Disappointed with Oblivion

Discussion in 'Games' started by Dagless, Feb 21, 2007.

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  1. Dagless macrumors Core

    Dagless

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    #1
    [this is the 360 version]

    To be honest I've only played it for an hour, afraid that's all I can stomach. My brother gives me a run down of the controls, easy peasy! lets go.
    I've played the first 15 minutes of the PC version and it showed me promise. But so I'm not repeating it my bro loads up his save. I don't know the details, we're on a horse, theres some ape-like thing chasing us and a wolf appears from the foliage. First thoughts were

    "Damn this hill looks ugly". It was night, the plants all have a sharp white glow to them that looks horrendous in 1080i (might be easier on the eyes in 720?). So we're galloping over hills n stuff, loving the night sky graphics, disgusted with the draw distances. There was an obvious ring around the player of 10 or so metres of dense plants, then it just cut off. You could even clearly see the wolf lying there, as you approached it would become hidden again, then arise as if to surprise you?
    Textures lacked so much detail.
    It's my own fault I think. The way Oblivion is hyped up to be the super beautiful game that can't run properly even on a PS3 sorta makes you expect something stunning. The only positive stinging on me was size of the world.
    Found it funny that if you're on a horse and you run off a rock/cliff, the galloping noise still plays, OOPS!
    Then the frame rate. This is absolutely what killed it for me. It stuttered too much, like every 5 seconds there would be a brief pause, and the framerate running through all the grass was hideous, I'd estimate it at 20fps and totally detracted from the enjoyment.

    The loading was horrendous. It would be brilliant if they paused the game when it first loads up so I could have taken my dog for a walk or made myself a snack without being killed ingame. I never noticed a PSP taking this long to load. If I had to do that everyday I'd probably go back to playing my glorious PS1. Even the loading for entering a house was terrible, and the way your movement doesn't slow down was an oversight. I mean it's nice to run outside but indoors in such an enclosed area just looked silly.

    The music is brilliant. I really liked the loading music (I suppose you have to really), reminds me of LoTR to no end with the melodies. But that's a very very good thing, audio guys get my approval.

    Maybe I can't see the forest because of the trees, maybe theres a good game down there somewhere. I can't find it amidst the problems that seems to plague all these free roaming games (movement always looks buggy?). Would it help if I lowered the resolution to 720 or 480? I've always valued smooth framerates over high resolutions through years of PC gaming.
     
  2. MRU macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #2
    It doesnt stutter that much for me in the open, I think you have to clear your HDD cache. There's info over on the Oblivion forums about how to do that.

    Reduce it to 720p but I dont think it will make much difference, if it's your HDD cache that's at cause.

    To be honest, playing Oblivion for 1 hour isn't enough. Your barely out of the sewer by that point.

    As for speed of walking, err it's analogue sensitive. If you are gentle on the controller you walk, push hard you run.

    Texture lacked detail ? Well yes in the distance they do, but up close the textures are very good, people and creatures are really well done. Running through a forest there's a huge amount of detail within your main periphery.


    Try and clear the HDD cache first, 'google it' and then give it until you've at least opened portals and joined a fraction.

    1 hour is just not enough, heck if you spent 1 hour with Zelda : TP you would be similarly unimpressed. Washed out blury visuals, textures that would make a whore blush, so slow paced that a snail would beat it in a race, an open world with planes with textures so muddy and brown it's like your living in a sludge pit.

    You need to give the game enough time so you've done a few quests, maybe visted the first oblivion gate etc.

    Also those faults are not the 360 hardware. The game has just an underdeveloped engine. On the PC too, I can play at 1280x768 maxed and it does have loads of loading on the surface world, and similarly I can run in 1920x1200 and its the same. Resolution made no difference. The distant land looks a bit crappy on both formats.

    They have said they have improved the distant land textures on the PS3 version, but whether this is true or not we will ahve to wait and see.
     
  3. Dagless thread starter macrumors Core

    Dagless

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    #3
    I know it's analogue sensitive. It seems to be the same problem in GTA too, in that they have this giant world, so the designers give the player a fast movement. However when in a small enclosed space, the movement feels like it doesn't adapt properly. Zelda has it nailed; horse- faster, wolf-fast, Link- slow. Even Saints Row has better controls in this respect (which I really like, before the 360 squad get on my case).

    I just think I was expecting too much from GotY and with all these people saying "it can't be done on PS3 properly". It's got too many bugs and design problems to make me want to play it properly again.

    And the save I played on was my bros and very far into the game. I wasn't playing that for the story, I wanted to see these impressive visuals in 1080i.

    Oh, cache cleared. No stuttering every 5 seconds now, still choppy framerate :(
     
  4. MRU macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #4
    mmm. try 720p maybe ? but I dont think it will change. PS3 version wont be any different other than the distant land objects. From the playtests I've seen loading etc is all about the same, it doesnt install to the HDD like some PS3 games can, it just uses it the same as the 360 does, and its 720p only on the PS3 I believe.

    Like I say the pc version plays just like the 360 version. Heck put a 360 controller in your pc and its basically identical, just that the loading is a bit quicker, but it still loads very often in the open world. The framerate appears to have a locked maximum too.

    Maybe ElderScrolls 4 will have a better developed engine that makes it open world better, but like you say I think it's mostly a curse of 'OPEN WORLD' gaming. You can have a massive open world, but if you want a load of details close up then you have to load them into scene at regular intervals.
     
  5. Haoshiro macrumors 68000

    Haoshiro

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    #5
    Yeah, I was going to mention the cache.

    Oblivion is the game I've been playing for the last several weeks, and the only game I play just about every day.

    I don't really notice much issue with the framerate, occasionally it hitches, but really not that often for it to be a problem for me. In fact, I'm almost certain it's caused by background loading.

    As for loading, it really is not NEAR as bad as you make it sounds... 10-20 seconds, rarely more then that and you don't have to worry about it that often except when entering/exiting a town. Sure there is some loading going into buildings, but it seems to be intelligently cached so that areas you've just been too don't require loading to go back to.

    I definitely agree with MRU that 1 hour is not enough... but you have a bigger problem - you jumped into someone else's game. Imagine if you did that in a Zelda game, that would be silly and it is even more so here.

    It's important you start straight from the beginning, making you character, etc. So he was fast, what level was he? He might have been a high level Assassin with Agility and Speed at 100 (max)... this is a *stat heavy* game.

    While I think the draw distance of the basic world is great (get up on a hill and look out over the forest, lakes, and cities, it looks great) but the short distance of the "extras" like foilage, rocks, etc is a definite distraction. There are areas that this is more of a problem then others, though. Often it's simply a non issue in dungeons, and in most of the world it seems like there is enough rolling hills, trees, etc that you can't tell. It's when you are traversing plains where it's horribly noticable.

    My guess about the wolf is that is was just laying there, and had you been in Sneak mode you may have been able to get to him without getting his attention.

    I find the game more interesting the longer I play, seeing the different skills they give you at different levels for each category, etc (like a Master of Mercentile can invest gold in shops).

    Joining Guilds is great as well, as you get a lot of quests and some of them with decently intricate plots (like the Mages Guild). And I haven't even explored the Theif Guild or Dark Brotherhood.

    Oblivion is ElderScrolls 4! :)

    I am hoping that was ES5 they just improve on what they have here. I don't see why they would need a bigger world then this. So if they could just get a nice tweaked engine for 360 perhaps they could improve loading and framerate, while at the same time giving a longer range to those extra visual details like foilage. It really doesn't seem like it would take that much to make this game look heaps better... which is saying a lot.
     
  6. MRU macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #6
    ^agree totally...


    What i think makes the game so good - despite its techincal flaws are

    A real breathing world, where everybody talks and has their own story & life. Where they go around their daily business if you were around or not. The way they will communicate and interact with each other, all adds up to the feeling of total immersion in this living world.

    How every NPC has real voices. A first. How your reputation and such effects conversation with them and how your past deeds change outcomes.

    Free will to roam where ever you want and when ever.

    Where you can go anywhere, at any time frame, no meet these set objectiveds before you can get past this magical barrier blocking off bigs parts of the world (like Zelda and FF games).

    There is a sense that your both important, and yet totally unimportant in this world. That the lives of these people will go on, good and bad without you regardless of your actions, again which makes you feel the world truly is real.

    The fact that all the NPC's have back stories of divorce, affairs, murder, betrayl as well as there own hopes and fears, desires and love. That level of detail is unprecedented in ANY adventure / RPG

    The fact that every nook and cranny is crammed with a full history, you stumble across a ruin or cave location and its full of tales of previous explorers, lost sailors, treasure hunters that have gone before you. Love lost, love gained.

    There are the myriad of factions you can align yourself with.
    The power to be good or evil, which like reality is less clean cut and is more a case of shades of grey - which in turn change your character and the world around him or her. Peter Molyneaux would have dreamed of achieving such in Fable.

    So whilst your framerate may take a hit here and there, or you have to load screen, there's so much 'soul' in this game, so much 'freedom' that it more than makes up for any technical shortcomings.

    Oblivion has 'redefined' the RPG genre and will have a lasting affect for years to come. That is why its such a hit and why it's the Game of the Year for so many.
     
  7. Allotriophagy macrumors 6502a

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    #7
    Such an irritating user interface. You can only have one spell visible on screen at once and selecting another spell quickly involves remembering which hotkey you assigned it to. Otherwise you have to open up your spell book...

    And you can't press Y and N for Yes/No in dialogues. Grrr.
     
  8. sikkinixx macrumors 68020

    sikkinixx

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    #8
    I saw on one of the Playstation forums (e-mpire I think, can't find the thread though :() that someone posted a comparison of 360 to PS3 of identical locations and all. The PS3 colours looked a bit more refined and less washed out and the draw distance was greater and the picture sharper. But the game is a year old so I would expect it to look better after further tweaking, and having a standard hard drive means that somehting like 5GB of data will be installed on the HDD to make loading times near the same as PC.


    But anyways, I was fairly underwhelmed when I bought Oblivion for my 360. The pop ups when you run across a field looked pretty bad, and frankly the character style looks quite ugly to me. The level up system is annoying, forcing you to use crappy skills that don't have anything to do with your player in order to max you stats. The speech was repetitive. It was easy to cheat the game. Yet I played it for like 75 hours and might give it another go on PS3... I guess once you start getting bit huge almightly swords and stuff it pushes you to get further and further to get even BIGGER swords and more evil looking armor, etc.
     
  9. MRU macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #9

    PC version obviously...


    I think the game is actually better mapped out for the 360 control pad than it is for the keyboard. I have both the PC & 360 version.


    I read an interview with Bethesda on IGN, where they said they were not having an install option ? Maybe they have changed there mind...

    That's the thing. 75 hours :eek: and yet they were 'your' 75 hours in the sense that the factions you aligned with, quests you did, places you went and such were more than likely utterly different to someone else who has palyed for 75 hours, and that's some going for a game.
     
  10. sikkinixx macrumors 68020

    sikkinixx

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    #10
    well i had just gotten out of the hospital for when you are in bed for a week then "hey! might as well play oblivion", funny thing is i never did the main quest at all. I did everything else, just not the main quest lol.
     
  11. e²Studios macrumors 68020

    e²Studios

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    #11
    I think you were talking about this thread http://forums.e-mpire.com/showpost.php?p=1411843&postcount=19

    There are also some photo comparisons in this thread http://forums.e-mpire.com/showthread.php?t=68781

    Ed
     
  12. sikkinixx macrumors 68020

    sikkinixx

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    #12
  13. Moshiiii macrumors 6502a

    Moshiiii

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    #13
    Oblivion isn't about graphics for me. Its about the deep gameplay.
    People were playing stuff like this on pen and paper years ago.
    Graphics don't matter.
     
  14. pcypert macrumors 6502

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    #14
    This was one of the first games I played after buying my 360. I play all at 720p because I'd ALWAYS rather have progressive over higher res interlaced. Never noticed any of the problems mentioned and I'm super sensitive to frame rates from my horrible World of Warcraft experiences.

    Right now it needs more time than I have for it though. I forget the controls on my few day breaks of playing it and have a hard time coming back to it. I am liking my character more and more and loved storming the dark tower area or whatever. As soon as I beet the last two bosses in Crackdown I may head back to it.

    It's a very, very solid game though. I know you only get to mash a button to swing your sword ;) But it's still fun despite that...there's real gameplay there. Or is game play not lush, full, interactive environments with tons of detail and possibilities...or is it only fast frame rates (though I've still yet to have a frame rate issue...just for arguments sake)...

    Paul
     
  15. Agilus macrumors regular

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    #15
    I'd like to play Oblivion one of these days. Not sure what platform I'd get it on, though. Morrowind was a fun game, and I find that I tend to like western RPGs better than eastern RPGs in general. They fit in better with my own RPG expectations, being an avid tabletop RPGer and all.

    I did have a few nitpicks about Morrowind, though. For all of its "open world" it was still pretty easy to talk to new NPCs and say, "Oh, this is NPC type A. I talked to a clone of you in the last house. No reason to talk to YOU," due to all of the possible dialog options popping up that you've already run through in previous type A NPC encounters. Still, the variety of NPC encounters was pretty good.

    I also enjoyed just going off track once in a while and becoming an outlaw. I appreciated when the game informed me that I had put it into an unfinishable state by offing an important NPC, too. In my opinion, this is better than artificially limiting what the player can do.

    Also, the level editor that came with it was pretty cool. Being able to install user-created content and design your own is always an awesome feature. If you can't do this on any of the consoles, I might have to go with the PC version after I get an Intel MacBook Pro.
     
  16. yellow Moderator emeritus

    yellow

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    #16
    Oblivion looks pretty good on my PC. Personally I don't think it would make a very good console game.
     
  17. MRU macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #17
    Err it was developed for both console & pc siumulatneously.

    And the console version actually has better defined control mechanics over the pc version. It's far easier to change spells etc, on the console version than it is on the pc.

    Even though I can play oblivion maxed out at 1920x1200 with 2x AA + Bloom on my mac pro - I still prefer playing on console, and even when maxed out on pc, there is very little difference graphically between it and the console version.
     
  18. Moshiiii macrumors 6502a

    Moshiiii

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    #18
    I disagree. I play Oblivion on my PC but I'd rather have a xbox 360 to play it on. The reason would be I'd like to kick back on my couch and play the game instead of in my PC chair. I do have a really nice Ikea computer chair though, its just the fact I can relax better on a couch than a computer chair...which is probably a good thing

    To each his own.
     
  19. 2nyRiggz macrumors 603

    2nyRiggz

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    #19
    I don't know about all of that...loading is really not that bad and I think you might have to try the method MRU suggested. I've played the game on max out settings and the works and I never had a problem at all.

    The game looks great dude....I'm trying to figure out where you got that from...are you playing it on a old tv tube?



    Bless
     
  20. Sutekidane macrumors 6502a

    Sutekidane

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    #20
    I'm sorry, but it looks like you already have decided that Oblivion (360) just isn't your game, so you should move on.
     
  21. Dagless thread starter macrumors Core

    Dagless

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    #21
    Philips 32PF5531D-10 32" LCD (I know, it says 720 on the box but the Xbox can run 1080i on it and is clearly sharper than 720i or p.)

    I'm not the only one either. Before I got round to playing Oblivion a friend had bought it for his PC, told me that even in his monitors native resolution it looks pants. My brother wasn't too keen either.

    Some things look beautiful, like hills in the distance. But the midpoint where foliage vanishes (nobody want to contend that point?) and up close textures (back of the player, trees too) didn't seem worthy of what the 360 can produce.
     
  22. emoeric macrumors member

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    #22
    Hey im going to throw one into the pot for OBLIVION sucks. It just really is not a good game. Its slow packed and its quite annoying.

    Im not trying to get anyone annoyed here, just sharing my opinion that its not a very good game. Take the $60 and buy GoW or Crackdown (with a halo 3 beta!)
     
  23. saunders45 macrumors 6502a

    saunders45

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    #23
    It's not that nobody will contend the point, it's that they don't care... Those of us who enjoy Oblivion enjoy it for the immersion, story, leveling, combat, whatever... If it was on the Wii, or it was Zelda, you wouldn't care. i'm not trying to come across as a jerkoff, but for someone who highly stressed gameplay before graphics, give it some time... Start from scratch, and just play as yourself. Don't try to be "good" or "evil", play like it's really you in the character's shoes. THAT is what makes it such an interresting game.... well, that and pH4t 13wwT!!1!!11!!!:)
     
  24. MRU macrumors demi-god

    MRU

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    #24
    I have to agree.

    As I outlined in my post about what makes the game so good. It's the depth that it has is unparalleled.

    Jimmi give it more time. The midpoint distance is the thing they have updated the engine for on the PS3 version. You no longer see the glaring difference, its blended smoothly from far into close detail.

    But I still think regardless of its technical flaws, the game still looks great and is infinitly better looking than other games which people claim are beautiful like Zelda TP, which to me seemed to suffer from N64 muddy texture syndrome.
     
  25. saunders45 macrumors 6502a

    saunders45

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    #25
    Blasphemy!!!!;)
     
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