Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

Keane16

macrumors 6502a
Dec 8, 2007
810
671
Which sucks, because people need Macs to develop for iOS. Letting the Mac stagnate means flipping off your iOS developer base.

A bit of a strange thing to say so close to an overhaul of the most popular Mac used for App development.

Nothing is dying. They use Macs internally. Don't you think the guys at Apple making macOS, iOS, tvOS, iTunes, Final Cut Pro X etc. don't provide feedback. They use the same machines you have access to. There's no way a company who like to own own the whole stack from components to OS allows the computers they themselves use to build their consumer products to "die" any time soon.
 

Tsaksonakis

macrumors newbie
Dec 14, 2012
24
29
Crete, Greece
Mia culpa! I thought they were one and the same animal; that is all the ports are to be TB 3 but any USB-C device can use the same port as they share common cables. I'm sure we'll find out more, Thursday.
 

cerberusss

macrumors 6502a
Aug 25, 2013
932
364
The Netherlands
get ready for more and more dongles and hubs to attach because the machine for the pros has nothing but USB-C

Screen-Shot-2015-10-28-at-11.51.52-AM.png

That example is a bit overwrought. USB-C-to-lightning cables are available, thus this would eliminate two cables in the picture. Then there's a thumbdrive, of which there are a lot with USB-C too.

The only good example is the SD card. That'll require a reader.
 

Tsaksonakis

macrumors newbie
Dec 14, 2012
24
29
Crete, Greece
Only the two USB-C ports towards the back of the laptops will be Thunderbolt-enabled, the front two are USB only.

Sorry, posted this without qualification. It's been a long morning...

"Mia culpa! I thought they were one and the same animal; that is all the ports are to be TB 3 but any USB-C device can use the same port as they share common cables. I'm sure we'll find out more, Thursday.".
 

LJC94512

macrumors newbie
Oct 24, 2016
13
12
No, that's not an expression of courage. Courage is doing something risky, unpopular (in order to stand on one's convictions), controversial having potential negative consequences, difficult, etc.

Like Jobs introducing the MacBook Air with one port and underpowered CPU for $1,799. Or Jobs canning Flash. Or Tim Cook standing up to the government regarding privacy/security matters, or pushing Apple's wireless vision forward by getting rid of the headphone jack, etc.

I'm just using that word as a joke hence the apostrophe marks. I am simply playing on the fact that people keep mocking Apple with that word but I'm not really meaning it. What you've said is correct though.
 

Accipiter

macrumors member
Mar 16, 2010
53
103
A bit of a strange thing to say so close to an overhaul of the most popular Mac used for App development.

Nothing is dying. They use Macs internally. Don't you think the guys at Apple making macOS, iOS, tvOS, iTunes, Final Cut Pro X etc. don't provide feedback. They use the same machines you have access to. There's no way a company who like to own own the whole stack from components to OS allows the computers they themselves use to build their consumer products to "die" any time soon.

And yet it has been a ridiculously long time since any of the Mac machines have received a substantial update (going on 3 years for the Mac Pro), every single machine with the exception of the 12" MacBook is listed on the buyers guide as "Don't Buy" because of how long it's been since they've been updated, Tim Cook is publicly saying stuff like "Why do you even need a computer anymore? iPad Pro does it all!", and it's extremely likely that the only machine to get a bump this week is the MacBook Pro leaving everything else (including the ACTUAL most popular Mac for development - the Mini) to continue stagnating into obscurity. Meanwhile Apple is pouring cash into iOS and the Apple Watch, playing with cars, buying headphones, toying with the idea of making a television and prying into the media creation space (interested in buying Time Warner, expanding Apple Music), and putting their focus on absolutely everything OTHER than building computers.

Don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. The Mac is slowly being phased out of Apple's strategy. It's patently obvious. They'll keep it around just long enough to figure out how to do development directly on iOS (probably with some sort of iCloud-based compiler OR wider platform support for XCode - or both), and then they'll do away with it completely.

The other possibility is another architecture shift, and the delays are because they've been working out the kinks.
 
Last edited:

MacBH928

macrumors G3
May 17, 2008
8,297
3,704
Its unbelievable how Apple no longer cares about the computers. Outdated tech for top of the line prices (Then they tell you you get FREE iLife Suite and OS X).

There should be some sort of consumer campaign to shame them or boycott of some sort to make them wake up.
 
  • Like
Reactions: amegicfox

MistrSynistr

macrumors 68000
May 15, 2014
1,697
2,079
I hope there are better enhancements coming than the one rumored so far. I don't see a point of a big event with the updates that have been rumored. 5 mins to introduce new Macs and 1 hour 55 mins to talk about the Nike Apple watch?

I'm fairly certain they release the new iPads at these events as well.
 

Abazigal

Contributor
Jul 18, 2011
19,551
21,993
Singapore
get ready for more and more dongles and hubs to attach because the machine for the pros has nothing but USB-C

Screen-Shot-2015-10-28-at-11.51.52-AM.png

That actually seems pretty cool. Does no one else see the utility of being able to plug all these into a single hub, then be able to disconnect all of them simultaneously at one go, rather than having to unplug each of them individually from your MacBook?

You probably intended to illustrate the opposite, but you just sold me on the value and the utility of going all in with USB C here.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Borin

SteveJobzniak

macrumors 6502
Dec 24, 2015
489
780
get ready for more and more dongles and hubs to attach because the machine for the pros has nothing but USB-C

Screen-Shot-2015-10-28-at-11.51.52-AM.png

Who are all these people that connect so many dangly, external peripherals to their laptops 24/7? Do you want a laptop or a desktop? Because it sounds like you want a desktop.

I have a MacBook Pro and there's nothing connected to the ports. Everything is inside the machine already; WiFi, bluetooth, storage, keyboard, trackpad, display, speakers, it's all internal. And if I briefly need to connect an SD card, well guess what? That's a 10 minute operation and then the cable is out of there again.

And if you truly want to hook up loads of things and work with it as if it was a desktop computer, then guess what? You're going to be using it on a desk anyway because you'll have so much **** hanging off the ports that you are going to need a desk to store it all on (otherwise it'd all fall off your lap). So plug in a single cable, which goes to a desktop USB hub, which connects all your desktop devices.

The few people who need to connect lots of devices already use USB hubs and a whole pile of peripherals on their desk. So this is literally a non-issue to 99% of people. Most people don't need the laptop's ports (or at most need 1 thing at a time), and have at most, connected an iPhone to their laptop to sync it. But now even that can be done wirelessly.

The only thing I hope is that they don't have the courage to remove the headphone port on the MacBook Pro. No need to make a laptop waterproof. ;)
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Borin

BeefCake 15

macrumors 68020
May 15, 2015
2,037
3,113
Maybe a weaker magnet wouldn't have too many accidental disconnects, but I know my dogs have successfully pulled my MacBook Air to the floor several times without the MagSafe connector pulling out.

It's not always successful to perform MagSafe Interuptus, takes a certain angle and timing
 

bjet767

Suspended
Oct 2, 2010
967
319
While bitcode can be used to enable Apple to recompile and send a program/app out with a a different processor it is really about 32/64 bit processsor compilation.

Recently Apple suggested to all developers for iOS to make sure their apps were updated for 64 bit processors, the most current ARM processors used by iPhones and iPads.

It appears that in the future bitcode could be used to allow Apple to choose which processor an OS X program will run on. However, currently there is no requirement that any program or app be compiled by the developer with bitcode enabled. Additionally OS X developers have not been pushed to update from 32 to 64 bit compiles.

It seems it may be a requirement in the near future for iOS and is currently mandatory for Watch OS and TV OS.

Apple's developer description: https://developer.apple.com/library...istributionGuide/AppThinning/AppThinning.html

And a more technical discussion in the subject:
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/30722606/what-does-enable-bitcode-do-in-xcode-7

So sorry again ARM hopes are dashed for many in the new MBPS.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: cerberusss

optyz

macrumors newbie
Oct 25, 2016
2
0
Since you seem to know so much about what Mac Pro users do with their machines, I'd like to know just how much 3D rendering you think I could do an an iMac before it melted. The Mac Pro isn't only used by professionals. Lots of us hobbyists use it also. Any workflow that needs cores & rams isn't being done with an iMac.

I can move my entire workflow from OSX to Windows and only spend $500 (Zbrush 5 - which I would have to spend regardless of platform; Pixelogic doesn't do upgrade pricing.) Everything else in my workflow comes with binaries for both platforms. It's no big deal - I work in the software, not the operating system, so moving to Windows 10 isn't problematic, it seems to be as reliable as OSX.

Like the pros, I am looking at how I will transition off of OSX and out of the Apple ecosystem.

That's what I've done a month ago. Still prefer Osx to Windwos 10 but as far as price and performance go... even if apple releases a new mac pro they will never compete. Let's say the release a up to date mac pro. Do I have to wait another 3 years for a top of the line machine? I can't afford that. With the PC I can upgrade almost anything whenever I see the need to get more cuda cores etc.
 

Keane16

macrumors 6502a
Dec 8, 2007
810
671
And yet it has been a ridiculously long time since any of the Mac machines have received a substantial update (going on 3 years for the Mac Pro), every single machine with the exception of the 12" MacBook is listed on the buyers guide as "Don't Buy" because of how long it's been since they've been updated,

The 13" was spec bumped last March. The 15" last May. It's hardly been forever. The internet would have you think it's been 4 years since the last update. Throw into the mix the issues Intel have had with Skylake (case in point the Surface Book). And here we are. Hopefully all Macs can get updated by year end.

Tim Cook is publicly saying stuff like "Why do you even need a computer anymore? iPad Pro does it all!"

He's never said such things. And even what he said doesn't mean what you've turned it into.

Macs and iOS devices meet different needs. Nobody expects app developers to use iPads and nobody should be suggesting my parents get a Mac. Use the right tool for your needs.

For a large slice, the majority, of Apple's users I completely agree they could get by with an iPad Pro. But there will be those which cannot. For them there's the Mac. As I said - Apple themselves create their software on Macs, they won't be killing them off any time soon.

and it's extremely likely that the only machine to get a bump this week is the MacBook Pro leaving everything else (including the ACTUAL most popular Mac for development - the Mini) to continue stagnating into obscurity.

Source? I'm not doubting you, but I'm not just going to believe the mini is the most popular development machine.

Also do you think Apple are not aware of declining sales due to lack of updates? The Mac is still over 12% of Apple's revenue. I'm sure the other machines will see updates when they're ready.

Meanwhile Apple is pouring cash into iOS and the Apple Watch, playing with cars, buying headphones, toying with the idea of making a television and prying into the media creation space (interested in buying Time Warner, expanding Apple Music), and putting their focus on absolutely everything OTHER than building computers.

Good, Apple have historically poured cash into lots of things - some of which never get released. Investigating cars doesn't mean the team that works on Macs disintegrates.

And I get value out of them other things, just as I do the Mac. In fact I get more value when Apple does them as they integrate them nicely into their product portfolio. For example, I used Spotify for a long time, but Apple Music is much nicer for me as it's on all my devices (Apple TV, Apple Watch Mac, iPad and iPhone).

Don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. The Mac is slowly being phased out of Apple's strategy. It's patently obvious. They'll keep it around just long enough to figure out how to do development directly on iOS (probably with some sort of iCloud-based compiler OR wider platform support for XCode - or both), and then they'll do away with it completely.

The other possibility is another architecture shift, and the delays are because they've been working out the kinks.

All possible. Ultimately users, developers, businesses... whoever, they migrate to what works best (easy, reliable, cost effective etc.). If Apple break the reputation they've built over years by releasing an inferior experience then they'll suffer. As much as people like to think Apple users are sheep and will buy anything. It's not true. There are enough Apple failures over the years that show that.

Whatever they release will not change anyone's life. That's just the state of Mac computing. Small refinement over revolution.
 

Mr. Dee

macrumors 603
Dec 4, 2003
5,990
12,828
Jamaica
"The fact that even Pixar doesn't use Macs anymore is telling."

Doesn't tell me anything except for the fact that Pixar doesn't use Macs. Nothing else beyond that.
Your idea of Pro and Post production must be filming pictures of your cat at 4k to upload to YouTube and Facebook. Hollywood productions houses are using off the shelf components and Linux with in house developed video editing software. Apple was good at one point. What I think scared a lot of them to go Linux and their own LOB apps was Apple's aggressive acquisition in the 2000's. At one point they owned Shake then killed. That probably was a nightmare for a lot of production houses.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tompkinson

Cartossin

macrumors member
Apr 18, 2016
37
65
Your idea of Pro and Post production must be filming pictures of your cat at 4k to upload to YouTube and Facebook. Hollywood productions houses are using off the shelf components and Linux with in house developed video editing software. Apple was good at one point. What I think scared a lot of them to go Linux and their own LOB apps was Apple's aggressive acquisition in the 2000's. At one point they owned Shake then killed. That probably was a nightmare for a lot of production houses.

Yes and isn't macOS Market share growing still?
 

bjet767

Suspended
Oct 2, 2010
967
319
Let's say the release a up to date mac pro. Do I have to wait another 3 years for a top of the line machine? I can't afford that. With the PC I can upgrade almost anything whenever I see the need to get more cuda cores etc.

On the surface your post may make sense, but digging deeper it really doesn't.

3D rendering does not require the latest machine or CPU and if it did the movie houses would go broke on constantly updating their devices. Also I doubt their primary machines are store-bought MBPs

Additionally if you update every year to the latest top-end Windows based PC you are essentially spending the equal of buying a new MBP. Dell XPS 15 16 gig memory, 512 gig drive $1699.99 i7-6700HQ Quad Core (6M Cache, up to 3.5 GHz) (Skylake for you Kaby drummers).

I would agree the current Micosoft Surface Book is a better machine than the current MBP, but will Microsoft update it every year? One problem, it doesn't run OSX and I wonder if anyone has run OSX well in a VM on the Surface.

Now if you are talking a desktop compared to a Mac Pro, well of course you can easily replace components, add memory and swap CPU (if they have same socket and are compatible with the board chip set) at a cost far less than a Mac Pro, but we all know that.

Oh I also see you are "newbie" here on Mac Rumors. Welcome, but if you are here just for the sport of Apple Bashing, well get in line many have led the way before you.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Tsaksonakis
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.