Bootcamp 4.0 allows users to create USB Installer?

Discussion in 'Mac OS X Lion (10.7)' started by seong, Aug 3, 2011.

  1. macrumors 65816

    seong

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    #1
    This is directly from Apple's support page:

    Support for the Windows 7 ISO installer
    Install Windows with an installation disc you provide or—on some Mac computers—with a USB flash drive that contains a Windows 7 ISO image downloaded from Microsoft. The Boot Camp Assistant helps you burn the image to the flash drive.

    So, I'm guessing that if you have the .iso image file on the flash drive, bootcamp assistant will help you make a Windows 7 installer USB for Macs!
    I'm going to give it a shot right now and see how it works.
     
  2. macrumors 65816

    parapup

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2006
    #2
    Depends on your hardware whether that'll work or not - my 2010 MBP will not boot from Windows USB installer no matter what due to firmware issues.
     
  3. thread starter macrumors 65816

    seong

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    #3
    Yes. I've been Googling around for about 10 minutes, and here are the results:

    1) There are two Boot Camp Assistant app version. 4.0 for all Macs with Optical drive, and 4.0.1 with Macs without Optical Drive.
    2) Macs with Optical Drive, which has 4.0, WILL NOT be able to make or boot from the USB.
    3) Macs without Optical Drive can install Windows 7 from DVD (using Apple's Superdrive USB) or create bootable USB using a 4GB or 8GB USB and .iso file. However, Windows 7 Install USB created using 4.0.1 will not work with Macs with Optical Drive.

    This is just sad......just sad.....
    Seirously, Apple should have just allowed the Macs with optical drive to be able to create and install Windows 7 from USB. I do not have any access to blank DVDs at the moment, but only USBs (plenty of 8GBs lying around.) I wish it would just work.
     
  4. macrumors 6502

    SideStepSociety

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2011
    Location:
    Roblin, Manitoba
    #4
    Install rEFIt, install Windows via USB drive, remove rEFIt. :)
     
  5. macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2008
    Location:
    Auckland, New Zealand
    #5
    This is cool to see. I wasted a bunch of time trying to make a bootable USB for Windows for my MacBook Air, and ended up using a friend's external optical.

    Hardware dependencies for such things are weird though, the idea that a different version opens based on hardware - like Finder doesn't even show the entry for AirDrop in preferences if your hardware can't do it, almost scarily efficient but can be confusing hmmm.
     
  6. thread starter macrumors 65816

    seong

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    #6
    rEFIt doesn't even work. I was successful on installing it under Snow Leopard, but not Lion.
     
  7. macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2009
    Location:
    SA, Australia
    #7
    Thats crap it will not work on Mac's with Optical Drive's hope this is not the direction apple is taking. (more locked down and controlled) i hope they release and update so we can do this.
     
  8. macrumors 6502

    SideStepSociety

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2011
    Location:
    Roblin, Manitoba
    #8
    Well, this is kinda complicated, but here's a possibility. Backup current Lion installation, wipe HD, partition HD for Windows, install SL/run from external drive, install rEFIt, install Windows, wipe SL partition if applicable, clean install Lion. Or upgrade, whatever.
     
  9. thread starter macrumors 65816

    seong

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    #9
    I thought about doing that, but that would be time consuming.
    Backup - 0min (assuming that you backup regularly)
    Snow Leopard - 40min
    Bootcamp - 30min
    Lion (Restore from backup) - 30min
    Total - Approximately 1 hour and 40 min.

    If I had a spare DVD that I can use, then I would definitely go that route since it would take about an hour to install from the DVD. Meh, I'll give this long route a try and see how that works.
     
  10. macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2011
    #10
    I can report rEFIt is correctly working on Lion. In fact I have double booted my 13'' Unibody MacBook with Lion and Windows 7. Sadly I had a hard time making my usb drive bootable. After that, rEFIt booted from it with no issues. Plugged and booted, voilà. To make a bootable usb, in case you are wondering, you need to have access to a Windows 7 machine, even VM will do. With windows 7 usb dvd download tool it's possible to make a bootable usb drive from a (legit) iso copy of W7. That's it. ;)
     
  11. thread starter macrumors 65816

    seong

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    #11
    Just for your information, I've used that tool for quite a while now. I've installed Windows 7 using a single USB on more than 30 machines. It works completely fine. The problem is rEFIt. Yes, it works fine, but installing Win 7 from USB on Lion using rEFIt is, somewhat complicated.

    One weird thing that happened was, I downgraded to Snow Leoaprd, installed rEFIt, rebooted twice to get it working, partitioned using Boot Camp Assistant 3.0.4, plugged in the USB, rebooted, and booted from USB. And.......there it was, that devil underscore, blinking like forever. I left it on for 2 hours, and nothing happened.
     
  12. shatteringlass, Aug 4, 2011
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2011

    macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2011
    #12
    rEFIt has a strange behaviour in the sense that it won't work until second reboot since its installation. I encountered the same issue as you but eventually got ahead. Installed rEFIt normally on Lion like you would on SL and then rebooted twice. On second reboot rEFIt boot menu will eventually show up allowing you to choose boot device. If you plugged a bootable usb drive it will show up in that menu. If you have prepared the drive with the app mentioned above, then you won't fail. Although if it does not show up in the menu, try rebooting first. It happens, sadly.

    P.s. I forgot to say the essential: if you installed Lion on your machine, you'll likely to find it impossible to install Windows. That's because Lion adds another partition called Recovery HD which will grow the number of partition on your disc to 3 (at least), that is EFI, System, Recovery. When you Boot-camp your drive, then another partition adds to that list, overcoming the max number of primary partitions. Therefore Windows will refuse to install. To proceed you'll have to erase and then merge Recovery HD at your own risk, decreasing the number of partitions to 2+bootcamp partition, which is an acceptable number.

    If I were you I'd just update to Lion. Apart from the merging thing, it was smooth easy for me. You get the avantage of a clean system instead of the mess of updating.
     
  13. thread starter macrumors 65816

    seong

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    #13
    I had no problem whatsoever when I installed Windows XP and 7 from DVD using Bootcamp Assistant. At the moment, I'm traveling, so I only have couple of 8GB USBs. If I was at home, then I would give up by now and use my DVD instead. I tried everything for 5 hours. Everything. Reinstalled Lion (clean) 10 times, tried it on two different computers, recreated Windows 7 USB 5 times, tried installing rEFIt using terminal, etc.
    About having three partition, that's wrong. It wouldn't make any difference if Lion created small partition for Recovery HD, because it won't be recognized as one when you are actually using it. You can only choose to boot from it using the alt-key when you start up the computer. Creating a third partition on top of Mac and Windows will disable Windows partition, if that's what you were talking about.
     
  14. macrumors member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2007
    Location:
    Brisbane
    #14
    I'm in the same boat as you too. Except I reinstalled Lion twice already, tried the Terminal/Parallels method, and the refit method. I've also tried the old traditional way of putting the DVD in and holding the Alt key. It picks up the DVD but just stays at the black page that says "Press any key to boot from CD or DVD".

    I think I'm just going to leave it for now until someone figures out a workable solution.
     
  15. macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2011
    #15
    Maybe I've been not so clear.
    Try launching Terminal and typing diskutil list. Here's what you'd get:

    Code:
    /dev/disk0
       #:                       TYPE NAME                    SIZE       IDENTIFIER
       0:      GUID_partition_scheme                        *250.1 GB   disk0
       1:                        EFI                         209.7 MB   disk0s1
       2:                  Apple_HFS Lion                    249.2 GB   disk0s2
       3:                 Apple_Boot Recovery HD             650.0 MB   disk0s3
    
    So there actually are 3 partitions on your Lion main disc, no matter what you invent about pressing alt key whatsoever.
    I struggled for a solution as much as you are, so please, please trust what I'm saying.
    When I finally managed to boot from USB, W7 still refused to install on BOOTCAMP partition, even after formatting it to NTFS.
    That's because Windows just can't accept to be installed on the fourth active partition of a disk. So I had to erase disk0s3 and merge it with disk0s2, obtaining a disk with just two partitions. Then I used Boot Camp Assistant to prepare the third partition and at last I was able to install W7 with no other hassle. I can't provide much help on the Snow Leopard path, since I'm finally on Lion, but I'll be very glad of guiding you on the path from Lion to W7. I hope things are clearer now.
     
  16. seong, Aug 4, 2011
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2011

    thread starter macrumors 65816

    seong

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    #16
    Hm. That's odd. So, even if Windows installer was to take the Recovery HD into account, it still would be third drive, right? Because, this is what I see without making any partition using Bootcamp.
    Code:
    /dev/disk0
       #:                       TYPE NAME                    SIZE       IDENTIFIER
       0:      GUID_partition_scheme                        *500.1 GB   disk0
       1:                        EFI                         209.7 MB   disk0s1
       2:                  Apple_HFS seong                   499.8 GB   disk0s2
    
    Oh yea, about the alt key. I'm not inventing anything. You can only see it if you are to press alt-key at startup. That's what I said. It's an invisible drive. As I said earlier, I've installed Windows XP and 7 on every Mac possible (iMac, Mac Mini, Macbook and Macbook Pro) couple of times, reinstalled few to do a clean install, on Lion without a single problem. Maybe it's just my luck, but that's 15 Macintosh I'm talking about.
     
  17. macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2007
    #17
    Out of curiosity, what are people using their Boot Camp installs for these days? With the state of Parallels (more so than Fusion - I have both) unless you are doing hardcore gaming, virtualization should be more than sufficient.

    Just wondering what I'm missing.
     
  18. macrumors 6502

    SideStepSociety

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2011
    Location:
    Roblin, Manitoba
    #18
    If I recall correctly, there are ways to bypass the "three partition limit" during the Windows installation. I believe you have to use Diskpart via command prompt to make the desired partition active.
     
  19. macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2011
    #19
    This must be from a SL terminal and I cannot say much. Boot Camp in Snow Leopard always worked out of the box with the help of rEFIt, cannot guess why it's not ok for you this time.

    I certainly know about the alt key. But the fact that Recovery HD is hidden doesn't make it less important when it comes to partition number. Lion implies the use of two partitions, which should be clear by now: the system one and the recovery, smaller, one. This is the only difficulty I went through when installing W7. And I think this is enough repeating.
    I don't think luck is important enough when talking about computers. Maybe rEFIt documentations may provide better help.
     
  20. thread starter macrumors 65816

    seong

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    #20
    Wait, so have you tried both DVD and rEFIt method? It's only rEFIt that's not working for me. I was thinking that since DVD worked and USB didn't, there were some changes made in Lion that prevents or conflicts with rEFIt booting from Win 7 USB.
     
  21. macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2011
    #21
    Yeah Lion perfectly works with W7, out of the box in case of DVD edition, and with the little help of rEFIt in case you only own a USB copy. you just need a good copy of it, because I had a hard time making it bootable.
     
  22. macrumors member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2007
    Location:
    Brisbane
    #22
    So is this AFTER you deleted the Recovery HD partition and merged it with your existing Mac/Windows partition?

    Basically I've used Boot Camp Assistant to make a 35GB partition for Windows 7 and tried booting from the Windows 7 DVD to install to it but it never loaded the installer (from both USB and DVD). I've got rEFit working but it didn't pick up the USB. May try the DVD tomorrow but I dont' have much hope that it'll work.

    In case you do have to delete the recovery partition, what's the best way to do it? And is that way safe or destructive to the Lion partition? Perhaps I could just delete that partition somehow and merge it with the Bootcamp partition?
     
  23. macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2010
    Location:
    Southern Cal
    #23
    I debated that myself, but do a lot of encoding, so using all available cores is important to me.
     
  24. macrumors 68040

    Dwalls90

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2009
    #24
    I'm using Lion GM and I have the ability to view installing using USB key, HOWEVER, the option is grayed out? Kind of annoying - I hope they make it an option for all users in 10.7.1 or Boot Camp 4.1/4.0.2
     
  25. shatteringlass, Aug 4, 2011
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2011

    macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2011
    #25
    As SideStepSociety already pointed out, it is possible to bypass the three partition limit by using diskpart tool before Windows installation in order to make the desired partition active. I can't provide much help about this because I did not try and wasn't interested in trying either. For me the recovery partition was plain useless and I really intended to remove it. It is basically harmless, if you know what you're doing. It might be useful to make a DVD copy of Lion installation image, though, so you can throw that in just in case your system fails.

    Instructions follow:


    1. Open Terminal


    • Type in diskutil list and it will give you a list of partitions


    • Type in diskutil eraseVolume HFS+ Blank /dev/disk0sN which will erase partition N of volume 0 . Then type diskutil mergePartitions HFS+ NEW_NAME_OF_MERGED_PARTITION disk0sn disk0sN and it will merge the recovery partition (disk0sN) with the main Mac partition (disk0sn) without losing any data.

    Only after this procedure you can partition by using BootCamp Assistant. Remember that before installation, Windows requires that BOOTCAMP partition is formatted to NTFS.

    Basically that's it.
    Oh, and Windows would boot just fine even before deleting the hidden partition. That was necessary in order to install. Boot should work just fine out of the box, as we'd all expect from a product selling worldwide and which promises to be the most advanced desktop operating system. I had myself a hard time trying to make my usb drive bootable indeed. With a DVD it's supposed to be working plain easy, but it happens sometimes to burn a DVD which can't boot. I don't have other suggestions.
     

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