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Discussion in 'Current Events' started by stubeeef, Feb 16, 2005.
In pueblo, in bad weather. & confirmed dead, 1 missing.
This is a bad trend in Corp Aviation.
Tragic. Please be careful out there; in your line of work, there isn't much margin for error. I hope the missing turn out to be alive, but that's rarely the case.
It's very sad news. My prayers go out to the family and victims. I also hope that the missing will be found in good condition, important to be positive till we know the fact of truth. Hopefully corporate jets will get a wake-up call and improve maintenance and safety.
I recently had a group of trainees we took to a doctor in Portland Maine that helps trainee reps for our company.
After getting home, we got a round of applause from the passengers (glad they are alive I guess) they mentioned how nice the flight was and yada yada yada. My response?
It is a job, not an opportunity to be a HERO!
I am very conservative, Navy training, and plan to retire.
More MacRumors folks will die in car accidents than airplanes. But I do appreciate your sentiment, THANKYOU! Some here I venture don't feel that way, but anywho.......
It is not good that 3 jets since Christmas have crashed. 2 in Colorado in bad weather. We canceled a flight to Maine last week because of FORECAST bad weather, it actually didn't develope as expected, but our company lets the pilots make the call.
While at KrispyKreme I was in a 2 hour long wait (Teterboro) short of the runway, waiting to takeoff. We were heading back to NC and the entire east coast was being slammed by thunderstorms. Planes going west were not effected, I told the CEO (ya the one recently fired) that we were on hold for the weather. What happens? I get **** that other planes are taking off! And have had discussions like that before, but when they complain to me head pilot for crap like that it makes you want to quit in the middle of a trip somewhere and leave them stranded!
I hear from other pilots all the time, the pressure to get the execs somewhere right away! Colorado is unforgiving. I used to fly in Colombia S. America. The mountains there are horrendous! At night I could feel my skin crawl up my back.
Edit: Update no Company Officers on board the CircuitCity flight. 8 passengers, 4 employees of the company. (I hope the other 4 weren't the spouses! that would suck to have 4 families without moms and dads!!)
Corp Aviation has a very impressive safety record, nearly mirroring that of the airlines. It seems that at least 2 of these 3 accidents are pilot error, could be mechanical today, will have to wait and find out.
...Stu, I could not make out one tangible thought from that passage.
Stubeef, that got my attention. Only the "best' fly in and out of the Andes. You wouldn't happen to remember the old airport in Medellín, Colombia before they moved it to Rionegro would you? We used to have to make a hard, bank 180° left to come in at mountain level to land in the middle of the city. Always with turbulence and windshear. White knuckle time, every time.
I last flew in Colombia, Medellin-Bogata-Cali in the fall of 2001. I flew a Cargo DC-10, also flew in/out of Quito in Equador.
Scary flying there, hard for us howlies to understand the lingo sometimes.
I was never the "best", I was the primary check airman for my navy squadron, but some of the pilots I was "training" were better than me! I learned along time ago, no matter how good you think you are, there is probably someone better. It is easier to look good when humble and falable than arogant and perfect.
Stu - definitely be careful. While I understand flying is safer (I do it all the time), the corporate pilot gig has to be more difficult, if for nothing else the pressure from your passengers.
And I get what you're saying about passengers complaining that other flights are departing. Happens all the time while I'm on flights (notably in the summer) where somebody's bitching that the plane won't take off in a tornado or something. Me? I'd rather be late or spend the night than being something somebody scrapes off the wreckage that night.
Edit: All 8 now confirmed dead. 4 employees, pilot, co-pilot and 2 others. I doubt any were spouses - more likely suppliers/customers/contractors/etc.
emw, thankyou for your sentiment! you and jsw are making me feel good today!
Seriously, most passengers if you let them know the problem, understand, some are CEO's and already know everything, you just get fired for telling them that they don't ACTUALLY know everything. That is the real problem with corporate aviation, getting fired for knowing more than your boss who is a passenger, about the actual flying part. Trust me it happens!
There is a twin engine beechcraft plane ( a Baron) that was NickNamed the "Doctor Killer", doctor seem to be so very smart and know so much that they would get into situations with an engine failure, stall, flop over and crash. The nickname was a little unfair because non-dr's did it too, it was just the Doctors that had the money to buy the plane.
I am fairly intelligent, hard to believe I'm sure, but I don't tell electricians how to wire my house, or the plumbers how to plumb it, or the drafter how to design it. We all have specific talents, it is just some have more consequences to screwing up than others.
I am very careful, but also have $1.5mil in life insurance incase a mech/airtraffic controller/other pilot/ or me has a bad day!
Sad news about the crash. I wonder if they should be a little more cautious about flying in such conditions? The track record in such weather hasn't been good lately.
Worse than the old airport in Hong Kong? The one, that while coming in to land, you could see not only see the label on their box of cereal as the plane's wing tips almost touched the high rise apartment buildings, but you could even read the ingredients
I have flown that approach, luckily I was in a navy P-3 which is a thousand times easier than in a 747. You flew the approach staight into a mountain, looking for a large orange and white checkerboard, like a purina logo, then cut a hard right turn. Watching the 747's do it was amazing, it seemed as though they would hit the buildings on the way in! In bad weather it was even more amazing.
I read an article about it once, and they mentioned that besides many hours of simulated landings prior to actually doing it for the first time, pilots had to sit in the cockpit and see first hand how it was done a few times before being entrusted with the job.
FYI the old Hong Kong airport had one of the best safety records because only the best pilots flew there, and only after additional extensive training.
I'm happy to hear that you are feeling better. It's always good to know that we can act as a community and help someone that is feeling down.
I also think that people are informed of a situation ahead of time. When people know that facts they are much more accepting and patient.
Isn't it interesting that this happened the day after a hedge fund made an unsolicited takeover bid for the company?
Get out the tinfoil hats folks. Time for a conspiracy theory.
I always hated circuit city but I feel really bad. There have been a lot of these jets crashing lateley.
I have actually been in an emergency landing because the landing gear would not lock only 6 years ago.
This has not been a good week for the CCity!
1. Unsolicited takeover by a shareholder firm because they basically say CCity doesn't know how to run its business.
2. CEO steps down from CEO position (still Chairman)
3. Have to close 19 stores.
4. Have to sell one of its HQ buildings
5. Corporate jet crashes.
And, all of that in 2 days!