Arstech Article about the Wii Processor specs

Discussion in 'Games' started by Archmagination, Oct 31, 2006.

  1. Archmagination macrumors regular

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    #1
    Broadway

    Though I actually found the Discuss link(Linking to their MessageBoard) way more entertaining.. Some of the posters there seemed to get 'it'.

    Those people screaming that the Wii is too underpowered, that its graphics are not HD make me laugh. I just don't see the crucial difference right now in graphics.. I have played 720p and 1080i games before on a HDTV and while the graphics were amazing the difference between them and Residen't Evil 4 played on that same HDTV was barely enough to worth noting.. sure RE4 didn't look as good but the graphics were close enough that it didn't really matter.

    Its gotten to the point of diminishing returns on graphics.. Graphics have gotten to the point where the human eye won't be able to tell difference. Any resolution above 720p is actually pointless.. the human eye can't tell the difference(That is if the graphics are utilized properly)
     
  2. Chone macrumors 65816

    Chone

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    #2
    Maybe on consoles but on PCs anyone can tell the difference between 1024x768, 1280x1024, 1600x1200, etc and graphics have a LOT of room to improve, like I said at least on PCs, this whole High Def craze is driving me crazy... it can become so confusing its just resolutions!
     
  3. Aegelward macrumors 6502

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    #3
    i'm slightly confused, i was sure that nintendo themselves have stated that the processor will be clocked at 1.4ghz when listing the specs
     
  4. GFLPraxis macrumors 604

    GFLPraxis

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    #4

    Nintendo has never listed the specs...
     
  5. Supa_Fly macrumors 68030

    Supa_Fly

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    #5
    I never played RE4 - Too gory for my tastes, but on the GCN or is it NGC, the Metriod Prime Hunters 2 is INCREDIBLE!

    Graphics are incredible! just take a dive into the water worlds and them walk out .... outstanding, how about mist, oh yeah baby!

    SOUND is truely incredible.

    All this talk about graphics; has blinded everyone into buying the XBOX 360, PS3. When you goto the movies its not the graphics that surprise you is it? The video resolution hasnt changed for over 30 years, so then why do ppl keep going? Plot, great writing, all that is there; but its SOUND that truely submerses you.

    Case it point.

    Just think of some classic Horror, Action Movies, or SciFi movies. The latter two I'm sure you can remember the images but its the SOUND you'll never forget.

    HORROR.
    Jason (everybody knows the mask and the theme track when they hear it, but can anyone remember how the blood flowed on any victim or remember the exact shape of the blade? Doubtful)

    Freddie Kruger (Sure everybody remembered the glove & thought they knew it until word came out there were more than 13 versions all uniquely different. But everybody remembers .... 1-2 Freddie's coming for you, 3-4 better _ _ _!)

    Most young teens may not remember Alfred Hitchcock movies but I'll bet they know the theme to the movie Psycho. or that eerie sound of the pending kill. THAT movie you NEVER SEE THE kill in the bathroom! Sound and lacking visuals from a tight budget left it to the imagination!

    Star Wars. Difficult to explain here. Sure everyone remembers the weapon of choice, the lightsaber. The colours and cool visuals of it moving where ok (watch those scenes with your ears plugged you'll remember the sound but its different). However it was DEFINATELY the SOUND that made them killer! Escpecially in the new movies Eps 1-3! Sound was greatly improved but the overall original never really changed much. The Landspeader! Laser Canons.

    More, on Star Wars. Ever wonder why geeks get sucked into that trilogy? I never could understand it until I watched the final ep3 where Obi Wan slices Anakin's legs off and scolds, cyring out in pain seemingly exhausted. Think back to the voice of Obi Wan when he's at lukes uncle's house the very first time, talking about Dark Vader. If you have that movie fast forward JUST to that scene, and play it back with you EYES SHUT TIGHT. You can hear the admiration, love, disappointment and even sorrow in Obi Wan's voice! That actor was incredible! This alone got me interested in who Darth Vader was - told me he had true power before seeing it in Empire.

    But there you have it. Classics that didnt do much for graphics, but it was the SOUND that captivates ppl and keeps them coming back again & again.
    :cool: ;) :p
     
  6. MRU macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #6
    So you complain graphics have blinded everyone and point to sound as being as important.

    True, but........... xbox 360 & ps3 offer dolby digital 5.1 - the wii only pro-logic

    The audible experience on 360 & PS3 will be superior as you get truly positional sound reflecting what is on and off your screen.

    Wii like cube can have great music/sound but it is somewhat watered down significantly by its lack of proper DD and positional sound.


    So your argument has only highlighted another deficiency in the wii hardware. Well done..
     
  7. iJaz macrumors 6502a

    iJaz

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    #7
    Super Mario Brothers on NES didn't need no dolby digital/pro logic/whatever, and we all still love the music and sound effects to that game, right!? ;)
     
  8. MRU macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #8
    But on a 2D game do you need surround ? ;)

    I was just busting his long winded hypothesis :D
     
  9. tominated macrumors 68000

    tominated

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    #9
    it's not about the sound or graphics, it's about having fun and killing time. just my 2 cents.
     
  10. takao macrumors 68040

    takao

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    #10
    well except that neither 360 or ps3 has a speaker in the controller ;)

    sure low quality but it helps immersion too ...


    that aside surround sound is kinda a matter of taste .. i know plenty of people who simply had to have it and i've watched movies etc there but i never really got into surround sound ...i always found it more distracting than immersive ... good music helps a lot more than adding surround... at least that's my opinion .. a lot of people differ
     
  11. MRU macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #11
    I love it, when playing a game like condemned, splinter-cell or ghost recon, you can hear if an NPC is coming up behind you, when playing a racing game it gives you a better indication if there is a car right up your rudder rather than having to press a button to see whats behind you, leaving you vunerable to slaming into somthing in front of you.

    Walking through a wooded orchard / forest and hearing the birds fly all around you, or in the depths of a lair and hearing the footsteps of a goblin echoing down caverns and enveloping you in sound. Walking past lanterns and hearing them as you pass go from one set of discrete speakers to the other.

    Stolling across huge terrain landscapes in a mech, hearing his every nut & bolt jingle around you, with the faint sound of gunfire positionally rattling and humming in say your rear speakers, and as you turn around and aproach the sound moves around with you. It makes the experience that much more tangible.

    Sure in some games its not used greatly, a 3D fighter for example, it makes no difference, but for many games I find it really immerses me.

    A game like GRAW is a completely different experience on a big screen with DD than it is without it.


    Dolby Pro-Logic 2 is alright, as it was alright on the cube, but I'd rather be playing Resident Evil 4 with full 5.1/6.1 DD, putting proper sound it the correct place around leon rather than the mixed guess work pro-logic provides.
     
  12. takao macrumors 68040

    takao

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    #12
    well that's your opinion ... personally i would rather look back in a racing game ... after all that's more realistic than hearing the other car, isn't it ;)
    i like the nerve wrecking decision about how and when to look back (at least when the game is new... it gets routine sooner or later) ...

    it's a matter of taste ... i played games and watched movies with surround at other people houses quite a few times and i never felt "boy i'm missing something" when i went back home and played a game

    perhaps it's because i'm coming from PC gaming (i'm a big strategy/tactics/simulation buff) where surround has been around since a long time and for a lot of people it doesn't play a big role since it hit a certain level of quality somewhere during the 90ties
     
  13. Dagless macrumors Core

    Dagless

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    #13
    I can't wait for the machine that's going to play Metroid Prime 3 and Twilight Princess :)
     
  14. benpatient macrumors 68000

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    #14
    even Nintendo knows that better graphics can be a better experience. Why else would they have re-done Mario 1, 2, and 3 when they included it with Mario World on the SNES?

    Identical gameplay + better graphics = more enjoyable experience.

    Nintendo knows this.

    Identical gameplay + double/triple the resolution and texture resolution = more enjoyable experience.

    Go play Splinter Cell on an XBox.

    Then load up the same game on a PC. Use an XBox controller if you want.

    The difference between 640x480 and 1600x1200 in any game where precision or aiming or looking or any of that is important cannot be reduced to a question of "opinion."

    As for looking back in a racing game being "more realistic" i'd have to disagree. If you've ever been on a racetrack, you'd know that often you CAN hear the cars around you, but that it's not enough to make a decision, just that it's enough to know someone is right behind you.

    Since a game without surround sound places the sound of the cars behind you in the speakers that are in front of you, I'd say that is the least realistic option available. Would be just as realistic to have no sound at all.

    the "look back" button on racing games is completely unrealistic. The view it shows you isn't available in real life unless you're on a bike or in a convertible. Some games do it "right" and make you drive from a POV inside the car (which they have to render, and lots of companies hate having to do that), and they make you use the mirrors, which is "realistic" more than anything else is.

    Since the rearview mirror is usually so small because the POV is essentially the driver's headrest, it would be cool if the "look behind" button was used to momentarily "zoom" the rearview mirror to take up more of the screen.

    If anything, PC gamers in general appreciate the benefits of surround sound more than console gamers, precisely because the tech has been more mature on PCs for longer. Racing games ARE better with surround sound. 1st person shooters are totally better with surround sound. 2d strategy games like starcraft offer a new level of information to people with surround sound on their machines. You can tell when one of your units is being attacked and where it is in general. I used it ALL the time.
     
  15. zero2dash macrumors 6502a

    zero2dash

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    #15
    /sorry in advance for the rant/ :D

    IMO it's all about the gameplay, I could give a crap what the graphics look like. Graphics do add to the proverbial "big picture" but graphics are not the entire "big picture". Same with gameplay, although great gameplay will keep you along for the ride whereas graphics with a garbage storyline and garbage controls (ie 'gameplay') will not save any game whatsoever. Maybe it's because I was a Saturn fan and I though the Saturn was the best 32-bit console despite the fact that it couldn't do 3d for crap. But 2d - the Saturn KILLED the Playstation (especially if you knew someone like myself who was heavy into importing 2d fighting games). But even though the Saturn had garbage 3d compared to the competition, that didn't matter because several of the 3d titles on the Saturn (like NiGHTS, Burning Rangers, and the Panzer Dragoon series) had better gameplay and storylines than 100 Playstation titles combined.

    I'm sure many of you have played games your whole lives and some of you haven't. I'm one of the "entire life" guys. I've seen practically everything that is possible with graphics to the point where I don't care about graphics anymore. (Or "dimensional sound", before anyone brings up that point.) When you've played games for 20+ years like I have, you don't look for "the prettiest new title", you look for something new and innovative that isn't like the hundreds upon thousands of games you've already played. That's the key group Nintendo's going after; not the "nongamer" crowd like they claim. I think they're standing up and saying "here, this is something new that you've never done before - and you're gonna love it" and that's why I'm buying a Wii.

    Here's a question for all you people who think that graphics make the game/system.

    If you like action movies - did you hate every other action movie before the Matrix? Since the Matrix (at its core) is an action movie just like every other great action movie I've seen in my life (including greats like Big Trouble In Little China), do you now think that an older movie like BTILC is bad because it doesn't have CGI or special effects? Maybe you do, but I don't. Why? Because BTILC is still a great movie with a good cast, good fight scenes, and decent effects for its time. It doesn't have to have "bullet time" or crumbling walls and columns for me to enjoy it (although it did have the crumbling Buddha statues scene at the end when Lo Pan took the knife to the head).

    What about games? Do you now hate every 2d Mario Brothers or Zelda after playing their 3d versions? Would you just write off the great gameplay and storylines just because Mario is made up of pixels instead of polygons?

    Graphics have their place in gaming. But I'm pretty uninterested in the other two consoles (at least in terms of "what I'll buy first") because that's practically all they offer - graphics (and sound). Been there, done that. I love my Xbox but anyone with a free unbiased mind can't argue the fact that the Xbox turned into a FPS console. Don't get me wrong, I love FPS and I still love my Xbox. But I want something different. Something that controls different or offers something else than regular control schemes and flashier graphics.

    ...just my two cents.
     
  16. Dagless macrumors Core

    Dagless

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    #16
    You know what giggles me thoroughly, you're going to be spending £450 on a PS3 or £200-300 for a DirectX 10 graphics card and games still don't look real. Actually you'll be spending £450 on a console that is about to be made graphically redundant when DX10 does come out.

    All this for the consoles that pride themselves on power. Moores Law, in your face.
     
  17. MRU macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #17

    Youll be spending more than £300 on one of the new DX10 card's - your looking at more like £450... :eek: And were talking 450watt's of power to power them :eek: :eek:

    Also the 360 ATI solution DOES support some of the DX10 trickery, the PS3's doesnt, but then the wii's barley supports itself ;) :D

    At the end of the day all things are important in making a game great
    graphics, gameplay & sound. Higher res doesnt always mean graphics are better, sometimes they just highlight the flaws, just like how CRT screens & interlacing hides horrendous AA problems which are apparent on other technonlogy (LCD).

    People arguing graphics arent as important as gameplay and sound more important than graphics are all missing the point. All the elements when combined with the right spark create a marvel whether it be 2D, 3D or I-dont-give-a-****-D..

    All those aspects are NOT mutually exclusive people.

    The Wii will have killer games
    The PS3 will have killer games
    The 360 will have killer games

    However these will be like diamonds in the rough and you'll have to search through a deluge of **** on all formats to find them.
     
  18. Supa_Fly macrumors 68030

    Supa_Fly

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    #18
    Having Pro Logic Sound or surround sound doesnt gaurantee the gamer thats playing games will have a better experience playing the games. If the games are lacking in great audio production - lacking creative sound that can enhance the game - its useless.

    > I tried to isolate the lightsaber because even with 7 speakers listening to it it made your ears perk up!

    > I'm looking for games to be more advanced in the sounds they use not just use 7+ speakers arbitrarily. ie Resident Evil 4 SHOULD have the zombies mumbles , dragging feat sounds SEEM as if they're creaping up on you behind your left ear. If a player leaves the seen of a battle - say 1 character emptying his gun while being swarmed by say 40 zombies, behind your right ear you should hear that last clip sound off, with the ripping of clothes, the desperate cry's of sorrow of imminent death!

    > ie ... This is NOT utilized with the XBOX's new 360 prowess. Game industry has lacked on this front instead concentrating on players sitting at their TV's just 3 feet away.

    THIS is what I mean about captivating sound in game play.
    Dont get me wrong .... I'd love to play the PS3 dragon game. :D
     
  19. Dagless macrumors Core

    Dagless

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    #19
    You already can.
     
  20. MRU macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #20

    oo those on foot levels of rogue-squadron 2 were amazingly appauling, seriously bad.... really let an otherwise decent game down for me.
     
  21. Dagless macrumors Core

    Dagless

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  22. zero2dash macrumors 6502a

    zero2dash

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    #22
    I generally agree, but again I think gameplay is 1000x more important than the graphics. I think that people have better memories based off of a memorable story or gameplay rather than 'how good that game looked' that they just finished playing.

    Perfect example of a game that had great graphics for its time but the story and gameplay were crap - The Bouncer. One of the most overhyped games I've ever seen, and it failed miserably to deliver. Then again, this is Square we are talking about, the same people who came up with Ehrgheiz and also the same people who feature commercials for their games that consist of nothing but CG (and no actual gameplay footage). :rolleyes:

    There's no question - all 3 systems will have games that everyone should own; it'll always be that way with every system. I just think it's a real cop-out when people write off the Wii because it has "slightly better than Gamecube" graphics.
     
  23. greatdevourer macrumors 68000

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    #23
    Hehe, marketing like this:
    [​IMG]

    For what actually looks like this:
    [​IMG]

    Although at least the FFXIII cutscenes and game footage don't look all that different
     
  24. ChrisBrightwell macrumors 68020

    ChrisBrightwell

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    #24
    This is laughably short-sighted.

    On a 30" display? Sure, you might be right. But what about the new 100" plasma? Or a HD theater projector?

    Have you been to a DLP cinema lately? Notice the "screen door effect", whereby you can actually see the lines between pixels? Stepping up to 1080p from 720p will effectively minimize that effect and, on many screens, eliminate it.

    That said ... I really couldn't care less about HD gaming. I still play nethack on a regular basis and think that the SNES was the pinnacle of modern gaming. Call me old. :)
     
  25. Abulia macrumors 68000

    Abulia

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    #25
    These threads are always fun to read, if nothing else to listen to the people who've clearly not had any extended time playing games in 1080i on a large display in 5.1 digital sound. :D

    "It's not abougt the GRAPHIGZZZ!"

    Good gameplay and outstanding graphics are not mutually exclusive.

    They can -- and do -- exist side-by-side.


    Settling for one at the total expense of another is just short-sighted, in my opinion.
     

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