than your body needs, and workout to make it need even more, your body WILL break down your fat. That is just biology, physics, and chemistry, and no matter how predisposed you are, it will happen. Will it suck at first? Yes. Will you hate it? More than likely. Will it be insanely hard? Oh god yes. Do you need to do it in order to not develop severe healthy problems, along with limiting what you are capable of doing in life, and therefor getting out of it? Yes! Getting obese may have been an accident. You may not like it. But once you are there, you can either choose to bite the bullet and become healthy, or stay horribly unhealthy. Its your call.

wdlove said:
That is quite sad. Although he does seem to be happy. Is that by any chance the 5 or 6 year old that social services took away from his parents. They had accused them of causing his obesity.
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When the child moves to one side you can see a pony tail, I think the child is a "she."
 
They should take up rock-climbing

Even at an indoor gym. There's nothing that makes you want to lose weight more than having to haul it up a wall. Dropping 15 lbs. made a HUGE difference to me when I was hanging by my fingertips...
 
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