Another one bites the dust....reverting from ML to SL

Discussion in 'OS X Mountain Lion (10.8)' started by RedRaven571, Jan 9, 2013.

  1. macrumors 6502a

    RedRaven571

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2009
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    #1
    Just thought I'd share. After a month with ML, I reinstalled SL today, using a time machine back up. The only things I really liked about ML were Notifications and iMessage but, for me, they didn't counterbalance the slow boot and shut down times of ML, and I really didn't see any other major positive differences in the OS that would make me stay with it. I can't even use AirMirroring because my MBP is too old, so I need to use AirParrot with either OS.

    I REALLY wanted to like it and stay with it; maybe will try again around 10.8.5 or so.
     
  2. macrumors 68030

    Krazy Bill

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2011
    #2
    iCloud?

    Hoping these get fixed in the next update. In the meantime I haven't found the need to reboot except maybe once a week or so. (Even then I don't know why I do it).

    It sucks. I've managed to ignore most of the frilly crap in ML. So much now I don't even notice if I try hard.
     
  3. macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2009
    #3
    Do you have an SSD? I have never noticed slow boot times in my MBP.
     
  4. macrumors 68000

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  5. macrumors 68020

    sidewinder

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    Location:
    Northern California
    #5
    I never understood the fascination with boot times and shutdowns times in regards to Mac OS X. It's Unix system for crying out loud. If you restart the system enough to care about this you are doing something wrong....

    S-
     
  6. benwiggy, Jan 10, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2013

    macrumors 68020

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2012
    #6
    Before ditching an OS, I would certainly want to make sure that any problems I was having were actually directly caused by the new OS, rather than merely "something happening on my computer right now."

    I haven't noticed any slowness in startup -- perhaps shutdown is slower than previously, but if I've pressed the shutdown button, I'm already moving out of the room.

    You should never argue over taste, of course, and some people just "like" Snow Leopard. Personally, my experience is that most of the OS has the same features and functions, although there are some very nice additions and fixes, as well as some interesting new features and under-the-bonnet improvements.

    Things like the ability to merge folders when copying in the Finder, for instance. AirDrop is also very useful for transferring files between Macs without having to have Sharing on all the time.

    I like Resume -- I turn my Mac off every night, and when I start it up in the morning, it's exactly as it was. Apple is moving towards an OS where you don't need to know or care whether an app is actually loaded into memory before you start using it -- this is the only real "iOS-ification" of OS X.

    I also like the new Documents method. I've been using Macs for twenty years, and yes you do have to change your habits a bit, but once you get used to it, it's a real boon. Finally free from the tyranny of having to hit save every time I do something! Versions is also very useful.

    To say nothing of iCloud, which makes syncing Calendar, contacts, reminders, Notes, Photos and even documents across two Macs and an iPhone effortless. And you get another email address.

    Even LaunchPad, which I thought initially was just a gimmick from iOS, is pretty handy for launching apps when you've got two large monitors and the Dock is miles away. Just make the gesture, and click on the App.

    This is just a fraction, and much of this was introduced in Lion, whose benefits you also get if you're jumping from SL. (And with ML, you get the refinements on Lion's features.)
    If anyone really wants to know about ML, then John Syracuse's detailed review on ArsTechnica is essential reading:
    http://arstechnica.com/apple/2012/07/os-x-10-8/
     
  7. macrumors 65816

    Xenomorph

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Location:
    St. Louis
    #7
    What the hell does being Unix have to do with anything?

    And because shutdowns don't matter to you, they shouldn't matter to anyone else?

    I use my MacBook Pro for work. That means I'm powering on and off my system at least once a day. Why would I leave it on all the time? It drains the battery, even when sleeping.

    At the end of the day, I shut down my system. With OS X 10.8, it sits at the spinning animation on shutdown for a VERY long time. It didn't do that in 10.7 or 10.6. It's annoying.
    I try to ignore it. I click shutdown and just pack up my MacBook Pro. I'm sure it's still "shutting down" as I leave my office.
     
  8. macrumors 6502

    b0fh666

    Joined:
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    south
    #8
    interesting.

    I have been using laptops 'for work' (linux,windows,mac) for the past 12 years and never had this habit of shutting down... just close the lid and let ACPI do its thing.
     
  9. macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2012
    #9
    I wonder why this is happening to you. Maybe try booting from an SSD?

    I didn't stick with the 5400rpm hard drive for long, but with the SSD I have about 6 or 7 seconds of boot up time, and probably a bit less for shut down.

    And I agree on the wisdom of shutting down. Keeping it running is harder on the hardware over the long haul, there are many studies proving this. Whether it's a UNIX based system or not is completely irrelevant.
     
  10. macrumors P6

    dukebound85

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2005
    Location:
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    #10
    curious, but why not sleep it? don't you have it plugged in when working?

    i never shut down my mbp or my work mbp
     
  11. macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2011
    #11
    I never shut down my MBP either. I can't think of any reason to. It just seems like it would be much more hassle to go through all the trouble of reinstalling Snow Leopard than it would be to just sleep your computer when you're not at work, and plug it in if battery is an issue. And what about iCloud integration, iMessage, etc? You are missing out on a lot of stuff just so that you can shut your computer down faster.
     
  12. RedRaven571, Jan 10, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2013

    thread starter macrumors 6502a

    RedRaven571

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2009
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    #12
    I don't think it's a hardware issue since my mbp (late 2008, C2D 2.4, 8GB RAM, 640GB 7200RPM HDD) shuts down in perhaps 5 seconds with SL and boots in something like 1/2 the time as it does with ML. In ML, it also takes an extra few seconds to wake from sleep, and also inexplicably occasionally hangs on the log in screen for an extra 10-15 seconds before I can enter my password.

    There are several threads on this forum, and lots of posts, that mention this exact same problem, from folks with newer hardware than mine.

    I don't always shut it down, I mostly just sleep it. I don't know why it bugs me so much, I think it's because, when i switched from Windows, I was SO impressed with how quickly macs booted up and shut down, compared to windows computers, that now I'm spoiled.

    And, as I mentioned, from my perspective, ML isn't really bringing any big WOW factor to the table that I have to have. All my apps work with SL and there's nothing I want to do that I can't using SL (although I do miss iMessage) :eek:.
     
  13. macrumors 68040

    SlCKB0Y

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2012
    Location:
    Sydney, Australia
    #13
    Sleep uses very small amounts of power.
     
  14. macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2008
    #14
    If you have a SSD Mac that comes with it.

    Though to the OP, I understand your frustration with the slow shut down times, I don't understand your boot time. My MBA is about 10seconds or so. If you have an HDD I could see it around 20seconds or so. Though that's not a problem at all. I'm sorry, I'm just trying to keep this in perspective. Remember the load times of older machines? Ooooo!!! Or booting XP or Vista? :D

    I'm just glad I don't have to work in that environment.
     
  15. thread starter macrumors 6502a

    RedRaven571

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2009
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    #15
    Yeah, my start up with ML is strange, about 25 rotations of the wheel on the screen with the Apple logo, then the cursor arrow appears in the upper left corner and the screen pauses for about another 10 seconds, then the log in screen appears. Once I put in my password, then my desktop appears and I am ready for business.

    With SL, I get about 17 rotations of the wheel on the Apple screen then it goes almost immediately to log in. So, overall, about 1/2 the time as with ML.

    Shutdown with SL is almost immediate, maybe a 5 second delay occasionally. With ML, it's a mixed bag of almost immediate, the blue-gray screen for a few seconds, or watching the spinning wheel for 15-25 seconds.

    I realize none of the times are an eternity, and, to your point, still superior to Windows systems; I just don't understand why it happens with ML and not SL.
     
  16. macrumors 68040

    tigres

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2007
    Location:
    Land of the Free-Waiting for Term Limits
    #16
    I am in agreement with OP.
    if icould run SL on my 2012 MBA I would.

    Not supporting iCloud from 10.6 when it worked fine w/MM was utter BS from apple.

    SL is light years ahead of 10.7 and 10.8 on reliability.
    I miss it, but still run it on an older iMac at my office.
     
  17. macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2008
    #17
    I'd also have to disagree with you there. SL did not really incorporate many features into the OS and was basically doing under the hood changes to Leopard. I don't think you can compare the two (or three if you include Lion).

    I would agree with you about Lion though. Worst system Apple has ever made/released.
     
  18. macrumors 68030

    Krazy Bill

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2011
    #18
    "small amounts" is relative. When you have to drive 300 miles between usage, that extra "small amount" makes all the difference.

    The lengthy shutdown time in ML is "broke". Workarounds like sleep should not even be part of this discussion.

    To anyone that disagrees I say, "duh".
     
  19. macrumors 68020

    Joined:
    May 1, 2009
    #19
    Just a hypothesis, but perhaps because ML has to resume all the apps and settings upon the next boot, and SL doesn't do that so it can just shutdown each app? Do you people notice any difference in shutdown times when you deselect the reopen apps option on the shutdown menu and in the general system preferences, i.e. disable the resume feature?
     
  20. macrumors 68030

    cmChimera

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2010
    #20
    Frankly, yes.

    I use my Macbook Pro for work as well, I really don't see how that makes a difference. Yes, sleep drains a minimal amount of battery. But if you were to sleep it overnight, I doubt it would completely drain the battery. Oh and did your Mac not come with a magsafe charger?


    Close the lid so it goes to sleep, and leave.
     
  21. macrumors 604

    iBookG4user

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2006
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    #21
    While I did not like Lion, it was far from the worst. The early versions of Mac OS X were nothing to be proud of.
     
  22. thread starter macrumors 6502a

    RedRaven571

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2009
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    #22
    Actually, I tried deselecting reopen apps, I even made a little app with Automator to shut down all open apps before I tried shutting down the computer, none of it made any difference.
     
  23. macrumors 68020

    Joined:
    May 1, 2009
    #23
    Weird. Well there goes that hypothesis :)
     
  24. thread starter macrumors 6502a

    RedRaven571

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2009
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    #24
    Well friends, here I am again. I installed 10.8.3 hoping for a better experience and have persevered or about a month or so but I'm probably going back to SL tomorrow.

    Maybe it's just me, or my machine, but ML runs hotter, boots and shuts own slower, and I even think it may run a bit slower than SL.

    I love the way my MBP runs on SL, but I keep getting lured back by the ML candy.

    As I said before, I want to like it, what with iMessage, iCloud, etc. but I just don't think those counter balance the downside.

    Maybe I'll try 10.9 when it comes out (if my machine is supported).
     
  25. macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2012
    #25
    How much RAM do you have? Usually the system will be much smoother if you do fresh-install rather than upgrade. If you have 'only' 4 GB, then better stay in SL, unless your system will be slowing down later due to insufficient memory & paging it out to the disk (although it's fresh-install system).

     

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