Climate Change Check-in

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by citizenzen, Aug 21, 2013.

?

When it comes to man-made Climate Change

  1. I believe it is real

    49 vote(s)
    65.3%
  2. I believe it isn't real

    21 vote(s)
    28.0%
  3. I'm still undecided

    5 vote(s)
    6.7%
  1. macrumors 65816

    citizenzen

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    #1
    The draft summary of the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change has been leaked to the press. This story in the New York Times reports ...

    I'm mostly interested in finding out who still thinks that Climate Change isn't a man-made phenomenon. Are there still disbelievers? Are there still fence-sitters? Are there recent converts? Why? Has your position changed recently? What leads you to hold on to the position you take despite reports such as the one cited?
     
  2. GermanyChris, Aug 21, 2013
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2013

    macrumors 601

    GermanyChris

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2011
    Location:
    Here
    #2
    I don't think many have changed their minds since the last time we went through this. If 45 years of science didn't convince them threads here aren't either.
     
  3. macrumors 68020

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2006
    Location:
    California
    #3
    You know, dog supposedly made the Earth and left us with all that oil to drill baby drill. It would be a sin if we didn't burn baby burn that oil and cause cataclysmic damage to our home. Yep that's it, the only solution is to keep drilling and burning to speed up the second coming of Hay-seus.
     
  4. macrumors 68020

    sviato

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2010
    Location:
    HR 9038 A
    #4
    I don't believe that it's 100% man-made, but I do believe that humans have made a significant contribution to the causes of climate change.
     
  5. macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #5
    95% seems high, sure we are a cause but how can we be close to the full cause? Climates are always changing, we might be pushing it along but it would change regardless.

    The poll is flawed, it should be I believe it is real but not totally man made.
     
  6. macrumors 6502

    DUCKofD3ATH

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2005
    #6
    You can't pump gigatons of CO2 into the atmosphere and not expect some reaction. But it appears the models haven't done a good job at predicting what will happen, since they've been too pessimistic by far.

    The most that CO2, by itself, can increase temps is 1°C, and since we've seen that amount of increase in the last century without any calamities, it's a safe bet that if CO2 were all we had to worry about, the results from doubling its concentration would fall within the bounds of natural variability.

    But there are feedbacks to worry about, which is why the IPCC keeps insisting on scenarios in which a 3°C increase is the minimum we can expect. This in spite of the fact that warming has essentially stalled for fifteen years, even though enormous amounts of CO2 are being emitted.

    So it seems the IPCC doesn't understand what is actually going on, and that they don't have a good grasp of the impact feedbacks will have. The results so far suggest that the effect humans are having on climate will be minimal or benign.
     
  7. thread starter macrumors 65816

    citizenzen

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    #7
    :confused:

    Never heard that one before.

    Source please.
     
  8. macrumors 6502

    DUCKofD3ATH

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2005
    #8
    Source: Wikipedia, but similar quotes are available in the IPCC TAR, FAR, and other reports.
     
  9. thread starter macrumors 65816

    citizenzen

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    #9
    Ah. I see. The key being the words "without any feedback."

    However, according to your quoted article ...

    So as you say there are other feedbacks that contribute to warming.

    The fact that all the feedbacks aren't understood to a precise degree shouldn't come as a surprise. Science is a process of constant refinement in all areas.

    How you can then leap to ...

    Can you cite reputable studies that have come to that conclusion?
     
  10. AhmedFaisal, Aug 22, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 16, 2013

    Guest

    #10
    <snip>
     
  11. macrumors 65816

    juanm

    Joined:
    May 1, 2006
    #11
    If you're managing a large company and that .5% represents millions (and, oh, what a coincidence, your yearly bonus! what are the odds!?), it's a perfectly valid excuse (or at least a good place to start shaving operating costs, because nobody will be directly affected in the short term)
     
  12. AhmedFaisal, Aug 22, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 16, 2013

    Guest

    #12
    <snip>
     
  13. APlotdevice, Aug 22, 2013
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2013

    macrumors 68030

    APlotdevice

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2011
    #13
    117 years actually. A scientist by the name of Samuel P Langley first observed that increasing Carbon-Dioxide levels had a warming effect on our atmosphere, and calculated that burning coal would be a major contributor to this, way back in 1896. (Although he thought the process would take much longer.)
     
  14. macrumors 6502

    DUCKofD3ATH

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2005
    #14
    Because we are experiencing the results right now. What we've seen so far contradicts what scientists predicted. Based on that, we can conclude that their predictions are unreliable because they don't clearly understand feedbacks and are overestimating the Earth's climate sensitivity.

    Until we can trust them (i.e., until their predictions aren't wrong), we have to go with actual experience, and said experience is that "the effect humans are having on climate will be minimal or benign".
     
  15. macrumors 604

    chrono1081

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Location:
    Isla Nublar
    #15
    Fox News says its fake so it has to be fake.

    Politicians with their hand in oil say its fake so its definitely fake.

    Science says...oh wait science says its real....so it must be fake!

    ----------

    You don't read many science journals do you...
     
  16. macrumors 6502

    DUCKofD3ATH

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2005
    #16
    Are you pretending to be a stereotypical American Liberal or is that your honest opinion? "Fox News", the boogeyman of the Left. Boo!

    As for science journals, you don't pay attention to their claims, do you?
     
  17. macrumors 68000

    Happybunny

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2010
    Location:
    's-Hertogenbosch Netherlands
    #17
    I think that most people on this planet think like this.

    My pollution/waste does no harm to the environment.

    It's everybody else, it's their pollution/waste which does all the major harm to the environment.
     
  18. macrumors G3

    Huntn

    Joined:
    May 5, 2008
    Location:
    The Misty Mountains
    #18
    I could not find the direct USA Today link but Reports say there is a 95% chance humans caused global warming. For the conservatives in the forum, this is just another liberal lie, in this case a world wide conspiracy to make you spend money trying to fix this illusionary problem. ;)

     
  19. thread starter macrumors 65816

    citizenzen

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    #19
    What has Climate Change science predicted would happen in the early 21st century that hasn't come true?
     
  20. macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2009
    #20
    But what to do when this measures start making businesses to cut workforce?

    -----------

    I'm of the thinking that wether climate change is man made or not, we have to start doing something. But this something has to be a economically and socially viable solution. And frankly, what the UN proposes sometimes seems a little too much, a little too dramatic.

    Because if something is clear, is that scientist have a very hard time predicting the future reactions of the Earth climate. We might know that we are changing something, but how far can this change go is a very difficult analysis.
     
  21. macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2009
    #21
    I'm sure if one digs, some faulty science paper will come out. Which really is to be expected, since predicting how the Earth will respond to climate change is not that easy.

    Found this:

    LINK: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704658704576274470237832478.html
     
  22. thread starter macrumors 65816

    citizenzen

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    #22
    Hey! You found one!

    I was so worried that Climate Change might be true.

    Imagine my relief to find out it is all a huge misunderstanding.

    ;)
     
  23. macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2009
    #23
    Always a pleasure discussing with people like you.

    I love it when someone asks a question and then make fun of you when you answer that exact question.:rolleyes:
     
  24. macrumors 65816

    TheAppleFairy

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2013
    Location:
    岩手県
    #24
    A Pleasure? lol

    Climate change has been happening long before man any impact on our planet.

    I am all for trying to keep the earth clean, but I am more for prosperity of the human race, and future generations.

    I want clean air and water just like the next guy, so I try not to leave too big of a carbon footprint, but it's not because I think it's going to cause the oceans to rise and super storms to happen.
     
  25. macrumors 6502a

    jnpy!$4g3cwk

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    #25

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