Errant bomb kills civilians in Baghdad market

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by caveman_uk, Mar 26, 2003.

  1. Guest

    caveman_uk

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    #1
  2. macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #2
    Re: Errant bomb kills civilians in Baghdad market

    theories?

    i found a site that's keeping track of the iraqi civilian casualties, with references.

    currently (since jan 1): min 227, max 307

    link
     
  3. macrumors 68000

    agreenster

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    #3
    Unfortunately, War claims innocent victims. Tragic.
     
  4. macrumors 68020

    Moxiemike

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    #4
    "our weapons are very accurate and don't do anything bad. honest they don't"

    yea. right. whateva.
     
  5. macrumors 65816

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    Re: Errant bomb kills civilians in Baghdad market

    Well, maybe not online, but I've heard about this all day on CNN. They are interviewing a general right now and asked hima bout it. It is possible that 1 of their 4,500+ bombs went array but they can't comfirm it yet so relax with the conspiracies.
     
  6. Moderator emeritus

    Rower_CPU

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    #6
    I've actually found CNN online to be very slow with updates.

    Maybe they don't have enough people to handle the constant stream of info (sometimes contradictory) coming in...
     
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    Backtothemac

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    #7
    Moxie, you know I love ya brother, but hey, with over 5,000 bombs now dropped, and less than 10 have gone off course. Plus, could it be that Iraq still has some GPS jammers? Would they then not be libel for the deaths if that is what they used?
     
  8. macrumors member

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    #8
    In war, innocent people will die. Whether this was caused by a US bomb or by errant SAMS or something else isn't clear. However, I've seen plenty of coverage of this on CNN.

    Moxiemike,
    What has been said is that targeting is done with great care and weapons are carefully selected to minimize civilian casualties. It has always been said that war is dangerous and people will die in it. If the US was targeting civilians, there would be hundreds of thousands of dead civilians right now.
     
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    Moxiemike

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    #9
    Regardless, if we weren't there in the first place, and you know how I feel about the fuzzy diplomacy we used, then there would be no deaths.

    It really feels like we're gonna be entering another vietnam... been talking to some people who were around and really feel that way. And these guys supported vietnam at first...
     
  10. macrumors member

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    #10
    This is not true. There would have been more deaths over a longer period of time if we weren't there in the first place, and we would have saved tens of thousands if we have intervened back in 1991.
     
  11. macrumors member

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    #11
    I wonder...

    At least 207, not more than 307. I wonder how the number of innocent Iraqis accidently killed by the US compares to the number of innocent Iraqis intentionally killed by Saddam Hussein.
     
  12. macrumors regular

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    #12
    At least could have saved the civilians they are using as shields during the fighting.
    I agree the war scares the hell out of me that we are going to be bogged down in this thing trying to be the good guy and we are going to have another Somalia.
     
  13. macrumors 68020

    mymemory

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    #13
    Write this down...

    Irakis are gonna kill their own people to blame the US, you can bet that.

    I do not mean this last bomb was that kind of scenario but just think that is the publicity is very bad for the US, Husseing can take just one oh his bateries and target some sensitive place (a school) inside Bagdad and luch a bomb. That would be the worst for the US.
     
  14. macrumors 603

    Dont Hurt Me

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    #14
    Ok we have had a few bombs or missiles go off coarse and kill some civilians, this is regretful for the families. On the other hand Saddam has murdered and tortured thousands and you just want to pretend he hasnt done this? Wake up world we are dealing with a killer thug with no values on human life, not a saint. Why do you think he puts civilians next to military targets, or hides tanks and weapons in hospitals.
     
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    zimv20

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    #15
    yes, that viewpoint has been expressed. it's tired.

    boils down to: "hussein is bad" and "some collateral damage is acceptable"

    agree w/ the first, question the second.

    maybe it doesn't matter who is right if the thing the arab world believes is that civilians are being targeted. maybe all we're doing is making more terrorists.

    in the PR campaign, bin laden is beating the pants off bush. and that's the part we'll end up regretting.
     
  16. leo
    macrumors member

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    #16
    @ zimv20: couldn't agree more.

    So Bush wants democracy and free elections in this part of the world?

    Maybe he should rethink this. There wouldn't be a single US-friendly government left.
     
  17. macrumors 68000

    topicolo

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    #17
    Here's a question: Would you shoot both of your parents in the head right now if it meant that you could possibly save thousands of Iraqi lives in the future?
     
  18. Moderator emeritus

    Mr. Anderson

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    #18
    mememory's got a valid point. Sadam knows the bad publicity could cause problems. He's gassed his own people, so what's the deal with shooting a surface to air missle straight up and have it land somewhere in Baghdad?

    Even the US command doesn't know if its one of theirs or an Iraqi missle. With all that's been dropped and the potential GPS jamming equipment it could happen. Killing a few Iraqis is to Sadam's benefit, so don't discount it.

    Regardless, its terrible, but if I was in the same situation as the Iraqis in Baghdad, well, I'd be visiting relatives in a city not being bombed. Not that that is a solution for those people, but it is war.

    D
     
  19. macrumors 65816

    alset

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    #19
    More deaths? You say that as if we've stopped killing people. This war could last much longer than anticipated, with far more casualties than anyone would care to imagine. I'll be interested to see how this period in our lives appears in history books when I have children.

    Dan
     
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    mymemory

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    #20
    3 months ago Hugo Chavez (our president) after a manifestation he shooted 3 guys from his own side to blame the oposition, one of the uncles of one of the guys said:

    "I didn't see anybody from the oposition, everything was calm and my nefiu (sorry about the spelling) got shoot just like that! and no one from the military around me did anything"

    I have to find the picture of Chavez with Hussein, I'm gonna get it for you.

    Hussein is gonna start shooting his own people if that is necesary to blame the US, that trick is even cheese for those people.
     
  21. macrumors 68020

    G4scott

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    #21
    And they claimed I used to jump the gun...

    You can't rule out the possibility that an Iraqi missile caused this damage. They fire so much crap up in the air at B-2 bombers that are long gone before the bombs hit, and it's all gotta come back to earth somehow.

    While there is a chance that this could've been a US bomb, it could've very well been an Iraqi anti-aircraft missile. Although the Iraqi foreign minister claims it was absolutely a US bomb, he's the same guy who claims that Iraq is beating the US troops...

    Unfortunately, this will only stir up anti-US feelings in Iraq...
     
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    zimv20

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    #22
    agreed on both points. that's what i mean when i say bin laden is winning the PR war. in that regard, it doesn't matter who is killing the iraqi civilians, it only matters that they're dead. and that makes for great terrorist recruitment material.
     
  23. macrumors member

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    #23
    Yes, Dan, more deaths. More deaths of innocent Iraqis if we just left Saddam alone than if we remove him by force. People are easily swayed by the human cost of military action, but do not often consider the human cost of inaction.
     
  24. macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #24
    please list the other countries in which you would propose military action.
     
  25. macrumors 6502

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    #25
    Iran, N. Korea top the list.

    G4Scott that is a laugh. That is the standard evasive retort. Try to come up with something better. The one comparing the sheer number of missles launched was much better. It was fired by an aircraft. There is a sandstorm going on, that is the likely cause of the problem. The pilot likely couldn't see what he was shooting at, but went ahead anyway. Much better to fess up than to try and weasel out of it, don't you think?

    try Guardian.co.uk and or an eyewitness report here,
    http://argument.independent.co.uk/commentators/story.jsp?story=391165

    then come back and say too bad.
     

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