Discontinue the Mac

Discussion in 'General Mac Discussion' started by blakespot, Jun 20, 2002.

  1. blakespot Administrator

    blakespot

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    #1
    John C. Dvorak has unleashed unto the world yet another spellbinding account of his views on the Macintosh entitled [url="http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,4149,1885,00.asp>"e-Mac, i-Mac, No Mac"[/url]. Within, he ponders the issue of the viability of the Mac, stating...
    <ul>Isn't it about time the Macintosh was simply discontinued—put down like an old dog? Why, exactly, does Apple maintain this line of machines instead of starting fresh or at least introducing something new with fresh legs. The Mac has become the AS/400 of desktop computing, except for the fact that it's prettier. Of course, if Apple never moves forward, what happens to the copycat Windows platform?
    </ul>
    ...and calling OS X simply "an update." With this piece Dvorak has reassured any who might have doubted that he has a true handle on the nature of the Macintosh
     
  2. Moxiemike macrumors 68020

    Moxiemike

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    #2
    He's right. We should replace the Macintosh with the all new Red Delicious.

    What a wanker....

    He should be taken to the gallows and promptly discontinued. I don't disagree with his points about stagnation, but what gets is that he had to flag it with some Mac bashing up front.

    I think the PC would could use something truly REVOLUTIONARY but it's no reason to bash Apple.... unless he's trying to wake a sleeping giant....

    hmmmmm

    :D
     
  3. nerickson macrumors newbie

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    #3
    Dvorak Column

    I have been seeing this "idea" for the past few weeks. The idea being that the Mac be discontinued, renamed, reinvented, etc.

    1. I don't get it.

    2. None of these articles mention Windows as just being update after update of the same thing.

    3. These articles and postings don't point to any other ideas that would go to "the next level" of personal computing. What doesn't the Mac do that they need it to do?

    I guess I don't see the point of this unless it is to get 5000 emails from the Mac Faithful while saying that is not your intent.
     
  4. me hate windows macrumors 6502

    me hate windows

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    #4
    What a moron, saying that the mac should be discontinued, when Windows has been around for almost just as long, and it has just been updated a thousand times like the Macintosh.:mad:
     
  5. gfsu macrumors newbie

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    arlington, tx
    #5
    silicon spin?

    isn't he that lame host for silicon spin? hopefully he gets fired someday, the show might be decent if they replaced him.
     
  6. blakespot thread starter Administrator

    blakespot

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    #6
    What is odd is that OS X truly is "revolutionary," and Apple's current position has rarely held this much promise. Apple is doing most things right an has released the only desktop UNIX OS that works. How is that more of the same, looking back at OS 9 in comparison, and the old Apple??

    Perplexing.



    blakespot
     
  7. Backtothemac macrumors 601

    Backtothemac

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    #7
    You know, he is a friggin idiot! I would love nothing more than to sit down one on one with him and have a debate. Can we send him an invitation to come here and explain it to him. Why not call for the reinvention of the PC? If anything is archaine, and outdated, it is the friggin Winblows operating system. X86, .dll, the registry! Please! He is flunky of Micro$hit, and he has not intelligent statements to ever make of the Mac. Sure, I am sure that someone could say the same of me, but he is an idiot! X is an update! Dear God, if Microsoft tried to do what Apple has done with the OS, the world would probably stop dead in its tracks!
     
  8. eunuchs macrumors member

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    Calgary, AB
    #8
    Interesting that he would use the AS/400 for comparison

    Considering that the AS/400 is an incredibly reliable workhorse found in most datacentres today....

    That said, he does make a good point. The iMac is pretty, but hardly revolutionary. The original Mac was revolutionary. The move to PowerPC was ballsy. Likewise, the move to OS X was pretty audacious. But in between those three it's been only baby-steps.

    In that same timeframe, PCs have gone from being glorified circuit boards to almost usable on a daily basis (thanks in no small part to ideas "borrowed" from Macs).

    I, for one, would love to see Apple blow everyone out of the water with a completely new technology platform. Something revolutionary underneath the skin, rather than a pretty red dress. There have been flashes of brilliance in things like OS X. But, by and large, Apple has spent the last few years improving on existing ideas (think iPod, Xserve...).
     
  9. Moxiemike macrumors 68020

    Moxiemike

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    #9
    Right. but I think he's (and i am by NO MEANS defending him) talking about the lack of something in the UI that is similar to the Xerox PARC stuff back inthe eighties. There's been no revolution to that is what he's saying and is partially right. I suppose talking computers are next, fully functional (without special software/programming) machines that can listen to us, etc etc etc.

    But he's still a half wit with really nothing intriguing to say. We just take what he says and respond/react/intellectualize it. Ya know?
     
  10. maclamb macrumors 6502

    maclamb

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    #10
    I agree that the concept of a PC has not changed since Apple invented it.
    Woz was quoted a few years ago as saying the same thing - Apple isn't innovating, it's just making faster machines..

    I disagree there has been no new, innovative tech since the mac - I look to the newton as the most innovative thing Apple has done since 1984

    I agree the mac today is the mac from 1984 on Major Steroids.

    I agree that complaning w/o having at least a requirement or idea is a loser's reaction jsut to garner attetnion and fill a column.

    I agree he's an *******.


    Car's haven't changed since the early 1900's (or whenever) but so what?

    I don't agree that OSX is an "update".

    I agree with whomever wrote that GUI's have gotten so good and ubiqutious they have stiffled any other innovation.

    So what would be the next thing?
    I would look at MITs media lab for answers:

    No, I don't want to wear or have an computer imbeded in me

    So, smart agents, mobile objects, better input (touch, eye motion, etc) more intellignece in everyday things (seeI, Cringley's article saying why this won't happen soon - chips ch ange to often and are too expensive) are really where we will see the next changes.

    I would rather have seen him describe the major frustations with personal; computing today and what users requirements are.

    i would alo contend that apple engineered the Mac but it was "designed" at Xerox Parc - which I think I read recently was being sold off..

    So, all in all I woudl give him a C- for quality and a B- for idea
     
  11. earblast macrumors newbie

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    Jan 4, 2002
    #11
    hey...it's only a computer guys....who cares what anybody thinks about a machine. If it works for you great...this guy may or may not like Macs.....who knows, who cares...his goal is to generate coverage of himself...sort of like the news media in general.
     
  12. Roger1 macrumors 65816

    Roger1

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    #12
    Interesting article. He claims OSX is nothing more than and update, but isn't that what Win2000, and Win XP are? Nothing more that updates of WinNT? As for design, I would much rather have a new iMac on my desktop, rather than a plain tan box (hmmm, when is the pc world going to update their design?). I guess this also means that firewire is nothing more than an update, being the first to use usb as a standard is nothing more than an update, and the same with wireless technology. Ah well, I guess he's entitled to his opinion. No matter how wrong I think he is.:D
     
  13. nerickson macrumors newbie

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    #13
    Another thing came to my mind when reading through these posts....

    Ten years ago the pundits and columnists heralded the era of the set top box, the convergence of everything. The PC wouldn't exist in ten years according to them.

    Perhaps this will still come but I really doubt it. Most of these 'revolutions' aren't really revolutions at all and die a quick death. What good is an amazing new technology item if nobody buys it. Newton was fantastic, but appearantly not enough to make it. WebTV? Remember that?

    It's kind of like voice recognition technology. Sure, it is pretty amazing but do you know anyone you is using it all the time? It is more of a novelty than anything.

    I suppose the day that we can speak to our computer as if it was another person in the room will be widely adopted but until then people will just use a plain old PC.
     
  14. xelterran macrumors 6502

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  15. barbaloot macrumors member

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    San Francisco, CA
    #15
    Who really cares what he thinks?

    I don't really care what he thinks! I have a G4 450MHz Sawtooth. My roomate has a 850MHz Windoze and my boyfriend has a Sony Laptop 1.4Ghz. My computer screams past them in just about any program.

    geno.
     
  16. cgmpowers macrumors regular

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    Mar 21, 2002
    #16
    Zzzz....

    I cannot think of a world where I don't have my Mac...

    Ever since I switched from PC to Mac, going on 3 years ago this Christmas, I've been in heaven.

    I've fallen in love with the one-shaped design of the iMac. The iMovie allowed me to take my videos and make wonderful home movies. When time came, I jumped to Final Cut Pro and "kicked it up a notch". The advent of iTunes allowed me to organize my CD collection, which spanned DOZENS of CDs. The iPod allowed me to take my ENTIRE collection with me, on the go. iPhoto organized the six thousand photographs i've taken with my digital cameras in less than 15 minutes; I found photos I had forgotten about and actually was able to have prints sent to friends and family with just 'one click'. Now I have a Superdrive Flat Panel iMac and can take the videos & photos and burn them to play on anyones DVD. This is not to mention other great things my Macs have brought me: Ability to be wireless through out my house & the yard and even neighbors house, the easy of use and mobility of the iMac and iBook, the excellent resell value on eBay when I want to upgrade--I've recouped 90% of my expense EVERY TIME that I've had to or needed to upgrade my machine...my old PC's? The old PCs just stop working and end up dusty in the basement or thrown away.

    I love my PC and it does still sit in my computer room; but its my 'game machine'. I do all my creative work, the work that'll benefit my life, on my Macintosh. And if this is a relic, a machine that should be discontinued, then I'd just stop using computer altogether...because there's nothing above that I can do on the Mac that I can do on the PC...without spending zillions of money on software for the PC (iMovie, iDVD, iTunes, iPhoto are all FREE)..and even if I can do them on the PC with that EXPENSIVE software, it'll never be as easy as it is on the Mac.

    Dvorak just needs to dig in the trenches and bolester the PC hardline that its MS or death...and that's just simply NOT the case...
     
  17. blakespot thread starter Administrator

    blakespot

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    #17
    Well, Apple is introducting hardware compositing with Quartz Extreme. Seems to be farther "out there" as far as the GUI is concerned than any other desktop interface. For what that's worth.


    blakespot
     
  18. bbarnhart macrumors 6502a

    bbarnhart

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    #18
    Lots of things have not changed over the years

    Lawn mowers are still the same - but with more features
    Washing machines are the same - more features
    TV's are still the same - somewhat 'better' picture
    Phone - same with cordless abilities
    Car - same with 'safety' features

    Although computers may still be the same think they were nearly 20 years ago, they have a lot more power. This, in turn, alows them to work on more complex tasks and to complete other tasks faster.

    Cars don't go that much faster, clothes are not washed in 5 min., and I can't freeze something in 20 seconds in my new refidgerator.

    However, I can now play amazing games, search databases very quickly, and perform touch-ups with Photoshop on my computer.
     
  19. pimentoLoaf macrumors 68000

    pimentoLoaf

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    #19
    What Dvorak doesn't "get" is that there will be no new computing technology regardless of what platform one is on.

    Everything has been done already.
     
  20. Jays macrumors member

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    Earth
    #20
    We know the truth, so what do we care what other people think? why do we try and convince others that the Mac is better? if everyone drove a Ferrari would it still be that special?
     
  21. arn macrumors god

    arn

    Staff Member

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    #21
    I moved it off the front page... mostly, because I don't personally think there's much point to these types of articles. Obviously, it's just an attention getter... and I don't necessarily want to give him the extra attention.

    arn
     
  22. sparkleytone macrumors 68020

    sparkleytone

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    #22
    just remember that this is the same guy who said the mouse would fail and had no real use in computing. who here has no use for a mouse?? who here has no use for a mac?? exactly.
     
  23. planetpetey macrumors newbie

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    London
    #23
    The only old dog needs putting down is Dvorak himself.

    For someone with obvious intelligence, seems he has decided that Mac bashing is a better use of his time. Ignoring advances in style, compactness, speed, reliability, ease of use, applications and also innovations like firewire & usb, not to mention great Mac tools like dvd burning, iphoto and ipod....are just not worth any merit to him.

    If Mac is not coming up with new things, then someone please tell why there is NOTHING in the windows/PC format that compares in any way to the new i-Mac, in either performance or beauty for that price? A superdrive, flat screen, compact sized, iconic, beautiful PC? NOT!!

    Dvorak is just like a PC...a big ugly boring beige collection of boxes, noise and mediocrity.
     
  24. Tommy! macrumors regular

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    NH
    #24
    BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA


    phew! ok, calm down thomas...

    Excellent, wonderful, perfect description. Keep up the good work.
     
  25. funkybass macrumors newbie

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    Jun 20, 2002
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    denver CO
    #25
    John C

    OK, I've been cruising this board since I got my Tibook-4 months ago and always thought about posting but it's a lot of working, signing up and writting messages a stuff, but I felt obligated once I saw all the John C bashing that was going on.

    Fist off, did read anywhere in the article john say, "and windows with it's inovations far superior to apple...." I didn't. In fact the article states at the top that if apple didn't do it how would micro.. copy them.
    I've watched John C on silicon spin and it was by far the best show on techTV, no BS just arguments. I appreciate that he has an openion and throws it out there. That's more then most of us can do. In fact I agree with him on almost everything.
    This thing about mac osx being an update. In fact it is an update. It's even called mac 10. that sounds like the next step fron mac os 9 to me. Yes I know it's got a new kernal. yeah. If it didn't there's no way I would have purchassed a Tibook. I could go on for hours but I'll just say a few things.
    OsX even looks like every other OS, including windows, I know it's prettier but look...
    Menus on the top like file and the apple menue, view help.
    Volumes mounted on the desktop
    we have a dock now whicch does pretty much the same thing as adding shortcuts
    the trash can is still there
    even the basic hierarchy of nested folders and files

    These are the inovations that john C states haven't changed, and they haven't. Just to keep you off my back, yes yes yes windows hasn't changed them either but that's no excuse as to why apple can't.

    OSX is wonderful to use, I purchassed a tibook for writting code on and love it, However John C is completely justified in saying what he has said, it's all correct. I know I know all you that have been with apple for the long haul hate to hear anyone bash your beloved company and it tyrant (steve jobs) but just because somebody says something bad about apple does in no way mean that they are defending microsoft or any PC maker.

    Oh by the way, I haven't turned off my Tibook since I got it, been running for 4 months straight, I put it to sleep but have yet to shut it down. try that on a sony or toshiba.

    I have much more to say but I'll spread it out over different threads
    L8
     

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