800 MHz bus a reality!

Discussion in 'Macintosh Computers' started by yzedf, Apr 14, 2003.

  1. yzedf macrumors 65816

    yzedf

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    #1
  2. Mr. MacPhisto macrumors 6502

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    #2
    It isn't truly an 800MHZ bus, and it may not do much in the real world if the hardware cannot function at the high speed.

    Seems to me that they took a 200MHZ bus and 4x it. I'll be interested to see how much it improves speed, because the 533 FSB speed wasn't that impressive to me. Anyhow, if it's running 400DDR then what is the point? My brother, a computer engineer, thinks most of this stuff is just "number inflation" by Intel. They keep doing doubles, triples, etc - and will be shafted at some point for doing it.
     
  3. cubist macrumors 68020

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    #3
    It's not really an 800MHz bus - it's a "quad-pumped" 200MHz bus. There isn't anything on the bus which is actually moving at 800MHz, just as there isn't anything inside the P4 which is actually moving at 2.4GHz.
     
  4. G4scott macrumors 68020

    G4scott

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    #4
    The only thing this would help with is memory access to the processor. No other components on the computer operate that fast. It'd be a waste of money to have that hooked up to your HD's, PCI slots, and everything else...
     
  5. yzedf thread starter macrumors 65816

    yzedf

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  6. yzedf thread starter macrumors 65816

    yzedf

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    Also supports Serial ATA...

    My point is the target for Apple just moved.
     
  7. iJon macrumors 604

    iJon

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    #7
    who cares if it is quad pumped. the reality is that it is faster. now the question is if its much faster than 533.

    iJon
     
  8. Catfish_Man macrumors 68030

    Catfish_Man

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    OK, this is kinda funny. The 970 is announced with a double pumped 450MHz bus and mac users go insane over it. The Pentium 4 is announced with a quad pumped 200MHz bus, and everyone goes "oh, it's not actually 800MHz, it doesn't matter". Also, what's with the comment about hooking hard drives to it? Since when does the HD hook up to the system bus? About hooking DDR400 to it: they use dual channel DDR400, so that it matches the "800MHz" bus.
     
  9. QCassidy352 macrumors G3

    QCassidy352

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    "OK, this is kinda funny. The 970 is announced with a double pumped 450MHz bus and mac users go insane over it. The Pentium 4 is announced with a quad pumped 200MHz bus, and everyone goes 'oh, it's not actually 800MHz, it doesn't matter'. "

    agreed. whatever it is technically, what it is for apple is another lost step in the speed wars.
     
  10. acj macrumors 6502

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    Pumped

    Sheesh. If something is dual or quad pumped it's effectively that much better since it moves that much more data compared to a regular bus. Removing the memory bottlenecks is a good thing, and it is one of Apples biggest problems currently.
     
  11. mgargan1 macrumors 65816

    mgargan1

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    #11
    i think intel makes great processors, i didn't switch to apple because the G4 is faster, it's not, i switched because of the OS, and the beauty of the machine. I say, if you're going to get a machine that does pretty much the same thing as everyone else's machine (to a degree), you might as well make it pretty right? Cause my new mac can go online, I can type up papers, i can do pretty much everything a PC can do, and it's eye candy too!... so back to my point, i don't see why everyone bashes intel. They make great processors which are reliable, stable, and fast. Yes, i know that they suck clock for clock with an athlon, or a G4... but they're still the fastest non-server chip on the market. So back off of intel, they a great company. Microsoft isn't!
     
  12. bousozoku Moderator emeritus

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    That would explain why they've stopped production on these processors until they figure out what went wrong. Then, there's the fact that most Intel processors, upon release, couldn't divide correctly. Yeah, that's a great company. They do restrict the market as well so compatible processor manufacturers have trouble getting their foot in the door. Yeah, that's great too, and not at all like Microsoft. :(
     
  13. acj macrumors 6502

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    That would explain why most intel based computers wouldn't opperate when they came out. Oh, except this didn't happen.

    Are you talking about Apple? Sounds like it, except they restrict more than processors. Your argument is flawed.
     
  14. e-coli macrumors 68000

    e-coli

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    #14
    How anyone could ever justify buying a PowerMac nowadays is totally beyond me. It would be a complete waste of cash.

    I think it's embarrassing. The 970 better come out in June, and Hypertransport had better rock hard, or it will be downright humiliating. And unless I have a misunderstanding about what Hypertransport it, it still won't address our BUS speed woes between hardware components. :rolleyes:
     
  15. bousozoku Moderator emeritus

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    #15
    I never said that they didn't operate, only that they didn't operate correctly when dividing. I suppose that accuracy isn't important to you, as you're displaying.

    Apple don't make processors, so they couldn't restrict a company making compatible processors. This would make your response flawed.
     
  16. acj macrumors 6502

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    Define "Correctly." If the average user doesn’t notice the problem, is it really a problem? And please, if accuracy is so important, prove that MOST Intel processors did not divide correctly.

    I agree Intel chips have a lot of errata, but many chips do, and most are worked around so that the end user does not see any problem.

    Well, you got me here. I was commenting on the fact that Apple restricts markets. I didn't mean to sound like I was referring to processors. By “more than processors” I meant the whole system. They don’t really allow competition, do they?
     
  17. zarathustra macrumors 6502a

    zarathustra

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    I can justify it because I needed a new Mac right now to do work (up from a g3 powerbook). Please don't knock my DP 1.25 Ghz PowerMac. On the contrary, be happy that idiots like me keep buying them so we can tide Apple over with cash to please little whinos. ;)
     
  18. iJon macrumors 604

    iJon

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    #18
    i think the powermac is a great machine. very powerful, out of hte box you can put up to 5 hard drives in the computer, easy open case for installing extra stuff, combined with os x its great.

    iJon
     
  19. DavidCL23 macrumors 6502

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    #19
    Sure, your PM can support upto 5 HDD's, but u'll need a permit for all that noise!
     
  20. MacCoaster macrumors 6502a

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    #20
    Much worse, my PC supports up to 8 internal 3.5" hard drives, where do I apply for that permit? :)

    Oh wait, I'm deaf. Who cares. :D Oh, that's right, my parents. :(

    /me drools at 200 GB * 8 in my case.
     
  21. yzedf thread starter macrumors 65816

    yzedf

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    /me crys cuz i only got 10GB hdd in the laptop, and no desktop :(
     
  22. bousozoku Moderator emeritus

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    #22
    I started Windows and Delphi to show you a workaround that all x86 compiler writers had to make for the Pentium divide problem. You'll see it in the screenshot: "Pentium-safe FDIV This is by far the most famouse of Intel's manufacturing goofs. Country by country, the word leaked out that there was again a divide problem. They denied it for a few weeks, later to confirm it.

    You're right about Apple not liking competition, they were even taken to court about it once, and from that, Claris was born.
     

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  23. caveman_uk Guest

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    #23
    'cos I wanted one...good enough reason for me;) And it was a dual 1GHz with a superdrive and I got it for £1300. It also goes quite fast enough for me. When the mythical 970 does appear machines with them aren't gonna be as 'cheap' as they are now. Apple will wring every last cent out of new adopters.

    The pentium FDIV bug I think only existed in the original pentiums. Everything that ran on pentiums had to have a workaround for it. I think (tho' I'm not sure) that' it's fixed now. All new processors have bugs when they come out. The 970 probably will. Mostly they can be fixed using microcode updates that are loaded when the machine is booted.
     
  24. hacurio1 macrumors regular

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    #24
    Re: 800 MHz bus a reality!


    One more thing!

    Hope This delays the new 3Ghz chip for at least a month. NEW POWER MAC WILL BE OUT in the next few months though, we shall see THEN!!!!!!
     
  25. MisterMe macrumors G4

    MisterMe

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    #25
    Actually, the FDIV did not begin with the Pentium. It actually began with the 486. Some only assume that problem has been fixed. It is difficult to get real information because people's jobs are threatened when they publicize problems in Intel chips.

    The most reliable workaround to the bugs in Intel's floating point unit is to do all mission-critical floating point calculations using integer arithmetic. One of the many nice things about the PowerPC is that it does floating-point reliably in hardware.

    How many people on this forum know that CAD drawings using an Intel-based computer will be visibly different from a drawing generated by the same CAD file from a similarly configured AMD-based computer? Which one is correct? Well, you pay your money and you take your chances. But I don't gamble; I use a Power Mac.
     

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