Fallujah Revisited

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by skunk, Nov 7, 2005.

  1. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #1
    http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/article325560.ece

    I suppose Cheney is going to insist that the US be allowed to do this too. Is it not exquisite irony that this comes out at the very time Saddam Hussein is being tried for using chemical weapons on Halabja? He is facing a death sentence: what sentence should we recommend for George Bush?
     
  2. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #2
    Bush? Life in prison among the general population.
     
  3. 3rdpath macrumors 68000

    3rdpath

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    #3
    I remember reading accounts that claimed napalm was used during the raids but this is just beyond...I'm at a loss for words.

    Makes me think about what Robert McNamara said after WWII---only the losers get tried for war crimes.
     
  4. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #4
    war crime trial in the hague. no other way for the US to regain credibility, imo.
     
  5. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    #5
    I'm skeptical, largely because of this sentence right at the beginning,

    "Ever since the assault, which went unreported by any Western journalists, rumours have swirled that the Americans used chemical weapons on the city."

    That assault was WIDELY reported by Western journalists, including every major US media outlet. Arguably, this is simply a sloppy, mis-stated sentence, but...
     
  6. tristan macrumors 6502a

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    #6
    The article says that new evidence is emerging, but doesn't really say the evidence. But it's a very serious allegation, I'd like to see it investigated thoroughly and either proven or debunked. I hope its not true but if it is, people should be stripped of rank and imprisoned.
     
  7. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #7
    Yet another sign of our impending doom. "And fire rained down from the sky on the holy city". Apocalypse, here we come.

    Y'all think I'm kidding.
     
  8. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #8
    A Medal of Freedom? :p

    They're gonna need a little more proof than some photos to make this stick. An autopsy or two would have been nice.
     
  9. skunk thread starter macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #9
    I downloaded the video from the Italian site: there are pictures of helicopters repeatedly spraying large areas of what is presumably Fallujah with hundreds of burning flares. If this is footage of what happened, the people underneath it would have had no chance whatever. It certainly looks appalling. You'll have to d/l it yourselves, as it's 1.5MB (WMV).
     
  10. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #10
    Ah that's beyond my dial-up ability at the moment. I'll have to take your word for it. It's not that I don't believe it, but I'm still leery of jumping on these things as fact this early. I'm sure it's likely, but definite?
     
  11. skunk thread starter macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #11
    Just for a contemporary account:January 18, 2005
    http://dahrjamailiraq.com/weblog/archives/000173.php

    Anecdotal evidence, I know, but the video also has pictures of skeletons inside undamaged clothing, for what it's worth. If this did happen, they won't be able to keep a lid on it indefinitely.

    And, as for the official US denial:
    http://usinfo.state.gov/media/Archive_Index/Illegal_Weapons_in_Fallujah.html
    Which fills one with renewed confidence.
     
  12. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #12
    ****

    Apparently that quote is to be found somewhere in this PDF.

    ****ing melting the skin off children. Nice little bit of PR we've got going there for us. :(
     
  13. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #13
    from this 10 Nov 2004 Wash Post article:

     
  14. toontra macrumors 6502

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    #14
    The US ambassador to the UK was just interviewed on Radio 4 (BBC) and has admitted that white phosphorous was used in the Fallujah siege (no mention was made of whether it has been used before and since). He said he didn't know why the Whitehouse had previously issued a denial on their website.

    He said it was the US military policy that white phosphorous could be used as an incendiary, or smoke-screen, device AGAINST enemy combatants, and said that it wasn't BY NAME mentioned in any treaty banning chemical weapons, although conceded that its use could be seen as contrary to the spirit of such treaties.

    Unbelievable - and to think it was the US who claimed to be freeing Iraq of chemical & "nucular" weapons!
     
  15. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #15
    I happened to be listening to Radio 4 this morning and heard this interview. Apart from whether the ambassador is right about the legality of the use of phosphorous, I found myself wondering whether this story will make the U.S. news media at all.
     
  16. toontra macrumors 6502

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    #16
    This story is now TOPPING the BBC 10 pm news programme. Wow. That's unusual even here in the UK.
     
  17. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #17
    Nope.
     
  18. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #18
    the BBC is now carrying the story here:

     
  19. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #19
    This is absolutely DISGUSTING. I've never been so ashamed to be American. Of course, there is no talk in our media about this. I'm feeling nauseous. What in the hell? What else can he possibly lie about before this president is impeached?
     
  20. wordmunger macrumors 603

    wordmunger

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    #20
    I have to say that at this point, nothing surprises me. This seems like a horrible weapon, but isn't it also horrible to bleed to death from a gunshot wound?

    I was already ashamed about the US actions in Iraq. This makes me incrementally more ashamed. But I do hope that maybe it will serve as a sort of tipping point and push a bunch more people over the edge in removing their support for the war.
     
  21. Kernow macrumors 65816

    Kernow

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    #21
    And now the British Government have admitted to using white phosphorous, although only as "smoke screens and illumination". See the BBC News site here.

    The most incisive comment comes from Menzies Campbell:

     
  22. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #22
    If I had to choose- I'd take a gunshot wound any day.
     
  23. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #23
    A very short AP story on this ran in the back pages of my LA Times this morning, literally in among the boxer brief ads.
     
  24. skunk thread starter macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #24
    So you've moved on from bras to boxers?
     
  25. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #25
    You had to notice. I tried the cross-dressing thing, but it just wasn't me.
     

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