10.3.4 DANGER!

Discussion in 'Mac OS X 10.3 (Panther) Discussion' started by michaelrjohnson, Jun 1, 2004.

  1. michaelrjohnson macrumors 68020

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2000
    Location:
    54140
    #1
    I wanted to start this thread as a warning, as well as a prevention mechanism. I own an iBook G4 recently purchased in March (thus, the previous rev.)(see sig for specs). Upon installing the 10.3.4 update via the software update panel, my computer WOULD NOT START UP. I worked for 4 hours with two, very skilled Mac-enthusiests. We tried all sorts of things, an abbreviated list:

    - repairing permissions
    - repairing disk
    - booting in safe mode
    - fsck -y -f
    - zapping pram
    - resetting PMU
    - clearing NVRAM

    etc, etc.

    To no avail. My computer would not boot, no matter what. Luckily enough for me, I was able to boot in Target disk mode and copy all my data to an external drive (via another mac). I don't know how may late-comers using iBook G4's there are to the update, but use it with caution. Apple currently has no fix for this error, and AppleCare suggests wiping internal drive and reinstalling.

    Although I remained calm throughout the process because i knew i wasn't going to lose any data, this just should not occur. I needed to wipe my drive and reinstall everything.

    /useful post
    begin rant

    Several things here really bother me.
    1) This update shouldn't have left the developer's floor with such glaring errors (there are several threads on Apple's support pages with other users having the same issues).
    2) I became aware of an iBook G4 graphics update during this process. This was a computer specific update and would have been really nice to know about. However, updates of this nature are not found in the Software Update panel. They should be. :mad:
     
  2. mkrishnan Moderator emeritus

    mkrishnan

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2004
    Location:
    Grand Rapids, MI, USA
    #2
    I totally agree. What I don't quite get is why some people are having these disasters and others are not. My iBook is almost exactly the same as yours (G4 / 800MHz / 12" / 640MB / AE / BT but with a 40 gig HD) and the update had no negative effects that I can see.

    So in other words (and not being accusatory at all!) there must be something that's a result of:

    1) Software installed
    2) Sysprefs etc settings
    3) Our usage patterns?

    That explains why different users have such different experiences. I kinda tend to think that there must be one or two specific apps or utilities that no one would suspect (because they'd be on the obviously safe list) that are responsible for this....

    FWIW the only system hack that I have is Sidetrack, and the only other stay-resident I have is NAV, I guess. I wonder what the trouble maker is.

    Or if it really is usage patterns (that is, there's some bug that was in 10.3.3 which somehow caused a persistent change in your computer through normal use, which eventually led to the crash on upgrade), how freakin' weird is that??? :eek:
     
  3. iBozz macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    May 19, 2004
    Location:
    UK
    #3
    I have a G3 CRT iMac and after I updated to OSX.3.4, the first restart took me to the desktop pattern but with no menu bar or anything else showing - at this point it froze.

    A restart took me to an spinning then frozen Apple "wheel".

    A further restart got me a black screen.

    And then it worked.

    No explanations from me, I'm afraid, just a comment.
     
  4. wrldwzrd89 macrumors G5

    wrldwzrd89

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2003
    Location:
    Solon, OH
    #4
    When I tried installing Mac OS X 10.3.4 on my G4 iMac, I had no trouble whatsoever. It installed and rebooted without any signs of trouble. What surprises me is that you would have so much trouble with it, yet I have a fairly similar machine and it worked just fine. I assume Apple knows about this, but what have they done about it, if anything? Are they working on a fix? Do they know what the cause is?
     
  5. abhishekit macrumors 65816

    abhishekit

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2003
    Location:
    akron , ohio
    #5
    i thought that update was only for the new ibooks. was it not? did u install it?
     
  6. Kevlar macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2004
    Location:
    Great White North
    #6
    My theory behind all the people having problems with updates is that they THINK they know what they are doing and end up trashing old files which are actually still used which stops the system from starting correctly. Since 10.1 I have NEVER had a single problem with an apple update and beilieve this will continue with this trend in the future. I have many mods/self made custom installations on my computer and yet I never have any problems, so I guess all these "WARNINGS" are pretty useless in my mind. I don't know maybe I just have a magic touch but who knows......

    BTW I am using an old TIpowerbook 667mhz which has never needed any hardware fixes.
     
  7. ingenious macrumors 65832

    ingenious

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2004
    Location:
    Virginia, United States (Kansan in exile)
    #7

    I think this might be a Panther problem. I am helping a teacher recover her pre 10.3.4 (probably 10.3.0) eMac today. It has the same symptoms. Applecare said there was an internal email about the problem. My problem involved 5 system files.
     
  8. JFreak macrumors 68040

    JFreak

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2003
    Location:
    Tampere, Finland
    #8
    i had no problems whatsoever in the 10.3.4 upgrade. i have a 1.25 powerbook. protools 6.4 seems a lot faster now.
     
  9. tomf87 macrumors 65816

    tomf87

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2003
    #9
    That's just plain baloney. How hard is it to mess up an install from Software Update? Even if you download the installer and run it, you don't get many options.

    I remember when Apple pulled 10.2.6 (or was it 10.2.8) due to Ethernet problems. Apple fixed the patch and re-released it and nobody had problems since. I guess Apple just fixed the patch because it had nothing better to do than help people who couldn't run Software Update correctly.

    :rolleyes:
     
  10. Kevlar macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2004
    Location:
    Great White North
    #10
    Ok more what I ment is that people don't learn how to properly keep there computer up to date, and how to keep it maintained. I think that is the main reason why people have problems with updates. AKA something was actually messed up before the update and this caused the update to go sour.
     
  11. michaelrjohnson thread starter macrumors 68020

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2000
    Location:
    54140
    #11
    no, i highly doubt this. not only do i not go around deleting system files, i stay current with my updates. (i dont' take it too personally, but i kinda resent the accusation ;))

    additionally, i also have NEVER had a problem with OS X. I have been a non-stop user since 10.0 Beta. So this was obviously a surprise to me too. What got me was that AppleCare's solution to the problem was a clean wipe of the drive and a fresh reinstall. I'm fortunate enough to have known to boot in target disk mode so I could copy my files. I just feel there should have been some attempt at reconciling the situation instead.

    as for an update. much like others posting here, as well as on apple's support threads, after I've reinstalled the OS, i upgraded to 10.3.4 no problem. and now i'm back at 100% there just seems to be some glitch with some machines.
     
  12. mstecker macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2002
    Location:
    Philadelphia
    #12
    I've had an iBook G$ running 10.3.4 for a while.

    All I'll say is that Apple did preseed many builds to customers as development progressed.
     
  13. 7on macrumors 601

    7on

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2003
    Location:
    Dress Rosa
    #13
    I think most of the problems may center around certain hacks that uninstalled still leave crap hidden in the system.
     
  14. mkrishnan Moderator emeritus

    mkrishnan

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2004
    Location:
    Grand Rapids, MI, USA
    #14
    I hope no one's trying to imply that you screw with your machine and so its your own fault. :( But still, what's the glitch right? It's either hardware, installed software, or some aspect of the OS itself / system files which can be changed as a result of usage. Hardware seems like an unlikely candidate bc you were able to do an upgrade off a clean install.....
     
  15. Dale Sorel macrumors 6502a

    Dale Sorel

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2003
    #15
    Danger, DANGER Will Robinson!

    [​IMG]

    Sorry, I just love the title of your thread ;)
     
  16. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2002
    Location:
    Palookaville
    #16
    Could be, but I'm going to guess something else: Damage present on a hard drive before the upgrade casing the installer to fail in some subtle way.
     
  17. mkrishnan Moderator emeritus

    mkrishnan

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2004
    Location:
    Grand Rapids, MI, USA
    #17
    That's an interesting point...do you mean damaged sectors of the kind a scandisk type of thing would detect, leading to corrupted files?
     
  18. iBook macrumors regular

    Joined:
    May 3, 2004
    Location:
    On a tugboat
    #18
    I don't how to do this. Can you explain the procedure?

    Thanks.

    BTW -- Have the same iBook configuration as you. No problems with 10.3.4.
     
  19. michaelrjohnson thread starter macrumors 68020

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    #19

    yeah, i would agree with that. i just think it's pretty odd that a relatively small "random" sample of us iBook G4 users would have the same issue. seems odd, ya know?
     
  20. michaelrjohnson thread starter macrumors 68020

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    #20
    EXACTLY what I was implying! Thanks!
     
  21. michaelrjohnson thread starter macrumors 68020

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2000
    Location:
    54140
    #21

    Sure, it's relatively simple. Here goes:

    To do this you will need:
    1 Firewire cable (A-A) (i think, or just the normal large size on both ends)
    2 Firewire enabled Macs (haven't tried on PC)
    1 Finger

    The Process:
    1) Connect the firewire cable between both computers
    1) Have the computer that you want the files to show up on turned on. (Computer A)
    3) Restart the computer whose files you want to access (Computer B)
    4) Hold down the "T" key on restart.
    (you should get visual confirmation with a Firewire logo as a screensaver)
    5) That's it! Computer B's Hard Disk should mount on Computer A. Proceed to copy at will.

    WARNING: All user passwords have become disabled, you can access anyone's files, and they can access any of yours. Use with caution! ;)
     
  22. kgarner macrumors 68000

    kgarner

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2004
    Location:
    Utah
    #22
    My own theory on this is actually a bad download. The only time I ever had a problem with an update was when I downloaded the .dmg from Apple and tried to install. Well, the checksum failed, but instead of heeding the warning I just ran it again and skipped the checksum (I am normally not this stupid, but I have done this with other .dmg (i.e. non-system related stuff) with no ill effects). Then after reboot, major crash. So maybe, some small thing got through the error detection/correction of the download in software update and that caused a problem.
     
  23. janey macrumors 603

    janey

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2002
    Location:
    sunny los angeles
    #23
    look, apple has computers and developers galore to test the builds of OS X. HOWEVER, it is unfeasible to have a ****load of setups that have every OS X app known to man installed on it. Apple can't know what causes OS X to act in certain ways, unless they go through every damned app. It might be the 3rd party software dev's problem, or maybe its just faulty hardware...there are trillions of different possible combinations.

    Apple does the best job they can with the resources they have, stop ragging on their developers. If you expect a few hundred devs and Apple employees to catch all the possible bugs in a new build of OS X, then youre sadly overestimating the ability of people like you who try out the software and you shouldnt be expecting builds of OS X to come out every couple of months, try a couple of years at least. Bah.
     

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