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TyleRomeo

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Mar 22, 2002
888
0
New York
LaoTzu said:
It's up to you what you buy, but there is no G4 rated to run over 1420MHz. The 1.67 GHz is actually overclocked. Apple & Mot/ freescale determined it is not possible to run them any faster without data corruption, heat damage, or worse...
I consider the claims of a 1.8/ 2.0 GHz G4 absolute fiction, sensationalism, and BS. Since they are overclocked, and no one believes they can run at those speeds ( OK, cooled in liquid nitrogen maybe ) This is selling you a POS CPU which has died, is neglected, still on 90nm process if anyone wants one... system bus @ 167MHz and CPU @ 10x is as fast as it can get.... there is no value in overclocking one & selling it for more than a G4 tower...

Please, do NOT hack your Mac CPU. No, there will never be more G4's - thermostats, cars, don't need 800 MHz, and they cost a buck each in volume.... do NOT bother, overclock your G4 chip yourself, or better yet, avoid data corruption, errata, and over drawing power resulting in damage, or unable to boot....

Crazy!

Good luck.
LT

Yeah sonnet wouldn't give out a 3 year warranty if it was unstable above 1.42GHZ.

http://www.freescale.com/webapp/sps/site/prod_summary.jsp?code=MPC7448&nodeId=0162468rH3bTdG8653

If they 7447A only goes to 1.42GHZ before it's overclocked, then the 7448 is always an option.

The MPC7448 processor represents the most significant product update in the MPC74xx line of processors to date. The MPC7448 is the first high-performance processor manufactured on 90 nanometer silicon-on-insulator (SOI) process technology and continues Freescale?s strong legacy of providing Power Architecture products with extensive processing performance at very low power. The MPC7448 is designed to perform between 600 MHz and in excess of 1.5 GHz, contains a full megabyte of L2 cache and offers enhanced power management capabilities. MPC7448 processors are ideal for leading-edge pervasive computing, embedded network control and signal processing applications.

AltiVec Engine Acceleration

The MPC7448 includes the same powerful 128-bit AltiVec vector execution unit as found in previous MPC74xx devices, but with the enhanced support for out-of-order instructions. AltiVec technology may dramatically enhance the performance of applications such as voice over IP, speech recognition, multi-channel modems, virtual private network servers, high-resolution 3D graphics, motion video (MPEG2, MPEG4), high fidelity audio (3D audio, AC-3), and so on.

AltiVec computational instructions are executed in the four independent, pipelined AltiVec execution units. A maximum of two AltiVec instructions can be issued in order to any combination of AltiVec execution units per clock cycle. In the MPC7448, a maximum of two AltiVec instructions can be issued out-of-order to any combination of AltiVec execution units per clock cycle from the bottom two AltiVec instruction queue entries. For example, an instruction in queue 1 destined for AltiVec integer unit 1 does not have to wait for an instruction in queue 0 that is stalled behind an instruction waiting for operand availability.

Power Management

Continuing to pursue lower and lower power consumption is a keen focus with the Freescale family of Power Archtitecture processors, and the MPC7448 is no exception. Power management features include:

Expanded Dynamic Frequency Switching (DFS) enabling software to change power consumption
Nap and Sleep modes
Voltage scaling down to at least 1.0 volt
Added benefits of 90-nm technology:
Multi-Vt and Triple Gate Oxide integrated transistors for low standby power
Low-K Dielectric for high performance with reduced power and noise
Temperature sensing diodes included to monitor die temperature

The e600 core is virtually identical to the G4 core, but with enhancements to L2 cache and AltiVec implementation, and it is manufactured in 90nm technology. Software written for the MPC7447 and MPC7447A will run seamlessly on the MPC7448. MPC7448 can be a pin-for-pin compatible drop-in replacement for MPC7447A.


It's just too bad that the 7448 is very expensive but it runs cooler than the 7447A does. So if they G4 ever goes to dual 2.0 i bet it will with these chips.
 

AlexMaximus

macrumors 65816
Aug 15, 2006
1,180
536
A400M Base
A word to the verax

Hi Keebler,

I have made some extensive research and tests in the past regarding the best noise/cooling solution for my G4 rig. In my opinion the most noise comes from the two small Powersupply fans. That means if you just go with the Verax Powersupply fan kit you have the best cost effective solution.(129$) But you still want to replace the case fan too. The best case fan by far is the Panaflow 120mm with hydrobearing (about 20$). However you will need a dremel tool to make the Panaflow fit.
I did not choose the CPU verax because of my heatpipe. The 1,25MDD does not have a heatpipe so you can go with the CPU verax as well but it will cost you more.
 

AlexMaximus

macrumors 65816
Aug 15, 2006
1,180
536
A400M Base
A pic of the verax psu fan

The fans really rocks! Here is the pic attached
 

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solvs

macrumors 603
Jun 25, 2002
5,684
1
LaLaLand, CA
You are completely wrong

LaoTzu said:
It's up to you what you buy, but there is no G4 rated to run over 1420MHz.
Er, no. I don't know what Moto/Freescale have posted, but they have chips rated to run at up to 1.8/2GHz. The highest Apple went in their desktops was 1.4 because the G5 came out after that. The PowerBooks/iBooks probably couldn't run the new models at full capacity due to heat, plus we got the Intels, so they only went up to 1.6. But mostly, you are misusing the term overclocked. Overclocking is when you run a chip higher than what it is rated as by the manufacturer. The manufactures of the chip determine how fast it can run, and the makers of the machines mark it as such. By definition, if a chip is rated as a certain speed by those who made it, it isn't overclocked. That's simply what it runs highest at according to spec. They are the ones who rate it, how can that be called overclocked? Some can run higher, but a company can't just go overclocking chips and selling them as a higher rating than they actually are. Plenty of people have the higher end chips and use them without issue, otherwise the makers could not be selling them.

I thought we had dealt with this back in the days of the 1.4 supposedly being overclocked 1.25s (they weren't, they were marked with different numbers by the manufacturer), or the 2.5 G5s being oveclocked 2.0s because they needed liquid cooling to be quiet (again, rated by the manufacture, by definition that is just clocking, it can't be overclocking). :rolleyes:
 

Bobdude161

macrumors 65816
Mar 12, 2006
1,215
1
N'Albany, Indiana
Long live the G4. I don't have the patience to save for a G5 so I make "monthly payments" on upgrades. Very illogical financially, but that's how I roll.

But a >2 ghz processor would be nice. Too bad I probably wouldn't be able to join the bandwagon cuz of my older Sawtooth. :eek: Ah well, I kindly settle for 1.6 :D

And also you think if that G4 processor upgrades are dead, why in the hell are the prices still high? There's gotta be some sort of demand to keep them at that price. If the demand was lower, the prices would be a tad cheaper. Stop buying upgrades for a little bit! I need the prices to drop a little!!
 

TyleRomeo

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Mar 22, 2002
888
0
New York
Bobdude161 said:
Long live the G4. I don't have the patience to save for a G5 so I make "monthly payments" on upgrades. Very illogical financially, but that's how I roll.

But a >2 ghz processor would be nice. Too bad I probably wouldn't be able to join the bandwagon cuz of my older Sawtooth. :eek: Ah well, I kindly settle for 1.6 :D

And also you think if that G4 processor upgrades are dead, why in the hell are the prices still high? There's gotta be some sort of demand to keep them at that price. If the demand was lower, the prices would be a tad cheaper. Stop buying upgrades for a little bit! I need the prices to drop a little!!

Wait around for the 7448s. I've been doing some research and it's a matter of time before these bad boys come out and get cheap. Of course at that point the Mac Pros will have 8 cores but who cares, some of us still love our old g4s. What is strange is that everyone is having trouble getting these chips to be stable. Day Star stopped selling them for their powerbook 1.83GHZ g4s and that other company power"something" said they were going to start selling them in january of this year and then stopped. Anyone have any information of what's going on with the 7448 G4 chips and when they will see the light of day?
 

FF_productions

macrumors 68030
Apr 16, 2005
2,822
0
Mt. Prospect, Illinois
TyleRomeo,

How many hard drives do you have in your PowerMac? 500x4? It kinda just sunk in that you have TONS of space in that PowerMac of yours.

I've really started to enjoy the expandability of this machine and I think I'm going to keep this machine for a very long time. This machine has enough speed for now (I'm going to eat those words during my next video project).
 

840quadra

Moderator
Staff member
Feb 1, 2005
9,256
5,968
Twin Cities Minnesota
Yeah I have decided to keep both my dual G5, and my Dual G4 (out on loan).

The G4 is currently a Digital Audio system logic board that I have mounted in a Quicksilver case. I got them both as new (were apple spares at one point), and they are in great condition. I am currently running a Dual G4 533 processor, but I am intending to upgrade the system to a much faster processor.

I have decided that I am going to stick with a L3 cache chip (the 533 does not have this), so my options appear to be limited.

Thanks for the great posts in this thread. It brings back lots of my love for the G4 systems!

FF_productions said:
I've really started to enjoy the expandability of this machine and I think I'm going to keep this machine for a very long time. This machine has enough speed for now (I'm going to eat those words during my next video project).

Regardless, if you end up getting a G5 or intel system, you can keep your G4 and have an awesome looking media server, or file server :) .
 

TyleRomeo

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Mar 22, 2002
888
0
New York
FF_productions said:
TyleRomeo,

How many hard drives do you have in your PowerMac? 500x4? It kinda just sunk in that you have TONS of space in that PowerMac of yours.

I've really started to enjoy the expandability of this machine and I think I'm going to keep this machine for a very long time. This machine has enough speed for now (I'm going to eat those words during my next video project).

I have two 400GB Seagate 7200.8, one 750GB Seagate 7200.10, a tiny 320GB Western Digital and 40GB on a sonnet 2.5 inch Tempo PCI hard drive. I'm only counting internal storage, I have a few external drives also. Soon I'm going to swap out the 320GB for another 750GB or larger if it's on the market. Then eventually throw the two 400GBs into a Firewire 800 case and RAID them externally. Then if one of those dies, throw in the surviving 400GB and throw the two 750GB into that same FW800 RAID box. Then fill whatever space I have left with the largest PATA drives on the market and get this G4 ready to be a giant media server.
 

FF_productions

macrumors 68030
Apr 16, 2005
2,822
0
Mt. Prospect, Illinois
TyleRomeo said:
I have two 400GB Seagate 7200.8, one 750GB Seagate 7200.10, a tiny 320GB Western Digital and 40GB on a sonnet 2.5 inch Tempo PCI hard drive. I'm only counting internal storage, I have a few external drives also. Soon I'm going to swap out the 320GB for another 750GB or larger if it's on the market. Then eventually throw the two 400GBs into a Firewire 800 case and RAID them externally. Then if one of those dies, throw in the surviving 400GB and throw the two 750GB into that same FW800 RAID box. Then fill whatever space I have left with the largest PATA drives on the market and get this G4 ready to be a giant media server.

Nice!
I would love to turn this machine into a media server with eyehome, wirelessly sending it over to the TV without having to author DVD's everytime I want to watch my movies from my machine.
 

TyleRomeo

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Mar 22, 2002
888
0
New York
FF_productions said:
Nice!
I would love to turn this machine into a media server with eyehome, wirelessly sending it over to the TV without having to author DVD's everytime I want to watch my movies from my machine.

You and I think a like I see. If you have room hold off on your PCI slots. Save at least one, when 802.11n comes out offcially, and iTV supports it, or other boxes you'll be limited by PCI bus of 133MB/s transfers which should be all that you will need for the future of FIOS, (already 30MB/s transfer) and you'll be able to stream just about anything from your multiple RAID MDD. Im just not sure how long Airport Extreme is going to hold up, it says 54MB/s but that only if you're 2 feet away. 802.11N is a sure thing, right now its rated to be something like 540MB/s or something rediculious like that. So I figure that 33MHZ PCI bus might be good for that work.
 

FF_productions

macrumors 68030
Apr 16, 2005
2,822
0
Mt. Prospect, Illinois
It will probably be a slow transition into a media center, as I still use this machine to edit videos. I think I still have about 3 PCI slots open, 1 for graphics and one for airport extreme are being used right now.

I'd like to get:
Another Gig of ram to max the machine out at 2 gigs
9600 256 mb's radeon
5 USB 2 Ports (PCI)
and more to come...
 

TyleRomeo

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Mar 22, 2002
888
0
New York
FF_productions said:
It will probably be a slow transition into a media center, as I still use this machine to edit videos. I think I still have about 3 PCI slots open, 1 for graphics and one for airport extreme are being used right now.

I'd like to get:
Another Gig of ram to max the machine out at 2 gigs
9600 256 mb's radeon
5 USB 2 Ports (PCI)
and more to come...

Ahh if you already have a PCI airport card then that might last you for a while. I'm only running a stock airport internal card. Oh unless yours is the MDD FW800 model then yes you would have intenal airport extreme. Anyway, for video card, i'd seriously recommend going for a 9700/9800 card, they are much much more powerful than the 9600. The only thing a 9600 gives you is the ability to run a 30 inch apple display. I picked up a 9700Pro becuase it has both ADC and DVI on it, check them out on ebay, ive had mine for a year now and no problems, i have full core video/image/animation capabilities.
 

FF_productions

macrumors 68030
Apr 16, 2005
2,822
0
Mt. Prospect, Illinois
TyleRomeo said:
Ahh if you already have a PCI airport card then that might last you for a while. I'm only running a stock airport internal card. Oh unless yours is the MDD FW800 model then yes you would have intenal airport extreme. Anyway, for video card, i'd seriously recommend going for a 9700/9800 card, they are much much more powerful than the 9600. The only thing a 9600 gives you is the ability to run a 30 inch apple display. I picked up a 9700Pro becuase it has both ADC and DVI on it, check them out on ebay, ive had mine for a year now and no problems, i have full core video/image/animation capabilities.

Wait, the 9700 pro has ADC on it? I don't need to get an adapter?
 

TyleRomeo

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Mar 22, 2002
888
0
New York
FF_productions said:
Wait, the 9700 pro has ADC on it? I don't need to get an adapter?


no, not if you have a legacy ADC apple display, thats why i got it, since i have the original 23 inch HD screen. The adapter cost $100 so it wasn't worth it for me to get the 9800 when the 9700 does everything the 9800 does anyway. I got the 9700 for about $225 and that was last december.
 

FF_productions

macrumors 68030
Apr 16, 2005
2,822
0
Mt. Prospect, Illinois
TyleRomeo said:
no, not if you have a legacy ADC apple display, thats why i got it, since i have the original 23 inch HD screen. The adapter cost $100 so it wasn't worth it for me to get the 9800 when the 9700 does everything the 9800 does anyway. I got the 9700 for about $225 and that was last december.

Yeah I have the 17 inch studio display, would these work:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Radeon-9800-Pro...1QQihZ007QQcategoryZ25449QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

and

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...10039684680&rd=1&sspagename=STRK:MEWA:IT&rd=1
 

TyleRomeo

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Mar 22, 2002
888
0
New York
FF_productions said:

If your has an ADC connector you need $100 adapter to make it work with a DVI connector. Now if you want to connect a DVI monitor to an ADC port that's only $20 or so. When looking for a video card it must be a mac card, and that makes sense since there has never been a PC video card sold with an ADC connector on it. The old ones are mostly VGA and DVI, my 9700 Pro is ADC and DVI.
 

ricgnzlzcr

macrumors 6502a
Jun 7, 2005
802
0
I just bought a 400 mhz sawtooth for an amazing price after reading this thread. I was just wondering if the dual 1.3 ghz upgrade makes it run very loud. What is the quietest upgrade? Also, there are so many different types of hard drives. Which one will fit my powermac well? Thanks
 

dpaanlka

macrumors 601
Nov 16, 2004
4,868
30
Illinois
xPismo said:
Good question: So then who has the fastest G4 here?

(anyone with ... mmm... liquid cooling?!)

I had both Sonnet's 1.8ghz and PowerLogix 2ghz upgrade. The PowerLogix was extremely unstable and very loud due to all the fans I installed to keep it cool.

The Sonnet one was very quiet and very stable, I even ran it with the main case fan disconnected.
 

ricgnzlzcr

macrumors 6502a
Jun 7, 2005
802
0
dpaanlka said:
I had both Sonnet's 1.8ghz and PowerLogix 2ghz upgrade. The PowerLogix was extremely unstable and very loud due to all the fans I installed to keep it cool.

The Sonnet one was very quiet and very stable, I even ran it with the main case fan disconnected.

Nice, I'm wondering whether I should get a single core processor upgrade or if the dual core is worth it. I do a lot of multitasking, but the most intensive thing I do is rip dvd's. Also, I like silence.
 

TyleRomeo

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Mar 22, 2002
888
0
New York
xPismo said:
Good question: So then who has the fastest G4 here?

(anyone with ... mmm... liquid cooling?!)


Give me dual 7448s at 2.0GHZ and that would be me. Ahh a man can dream.
 

dpaanlka

macrumors 601
Nov 16, 2004
4,868
30
Illinois
ricgnzlzcr said:
Nice, I'm wondering whether I should get a single core processor upgrade or if the dual core is worth it. I do a lot of multitasking, but the most intensive thing I do is rip dvd's. Also, I like silence.

There is no Dual core G4: they are two full processors side by side.
 

disconap

macrumors 68000
Oct 29, 2005
1,810
3
Portland, OR
Honestly it just depends what you do; if you run a ton of apps at once and use a lot of applications that take advantage of dual processors (mostly pro-apps and some of the OS included stuff like Quicktime), then a dual makes sense. If you generally use three or less applications at once and have never paid more than $100 for a piece of software, then a dual processor is far more than you need.
 
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