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Old Mar 27, 2010, 03:52 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by NoSmokingBandit View Post
I do hope they never fully move to digital distribution. If the next gen is all downloadable games (which i doubt, mainly because the US's internet speeds are still **** compared to the world) then i'm just going to quit gaming. I like to own the games i buy, not long-term rent them. I could rant about that for a few pages, but i'll try to control myself
They're already doing this in the PC (and soon Mac) markets with Steam. Works a treat and I hope consoles catch up to this level of quality. I wouldn't like next-gen consoles to use the current tech as standard, but like I said if they get to Steams-quality then I'd be happy to be all digital.
So long as they allow backups too.

I love and swear by DD and I only have a 1.2-1.5mbps connection .
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 04:34 PM   #102
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I had a 360, the 'Its Microsoft' didn't bother me. But then I had two that both died. So now I avoid Microsoft hardware like the plague. Because their Keyboards, Mice and Consoles die on me within months.

My 80GB PS3 is going strong, mainly exclusive titles. I'm getting Heavy Rain today.

---

The learning curve of the PS3 is debatable. Its reasonably well documented by IBM and Sony. I'm more willing to scratch it up to laziness.

---

In all honesty, for the next generation. I'm probably going to bite the bullet and end up getting all 3. But it'll be interesting to see when one dies if I think it will be worth replacing.

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Originally Posted by TheSpaz View Post
1. Who cares if there's a lot of people using Microsoft stuff everyday… doesn't mean it has to be in my house too.

2. I haven't had any issues with the free Playstation Network. I don't understand what's so bad about it (besides cross-game voice chat)

3. I don't develop for X360 so that doesn't matter to me. If the game is good, then I'll play it.

4. Blu-ray is nice but I already had a dedicated Blu-ray player

5. I'm not interested in the Move one single bit.

I buy products based on quality, not features. I don't have much faith in Microsoft products, but I have a lot of faith in Apple and Samsung for bringing high quality stuff to the market. I'm sorry it bothers you, but that's just the way I am. If I bought a Microsoft product, I would feel guilty about it. It was bad enough running their OS on my Mac, but now I don't need Windows at all thanks to Playstation 3!
But the BluRay player allows devs to put as much true HD content as possible on the PS3

My hardware preference list has gone to this with the advent of the 360. (In no particular order)

Apple
Samsung
Western Digital
Nintendo
Sony
HP
Philips
LG
Logitech
Epson
Cannon
Asus/Gigabyte
Sapphire Graphics
ATi/AMD
Corsair
NZXT
Thermaltake/Highpower

Blacklist:
Seagate
Microsoft
nVidia (For their crap drivers)
The cheap/generic brands.
Dell Desktops.
Acer Laptops.

And I'll be damned to change that because some person mistakes preference for fanboyism. That list thas been built up from many years of gaming and working in the IT support industry.

---

BD is being adopted faster than DVD was. And DVD hardware back then costs as mych as BD hardware costs now.

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Old Mar 27, 2010, 04:55 PM   #103
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So Sony should be able to design a Ps3 based on information that wont be finalized until 4 years later but its ok for MS to build a console with a dvd drive when theres finalized blu-ray and hd-dvd available during their design phase?
There is quite a difference between one console (360) launching 6 months BEFORE either HD disc format goes on sale, and the other (PS3) coming out 6 months AFTER. Especially when one of those companies is not only in the position of selling a gaming/media device, but also trying to promote a format for which their in-house movies will be delivered on.
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Yeah, Sony should have put a USB 3.0 port in the ps3 three years ago when USB 3 barely existed....
Hey, I'm just using your logic here. The USB 3.0 spec was final toward the end 2008, and if I'm not mistaken, the PS3 did just get a redesign. So again, by your logic, the technology is there, why not use it?? Also, Sony was using "Draft-N" wifi in their laptops well before the spec was final, so why not have it in the Slim PS3 as well?
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I didnt read the rest of your post because you arent making a whole lot of sense, tbh.
Here, let me REALLY dumb it down for you...

I believe that Sony wanted Blu-ray to win more than they wanted to make an affordable, consumer-friendly game console, and forcing it into the machine raised the starting cost above what a lot of people, myself included, believe a gaming console should cost. All of these things I've been proposing have been hypothetical exaggerations to prove my point that, while they do make for a very high-tech, amazing machine, they also burden the consumer with higher costs that they might not need.

You say - If we have the technology, why should we have to settle for less?

I'm saying - Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 05:04 PM   #104
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I believe that Sony wanted Blu-ray to win more than they wanted to make an affordable, consumer-friendly game console, and forcing it into the machine raised the starting cost above what a lot of people, myself included, believe a gaming console should cost. All of these things I've been proposing have been hypothetical exaggerations to prove my point that, while they do make for a very high-tech, amazing machine, they also burden the consumer with higher costs that they might not need.

You say - If we have the technology, why should we have to settle for less?

I'm saying - Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.
more money in BD. in recent months, for the first time, DVD sellings have gone into the negative growth. this is because people are SLOWLY turning to BD (or DD i guess too) - i think its a great thing. on that note, we should be moving up and on to new technologies. i hate using the old technology when something newer is there (except USB3, its crap ).

gamers wont benefit from spec-N, have you ever watched your upload speed whilst gaming? GBoE makes up if you wanna stream ripped BD movies (where bandwidth required is >~3MB/s). sony doesnt want you doing that though, they want you to purchase their BD MOVIES!
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 05:48 PM   #105
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more money in BD.
Oh, totally. I didn't say it doesn't make sense. I'm just saying, when people tout Blu-ray as this feature that Sony graced the PS3 with to crush MS and their lowly DVD-spec'd 360, they are missing the point of the drives inclusion. And to be honest, as someone who was a very big fan of the PlayStation brand growing up, it stings a little seeing a company you used to really like use an entire market-segment as their guinea pig for their fancy, new tech. Like I said, I just want good games, but a 50GB BD-Rom doesn't grant a game instant A+ status.
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(except USB3, its crap ).

gamers wont benefit from spec-N....
Oh trust me, I know. I was just using them as examples of how I personally think NSB's logic is flawed in this discussion.
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 05:52 PM   #106
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Hey, I'm just using your logic here. The USB 3.0 spec was final toward the end 2008, and if I'm not mistaken, the PS3 did just get a redesign. So again, by your logic, the technology is there, why not use it??
Once a console goes into production its very hard to change major hardware parts like the entire usb chipset and still have it function properly. This is why consoles *rarely* get faster reading disc drives, more ram, etc... Firmware issues will crop up, then you have to explain to the developers why they have to put two different binaries on their disc, which causes more overhead in the storage medium... It just gets really messy really quickly.

The ps2 did get an incredibly minor cpu speed boost (4mhz or something close) when the slims were released, but developers could just keep their engines set at 294.whatever MHz and keep on trucking, nobody would notice an extra 5mhz anyway. USB3 on the other hand would be something people would notice and would want to take advantage of so you cant start overhauling the system half way through its life. So you pack everything in the original specs so you can last as long as possible and keep cranking out good games.

I'm beginning to think you have no idea how these things work.
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 05:59 PM   #107
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totally agree with what you said seven. Nsb also has a point about changes of hardware though, you just can't change it for cross compatibility.

500gb bds would be nice, very crisp but yea they don't indicate game playability.

Sorry for the short reply, on my mobile!
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 06:10 PM   #108
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totally agree with what you said seven. Nsb also has a point about changes of hardware though, you just can't change it for cross compatibility.

500gb bds would be nice, very crisp but yea they don't indicate game playability.

Sorry for the short reply, on my mobile!
Yet Microsoft go around putting different chipsets in their consoles left and right?
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 06:12 PM   #109
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And I'll be damned to change that because some person mistakes preference for fanboyism. That list thas been built up from many years of gaming and working in the IT support industry.

---

BD is being adopted faster than DVD was. And DVD hardware back then costs as mych as BD hardware costs now.
Personal preferences are of course normal and not in dispute. However there is a big difference to preference and fanboyism, however there is a lot of illogical fanboyism that permiates forums like this you have to agree.

Also can you provide actual imperitive evidence that blu-ray takeup is faster than DVD as I simply do not believe that statement. I have found only one article on google dating back to 2008 which claimed so, and more that say otherwise. Blu-ray is 4 years old by now, DVD from my own observational point was taken up far quicker. And I'm an early adoptee of most technoligies & formats (cdi, video cd, minidisc, philips dcc, laserdisc, HD-DVD, blu-ray etc..)
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 06:38 PM   #110
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Personal preferences are of course normal and not in dispute. However there is a big difference to preference and fanboyism, however there is a lot of illogical fanboyism that permiates forums like this you have to agree.
But he just doesn't want Microsoft products. How is that not personal preference?

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Also can you provide actual imperitive evidence that blu-ray takeup is faster than DVD as I simply do not believe that statement. I have found only one article on google dating back to 2008 which claimed so, and more that say otherwise. Blu-ray is 4 years old by now, DVD from my own observational point was taken up far quicker. And I'm an early adoptee of most technoligies & formats (cdi, video cd, minidisc, philips dcc, laserdisc, HD-DVD, blu-ray etc..)
Theres a gadget show article somewhere. But Im not allowed to access their website now becasue Im a New Zealand IP.
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 06:48 PM   #111
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I'm beginning to think you have no idea how these things work.
No, I get it. You have just COMPLETELY missed the point of this discussion.
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I am still laughing over the irony of posting this on an apple forum.
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I didnt read the rest of your post because you arent making a whole lot of sense, tbh.
Had you not been "laughing" so much, and actually took the time to read people's posts, you might be able to follow the discussion better.

My point is not about the minutiae of the tech. I get that even minor changes can have larger, far-reaching effects on the entire system. Had you actually read what I was saying, multiple times, you would see that I was simply using those newer tech parts as exaggerated examples of why I feel your logic is incorrect.

My point, as it has been THE ENTIRE TIME, is that while it is all well and good to have high-tech (current) parts in your consumer electronics devices, when they come with a much higher cost than people are expecting, that isn't good. Launching the PS3 with the specs it has, and at $600, means that over time, there is only so low the retail price will get.

You say that the 360 was "built as cheaply as possible" as a sort of knock on the system. You can lecture people all you want on how well or not the 360 was engineered, but keeping high-cost parts (HD-DVD, wifi, HDD) out of the base machine is precisely why it is selling for only $200 now AND making them a profit. Contrast that to Sony who is only at $300, and still losing $$$ on every PS3 sold.

I couldn't care less about the spec of the machine. I want good games from my game machine. Even an Arcade with no HDD, wifi, or HD-DVD, which you refer to as "cheap", "pitiful", "junk" and "mediocre", will play one of my favorite games this generation (Geo Wars 2). And while I have many games I really enjoy on my PS3, it is just a shame that it had to cost me so much to get them, considering most of those spec-sheet highlight parts aren't a factor with them.
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 07:46 PM   #112
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I guess I'm not the typical Mac user that I thought I was. I wanted a powerful adult gaming system. There were 2 requirements in my head before I made the purchase.

1. Can't be a Wii
2. Can't be a Microsoft or Windows-based/DirectX-based product.

That didn't leave me with a whole lot of options. The fact that I had all the previous generation Playstations and the recent PS3 Slim really made my decision easier.

I guess that I thought most Apple users were anti-Microsoft. Is that so hard to believe?

Anyway, I'm still enjoying my PS3 and that's all that matters now. The games that matter to me most are available and run great.
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 08:38 PM   #113
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You should have labeled this thread "Why I'm 'PRO' PS3" Mr. TheSpaz..

Adult "gaming" system. Is that some kind of oxymoron?
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 08:45 PM   #114
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I have both a XBox 360 and a PS3 connected to my Dell 3008WFP via a HDMI switcher. It makes absolutely no difference to me which one I use. It's the games that matter. Right now I'm playing Uncharted 2 on PS3 and Forza3 on the XBox.

I do like that backing up to external storage is drop dead simple on the PS3. On the XBox360 it's such a PITA that I don't bother doing it.

I have another PS3 Slim in the living room that's used as a Blu-ray player.
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 09:02 PM   #115
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Originally Posted by TheSpaz View Post
I guess I'm not the typical Mac user that I thought I was. I wanted a powerful adult gaming system. There were 2 requirements in my head before I made the purchase.

1. Can't be a Wii
2. Can't be a Microsoft or Windows-based/DirectX-based product.

That didn't leave me with a whole lot of options. The fact that I had all the previous generation Playstations and the recent PS3 Slim really made my decision easier.

I guess that I thought most Apple users were anti-Microsoft. Is that so hard to believe?

Anyway, I'm still enjoying my PS3 and that's all that matters now. The games that matter to me most are available and run great.
Ah, Spaz. It's always fun watching you post, and then watch almost everyone else disagree with you.

I'd be willing to wager a lot of Mac users also have PCs, or bought Macs after switching from a Windows machine because they knew they could still run Windows if they needed to. Steve Jobs (he's your Leader, right?) even said, "We want to let go of the notion that for Apple to win, Microsoft has to lose." If buying anything MS makes feels like a 'betrayal' to you, well, that's just pretty sad.

Personally, I started with a Xbox 360, then bought a PS3 for Blu-ray, and now I haven't turned either of them on in months. I've gone back to gaming on my computer under Windows 7 entirely.
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 09:07 PM   #116
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The difference between the 360's chipsets are kind of like the change in the PS3's CPU over the years. Just a minor change due to manufacturing methods. They didnt change the architecture or functionality of anything like changing from USB2 to USB3 or whatever, just minor revisions, mainly smaller nm chips, which happens on every console over time because smaller chips use less power and generate less heat. The Cell started out at 90nm and i think its down to 45nm now. Still the same chip, just more power/heat efficient. MS just names their revisions and Sony doesnt (other than the slim, of course).

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Adult "gaming" system. Is that some kind of oxymoron?
People often bash the wii saying it only has little kids games, but fun has no age limit, imo. I had some people over a while ago and everyone from 16 to 60 was playing Wii Bowling and having a great time. That wouldnt have happened with COD or whatever.

I do remember a recent poll saying the majority of ps3 owners were around 30 years old or something. I dont recall what the other console's stats were, but they were younger by a few years. The older generation may not like the fast-paces flashy games but many do enjoy a relaxing game like Wii Sports or a puzzle game like Picross (which i am currently addicted to myself, btw).

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Old Mar 27, 2010, 10:29 PM   #117
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But he just doesn't want Microsoft products. How is that not personal preference?
So your saying it's a preference and he's not a fanboy?

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Yeah, I'm an Apple fanboy and buying from the competition doesn't feel right to me whether the games are better or not.
Guess you didn't Spaz's little acceptance speech.




Or is self confesion discounted?
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Old Mar 27, 2010, 11:51 PM   #118
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People often bash the wii saying it only has little kids games, but fun has no age limit, imo.
I know you don't like to read my posts, but at least stop stealing my lines...

Post #40, this thread:
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Fun has no age limit.
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Old Mar 28, 2010, 01:39 AM   #119
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So your saying it's a preference and he's not a fanboy?
Is fanboyism any different than having Sony as a preference and avoiding Microsoft like the plague?

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Old Mar 28, 2010, 02:00 AM   #120
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People often bash the wii saying it only has little kids games, but fun has no age limit, imo. I had some people over a while ago and everyone from 16 to 60 was playing Wii Bowling and having a great time. That wouldnt have happened with COD or whatever.
You're preaching to the choir. I was commenting on TheSpaz's comment.

I own a Wii -- bought it at release -- as do all of my friends and most of my family. Great console with something for everybody.
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Old Mar 28, 2010, 02:08 AM   #121
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You're preaching to the choir. I was commenting on TheSpaz's comment.

I own a Wii -- bought it at release -- as do all of my friends and most of my family. Great console with something for everybody.
The weird thing is, I bought a Wii to get SSBB. But I got twilight pricess and Fire Emblem - Radiant Dawn. Loved the first two but severly dissapointed by SSBB.

(I've played path of radiance too, should've kept for a little while longer. It goes for a lot now.)
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Old Mar 28, 2010, 02:22 AM   #122
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I never picked up Path of Radiance, but I bought Radiant Dawn, I just never played it beyond the initial try.

And I could never get into the SSBB games. Gave my Cube bundled copy to a friend's son.

I bough the Wii mainly for Zelda, but pretty much anything Nintendo. The game I ended up liking the best was Resident Evil 4 Wii, which I could not get into on the Cube or the PS2.
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Old Mar 28, 2010, 03:09 AM   #123
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Is fanboyism any different than having Sony as a preference and avoiding Microsoft like the plague?
Oh my goodness yes.

A preference is based on usage. A knowledge of the subject. A rational experience of a product normally first hand.

To prefer somthing you must first 'know' somthing about what you are prefering too.


Fanboys do not do this. They base decisions on arbiturary things such as the brand labeling rather than an actual first hand knowledge or experience of the goods, product or subject in hand.

They think 'blind' brand loyalty is normal, and will often use missinformation and illogical positioning (despite realising hypocracy) to backup their stance on the subject. They will always fail to listen to reason and will often become aggressive.

In this case...

TheSpaz refuses to give the 360 a chance unlike you who owned one. He makes decisions not based of first hand usage and therefore it is not a preference. He uses missinformation to say how one is better than the other (no hdmi etc..) and he struggles to see how anyone else can not think like he does (assumes every mac owner hates Microsft) and is unable to comprehend an other perspective over his own and flippantly dismisses the notion of doing so. He may have remained civil and his tone less aggressive than others who do the same and yet the underlying part is the same.
The very definition of a fanboy.
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Old Mar 28, 2010, 04:07 AM   #124
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Oh my goodness yes.

A preference is based on usage. A knowledge of the subject. A rational experience of a product normally first hand.

To prefer somthing you must first 'know' somthing about what you are prefering too.


Fanboys do not do this. They base decisions on arbiturary things such as the brand labeling rather than an actual first hand knowledge or experience of the goods, product or subject in hand.

They think 'blind' brand loyalty is normal, and will often use missinformation and illogical positioning (despite realising hypocracy) to backup their stance on the subject. They will always fail to listen to reason and will often become aggressive.

In this case...

TheSpaz refuses to give the 360 a chance unlike you who owned one. He makes decisions not based of first hand usage and therefore it is not a preference. He uses missinformation to say how one is better than the other (no hdmi etc..) and he struggles to see how anyone else can not think like he does (assumes every mac owner hates Microsft) and is unable to comprehend an other perspective over his own and flippantly dismisses the notion of doing so. He may have remained civil and his tone less aggressive than others who do the same and yet the underlying part is the same.
The very definition of a fanboy.
I was going to say its all in the wording but thats very hard to argue against!
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Old Mar 28, 2010, 08:48 AM   #125
NoSmokingBandit
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SevenInchScrew View Post
I know you don't like to read my posts, but at least stop stealing my lines...

Post #40, this thread:
I knew i reead that somewhere recently, but its true so i dont mind ripping you off
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