peharri said:
When you'll play a game as heavy as UT... then, performance wise, isn't it for the best to close as much as possible? I know I will!
Perhaps reconsider your working method, no? If possible, Again, I know I will!
[ dim. ]
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Boot Camp and Mac Game Developers?
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
When you'll play a game as heavy as UT... then, performance wise, isn't it for the best to close as much as possible? I know I will!
Perhaps reconsider your working method, no? If possible, Again, I know I will!
[ dim. ]
Will Apple Adopt Windows?
Has anyone read John C. Dvorak article on PC magazine ( March 7 , 2006 page 91 ) ...
I love macs but I am getting scared of what might happen in the long run i.e. "....apple will ditch its own OS for Microsoft Windows....."
This is too scary
Has anyone read John C. Dvorak article on PC magazine ( March 7 , 2006 page 91 ) ...
I love macs but I am getting scared of what might happen in the long run i.e. "....apple will ditch its own OS for Microsoft Windows....."
This is too scary
from apple [The public beta of Boot Camp is available and is preview software licensed for use on a trial basis for a limited time. The final version of Boot Camp will be available as a feature in the upcoming Mac OS X version 10.5 Leopard. ]bhibbert said:
maybe apple will release another beta. maybe not. They want you to buy Leopard, so they might hold off all the features till then.
monster620ie said:Has anyone read John C. Dvorak article on PC magazine ( March 7 , 2006 page 91 ) ...
I love macs but I am getting scared of what might happen in the long run i.e. "....apple will ditch its own OS for Microsoft Windows....."
This is too scary
theres no sane reason that Apple would ditch its OS. there has never been since the beginning. I don't see why people are connecting that Boot Camp came and OSX left.
The future that I see is that Boot Camp came and teased PC users into Apple by offering them a way to use both, meanwhile snatching up all the unsatisfied Microsoft PC users, creating a stronger legion of OSX fans. Developers see the shift. OSX begins its quest into the mainstream. Later down the road Boot Camp becomes a useless feature.
and really, if booting to Microsoft strips all the life out of OSX gaming, its cool. Maybe Apple has thought this out and sees the future of gaming going elsewhere. the console gaming market is a monster. Maybe the future of MS PC is dead. and their only future is gaming. lol. makes sense to me.
Using a MS PC will always be like shopping at Walmart. There will be millions of people that find it satisfying. The other crowd hopefully will have an affordable option to not compute in such a boring and unthoughtout environment.
Cause for concern
I don't know about many of you other Mac users, but I certainly didn't buy a Mac so that I could use Windows or any programs associated with it.
Hard to imagine that any software developers will have much of an incentive to develop software specifically for the Mac or OS X if end users can simply boot Windows and run the programs. Doesn't bode well for those of us with G5 and older machines.
I imagine Apple is taking this approach in order to increase their market share for Apple hardware, but where does this leave OS X? Too few Windows users have switched over to OS X previously, what makes Apple think they'll switch just for the hardware?
Seems like my favorite rebel company is not thinking differently anymore.
I don't know about many of you other Mac users, but I certainly didn't buy a Mac so that I could use Windows or any programs associated with it.Hard to imagine that any software developers will have much of an incentive to develop software specifically for the Mac or OS X if end users can simply boot Windows and run the programs. Doesn't bode well for those of us with G5 and older machines.
I imagine Apple is taking this approach in order to increase their market share for Apple hardware, but where does this leave OS X? Too few Windows users have switched over to OS X previously, what makes Apple think they'll switch just for the hardware?
Seems like my favorite rebel company is not thinking differently anymore.
excalibur313 said:
Tell that to my PC which sits next to my Mac. I built it specifically for gaming because, as wonderful as OS X is, its implimentation of OpenGL is slower than Window's implimentation of OpenGL and DirectX. Sad fact of life but its the one advantage my PC has over my Mac.
All you mac users upset about this should look at the percentage of both XP & OS users. This move is great for the consumer. Let's face it games on the mac suck. I've been so hesitant numerous times about buying a pc to play games. Not only games but graphic apps such as 2D and 3D apps are much faster. The fastest mac graphic card in the market couldn't compete against the PC until this day!!!!!!
PowerPC Rules said:
its not just the hardware. before when you purchased an intel mac, you get Tiger and a nice computer. now you get Tiger, a nice computer, and Windows Boot option.
Apple trying to think different is getting Windows users to switch to Apple computers, which gives them Tiger, a nice computer, and Windows. 3 powerful things that could get Apple some more cash flow.
You have to remember.... Apple is keeping OSX from booting on a generic PC. right?
Doctor Q said:
Braindead. It just got a lot easier for Mac users to use other operating systems on their hardware.
So what. The reason they use OS X is not the hardware, but the operating system.
This has been proven with sales of Mac Hardware increasing since Intel, mainly due to the fact that Intel must innovate to compete in the PC space against AMD. IBM wants the server markets. With Intel making the efforts to port their compilers to OS X and other advancements through joint ventures, it makes it that much easier for 3rd party peripheral and add-on card vendors to coordinate with Apple and provide driver support.
This ability to have the latest in add-ons with their favorite OS will only expand Apple's market share.
It will boil down to OS X vs. XP in not just the consumer space, but the enterprise space as well.
Any game vendor who can't get off their asses to port their games to OS X as it market will continue to grow is truly dense.
What they really want from Apple is a set of APIs targeted specifically for Game Developers and to have OpenGL 2 graphics cards ASAP.
WWDC hasn't even arrived and these pukes are whining already.
Think of this
Assume that Apple knows (now with Boot Camp) we all are gonna play games more often. Windows games for all I care...
Assume this, ... Shouldn't Apple give us better Graphic Cards then? Or at least the possibility to upgrade? (listening Apple?)
For all I know, Apple isn't doing well at this point. Or am I wrong? (No I am not wrong )
What do you think?
[ dim. ]
Assume that Apple knows (now with Boot Camp) we all are gonna play games more often. Windows games for all I care...
Assume this, ... Shouldn't Apple give us better Graphic Cards then? Or at least the possibility to upgrade? (listening Apple?)
For all I know, Apple isn't doing well at this point. Or am I wrong? (No I am not wrong
)What do you think?
[ dim. ]
Release WINE Versions...
The game developers can counter this threat by releasing WINE versions of games that will run with Crossover Office's solutions to play in MacOS X on Intel Macs. Sure, that leaves PPC gamers out in the cold, but they weren't going to use the MacBoot solution anyways, so it's a different market than the one they're worried about losing here.
The game developers can counter this threat by releasing WINE versions of games that will run with Crossover Office's solutions to play in MacOS X on Intel Macs. Sure, that leaves PPC gamers out in the cold, but they weren't going to use the MacBoot solution anyways, so it's a different market than the one they're worried about losing here.
They are thinking different. Different from the old/irrational "computing as a religion" and "being different just for the sake of being different" sort of mentality which made all of us Mac users look like a bunch of cultish freaks to many others. That is one of the things I disliked as those of us who looked at desktop computing environments from a rational perspective (and didn't care about participating in these silly platform/OS wars) as useful multipurpose tools (and using the best tools to get the job done regardless of platform and operating system instead of using a "hammer" for everything) all ended up being generalized into that same group.PowerPC Rules said:
Apple isn't assuming anything. All they are doing is providing the enabling technology and doing it in an Apple-like fashion to allow running other x86-based operating systems for those who want to be able to do so. What people do with it Apple really doesn't care and with regards to Windows, they are only providing the drivers for XP in order to make that user experience as pleasant as possible and to not make the Mac look crappier than it has to when it is running XP (else all you are going to get is the detractors coming out in force saying look at how much the Mac sucks running Windows).minipri said:
minipri said:Assume that Apple knows (now with Boot Camp) we all are gonna play games more often. Windows games for all I care...
Assume this, ... Shouldn't Apple give us better Graphic Cards then? Or at least the possibility to upgrade? (listening Apple?)
For all I know, Apple isn't doing well at this point. Or am I wrong? (No I am not wrong
What do you think?
[ dim. ]
Shouldn't Microsoft give us better graphics drivers? It's up to the driver manufacturers to get on board and work with I/OKit. They can't bitch too much since it's written in C++.
Apple is ripe with cash. They are expanding their markets and the shares in everyone of them.
Graphics
Okay, Apple isn't assuming anything. But... the grahic cards on Mac aren't to write home about. They are different then the one's for PC right? When the Intel Powermac will arrive, I can't imagine that I can pick up any graphic card designed for use with Windows and throw it into my beloved machine. ...Or will I?
So again, they are different. Isn't that the biggest problem?
And I know that Apple really doesn't care for us gamers, and don't care how we will use Windows on Boot Camp anyway but isn't it about time they start to care?
I mean, I'll buy a Mac for God knows how much $$'s ('s in my case) and all people can say is: "Oh you want to play a game from time to time?? Sorry! Then you should buy a friggin' XBox, PSX or full branded PC!"
And then I'll say: "NO! I bought myself a Mac and I wanna use it! No ugly hardware in my apartment please. Why do I have to buy a console anyway? I don't like playing that way.
Am I so high demanded?
[ dim. ]
mdriftmeyer said:
Okay, Apple isn't assuming anything. But... the grahic cards on Mac aren't to write home about. They are different then the one's for PC right? When the Intel Powermac will arrive, I can't imagine that I can pick up any graphic card designed for use with Windows and throw it into my beloved machine. ...Or will I?
So again, they are different. Isn't that the biggest problem?
And I know that Apple really doesn't care for us gamers, and don't care how we will use Windows on Boot Camp anyway but isn't it about time they start to care?
I mean, I'll buy a Mac for God knows how much $$'s ('s in my case) and all people can say is: "Oh you want to play a game from time to time?? Sorry! Then you should buy a friggin' XBox, PSX or full branded PC!"
And then I'll say: "NO! I bought myself a Mac and I wanna use it! No ugly hardware in my apartment please. Why do I have to buy a console anyway? I don't like playing that way.
Am I so high demanded?
[ dim. ]
I think the best point is the one about mac games being more expensive than their Windows counterparts. That is, to me, the single biggest obstacle for mac gaming as it is, let alone after boot camp and intel macs have been around a while.
I can wait a while for a port, I can put up with performance not being quite as good (I have a nice machine anyway) but when you add those points to a higher price tag, it's just silly. I'm surprised Aspyr and co make any money at all from mac games, but I maybe their prices mean they only need to sell a couple of copies!
What mac gaming really needs imho is good, new, OS X-exclusive titles, instead of trying to compete with consoles and the PC, which it can't.
On the subject of boot camp more generally, I see it as a big marketing plus point for potential 1st-time/returning mac purchasers, not so much current mac users/upgraders (apart from perhaps some Virtual PC users). It means windows users protect their investment in windows software, have a fall-back if they hate OS X and yes, games are part of that.
I can wait a while for a port, I can put up with performance not being quite as good (I have a nice machine anyway) but when you add those points to a higher price tag, it's just silly. I'm surprised Aspyr and co make any money at all from mac games, but I maybe their prices mean they only need to sell a couple of copies!
What mac gaming really needs imho is good, new, OS X-exclusive titles, instead of trying to compete with consoles and the PC, which it can't.
On the subject of boot camp more generally, I see it as a big marketing plus point for potential 1st-time/returning mac purchasers, not so much current mac users/upgraders (apart from perhaps some Virtual PC users). It means windows users protect their investment in windows software, have a fall-back if they hate OS X and yes, games are part of that.
bigwig said:
The argument could be for a growing OS X user-base Vs a declining Windows user-base. If that's what happens. A Windows user who buys a mac but doesn't use OS X is presumably just another Windows user who happened to buy a mac instead of a Dell or whatever. But if only a few of those try out OS X and decide they like it better, that's more incentive for developers to make apps for OS X, because there are more potential sales than there might have been.
Apple seem to be betting that they will win more OS X users from boot camp etc than lose market share to Windows on their hardware. I think that's fantastic, and I agree with them - part of all this to me is that it looks like they're putting their faith in their product, that they believe in OS X enough to win out when Windows is installed on the same machine and end users can directly compare the whole experience of using both OSs on a level playing field.
Rebooting is a drag
The whole idea of rebooting back and forth makes it not worthwhile for gaming or even more serious applications that I would use frequently. Having to reboot makes it only worthwhile for something like tax software where you do it once in a while. Except that I bagged tax software and just do it by hand now so even that isn't a good enough reason to reboot.
One of the joys of the Mac is not having to reboot so often. Our family has several Macs and we reboot them once in a blue moon. I've heard Windows users complain about rebooting several times per day. Major hassle.
What I want is virtualization. I just wan to be able to run any software - not hassle with Windows. I want MacOS X, Windows, Classic, PalmOS, Unix/Linux and it all to feel like the Mac.
The whole idea of rebooting back and forth makes it not worthwhile for gaming or even more serious applications that I would use frequently. Having to reboot makes it only worthwhile for something like tax software where you do it once in a while. Except that I bagged tax software and just do it by hand now so even that isn't a good enough reason to reboot.
One of the joys of the Mac is not having to reboot so often. Our family has several Macs and we reboot them once in a blue moon. I've heard Windows users complain about rebooting several times per day. Major hassle.
What I want is virtualization. I just wan to be able to run any software - not hassle with Windows. I want MacOS X, Windows, Classic, PalmOS, Unix/Linux and it all to feel like the Mac.