Darkest Keynote in the History of Apple

Discussion in 'General Mac Discussion' started by chaos86, Mar 4, 2006.

  1. chaos86 macrumors 65816

    chaos86

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    #1
    A lot of us know about this, but for those new mac users, here's our most embarassing and depressing history lesson for you.

    1997 Macworld Boston Keynote

    This is shortly after Steve Jobs came back to Apple, and the mac fans were hoping he would instantly turn the company around with new ideas. Instead Jobs told us that Microsoft was becoming a big influence on Apple, including making IE the default browser, working together for Java compatability, and making Microsoft a big investor in Apple (non-voting stock, phew). It was a drastic change, and it definately saved Apple, but we are not proud of it.

    You can literally hear the booing from the crowd at any mention of Microsoft gaining any presence in macs, and when Bill Gates appears on the screen to talk to us.
     
  2. treblah macrumors 65816

    treblah

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    #2
    Without the agreements Apple would not exist today. Period.

    Yes, yes, I know Microsoft is evil and Bill Gates is the devil...;)
     
  3. chaos86 thread starter macrumors 65816

    chaos86

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    #3
    yes, and apple made a deal with the devil ;)
     
  4. Benjamindaines macrumors 68030

    Benjamindaines

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    #4
    Yes, but 1999 was the best... why don't they jump from the rafters any more :confused:
     
  5. joshysquashy macrumors 6502a

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    #5
    Because they are not in the rafters anymore, they are doing rather well currently.
     
  6. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #6
    Ridiculous! Do you know anything about how and why these deals came about?
     
  7. chaos86 thread starter macrumors 65816

    chaos86

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    #7
    1) watch the keynote
    2) if you disagree, do research, like look at stock prices at the time and after
    3) then comment in detail, dont just dis someones comment with no backup
     
  8. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #8
    I've seen it, and I know perfectly well what happened. I apologize for the curt reply, but the misinformation about this event just never seems to be put to rest.

    This deal was all about Apple and Microsoft ending a long-standing patent dispute, quite obviously in Apple's favor. Apple could have continued to fight it out in court, and possibly have ended up with more, but Steve wisely (I think) decided that it was more in the company's interests to get it behind them and turn the resolution into a positive publicity event. It worked like a charm -- though even at the time, many analysts spun it as a big win for Microsoft. Not that anybody could explain why, beyond the conventional wisdom that Bill Gates always wins.
     
  9. xPismo macrumors 6502a

    xPismo

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    #9
    I don't' want to turn this into a flame war, but I clicked back ... and realized I should say something ... and decided to post.

    Many, many Apple users understand why this Keynote was a turning point for Apple and why burying the hatchet with M$ was absolutely key. Those who think Steve somehow sold-out the core of apple that day, I think, are living in a fantasy world.

    Apple could not survive for long producing poor quality solutions and blaming everything on MS. This 'blue meany' thinking had really made Apple a sick company.

    What steve jobs says at the end of the speech, i.e. 'we have to let go of the notion that for Apple to win, MS has to loose' is one of the most defining moments of Steve's career as a leader in the tech industry.

    He let them boo all they wanted, and explained why they were wrong.

    So, embarrasing and depressing? Not at all. This isn't a dark moment in Apple's history. The years before this moment, where all you could hear was whining from the apple campus about big mean MS, were. Steve got Apple back on track. Building better solutions for consumers.

    I personally, love watching this video. Everything we have today is just a belief at that point. The fact that SJ and his team realised the potential of that moment is something awesome.

    So anyway.... where is my coffee.... :)
     
  10. Supa_Fly macrumors 68030

    Supa_Fly

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    #10
    I think what most of us are missing or forgetting about is that Bill Gates was under some serious HOT water - scolding actually - regarding the Java Standard (the court case with Sun Microsystems); along with that Monopoly issue at that time .... it was the only way for Microsoft to get positive light on themselves, and Jobs took special advertisement.

    I like the ideas "we need to let go of the notion, for Apple to win Microsoft has to loose" and "if we screw up its not somebody else's fault, its our fault."

    This shows responsibility, maturity and the gusto that Apple had lost when they ousted Steve Jobs.;) :D
     
  11. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #11
    This is a variation on the often-state rationale for claiming that Bill Gates won (doesn't he always?). But the fact is, Apple never figured into the government's antitrust suit against Microsoft in a significant way, so the argument really doesn't work. It's also predicated on the theory that Apple was on the verge of going out of business at the time (they weren't) and that Microsoft's $150 million "investment" in Apple was all that stood between them and Chapter 13 (it wasn't). Even more importantly, it could hardly have looked good to the government's antitrust regulators for Microsoft to be investing in (or, "propping up," as some like to say), their only real competitor in the OS market. This could hardly make them appear less powerful and monopolistic.
     
  12. whocares macrumors 65816

    whocares

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    #12
    Two points:

    1. boy does steve look young
    2. boy does bill come out looking better than then mac-fanboys :rolleyes:
     
  13. treblah macrumors 65816

    treblah

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    #13
    So its 2006 and the Mac has not had the defacto standard in word processing and spreadsheets for nine years.

    Oh yeah, I know don't know how I could have thought that Apple would not have survived. Silly me. :rolleyes:

    It's bad enough that there is so much misinformation about Macs not running Office but if it were actually true who in the hell would buy them for their kids/schools/businesses?
     
  14. iPhil macrumors 68040

    iPhil

    #14
    Is there anyway to download the '97 keynote in QT from www.youtube.com or other site ??:confused: :confused:
     
  15. Benjamindaines macrumors 68030

    Benjamindaines

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    #15
  16. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #16
    Me, for one... but that's another issue. The point I'm making here is that Bill Gates didn't agree to any of this out of the goodness of his heart or because Steve beat it out of him. Continuing Mac Office development was a perfectly reasonable business decision for Microsoft (one that remained in effect long after the five year term announced in 1997 expired, and it was renewed with minimal fanfare just this past January). Apple orchestrated something Microsoft probably would have done anyway into a publicity coup, which was much needed at the time. But that's not to say that Apple would have folded its tent if Bill Gates hadn't made the announcement on a big screen at MacWorld. You shouldn't elevate the style of the announcement over its substance, is what I'm trying to say.
     
  17. whooleytoo macrumors 603

    whooleytoo

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    #17
    Gates has supposedly joked more than once they made more money off the Mac than Apple did.
     
  18. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #18
    Bill Gates is a funny, funny guy.
     
  19. whooleytoo macrumors 603

    whooleytoo

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    #19
    He hides it well.. ;)

    I loved the picture emailed around after that keynote, comparing the vision of Gates on-screen and the scene from "1984". Scary.
     
  20. xPismo macrumors 6502a

    xPismo

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    #20
    Cool! I'm getting a few at the moment. I thought applekeynotes.com/ was going to stay around for a bit longer so I didn't start downloading them right away.... just watched a few NeXT videos which were cool. So no I'm craving and can't find many.

    So, anyone with more links, post away. :D
     
  21. miniConvert macrumors 68040

    miniConvert

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    #21
    I have to say, as someone who hasn't even received their first Mac yet, that after watching the 1997 keynote it actually seems like it was a very bright day for Apple.

    It's very rare in todays corporate world that you ever get a sense of 'real change', but here it feels radical and exciting. What a nine-year rollercoaster they've had since!

    *off to watch more of these old videos*
     
  22. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #22
    Mostly up, fortunately.

    Speaking of old ads, Guy Kawasaki (whom Mac old-timers will know as a member of the original Mac team) had in his collection an un-aired Apple TV ad that involved blasting a computer with a shotgun. He showed it at a conference I attended years ago, to howls of laughter from the audience. It was considered just a bit too rough for TV. I wonder if anybody else has a copy.
     
  23. xPismo macrumors 6502a

    xPismo

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    #23
    So I've been watching the keynote videos today as I fight the latest flu... happily waiting for the iBook and wireless networking bit when....

    Bungie's HALO demo happens... or happens again I guess.

    This is 1999? On OS 9? Wow. Incredible. I had forgotten.

    I kid you not, I shed a tear for what Bungie attempted to do. Halo really was to become the flagship game app for apple in many ways. You don't often see SJ praise games like that.

    Anyway, interesting bits of history. Thanks to all who took the time to put them up for me to see one more time. Time for more drugs.
     
  24. Heb1228 macrumors 68020

    Heb1228

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    #24
    I watched this one the other night and I actually felt bad for Bill Gates when his picture came up on the screen and everyone started booing. Steve's point was, hey, this guy is actually helping us out here.

    I'm not a huge Bill Gates fan, but booing the man to his face was pretty classless IMO.
     
  25. Project macrumors 68020

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    #25
    This remains my favourite Keynote. There is an incredible sense of movement in this right here... and thats just from watching a recording of it nearly 10 years later. Unbelievable stuff.
     

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