Faux News poll: Christianity is under attack

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Thomas Veil, Dec 2, 2005.

  1. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #1
    I saw this as I was flipping channels today while simultaneously listening to the mortarfire of the 98th Armored division surrounding St. Stephen's Episcopal:

    Link

    Man. I so want to believe that Faux's methodology in this poll is as biased as the rest of their network. I don't want to believe that this is an actual, valid result, because that means we've still got a long ways to go.

    About the only result that gives me any comfort is that most people don't believe that there is a "war on Christmas". I know the Right's really been trying to build up that straw man in recent years, and it's nice to know it isn't working.

    But the rest is unsettling, and raises a whole series of questions. Aren't we still teaching kids the Constitution in civics class? Or are we too afraid to bring up the subject of separation of church and state? Do certain religions exert so much influence (*cough*mindcontrol*cough*) that they override what kids learn in school? Do most people really not know that "under God" is a relatively modern addition, not something the Founding Fathers approved?

    Moreover, lacking the kind of propaganda mill that the Right has, how do we counteract all this blatant ignorance of how church and state are supposed to work?
     
  2. Sayhey macrumors 68000

    Sayhey

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    #2
    Do you mean that Bill O'Reilly ... <gulp!> ... lied to us?! :eek:

    From one of my favorite bloggers, James Wolcott.

     
  3. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #3
    I think I'm going to puke, then move to South Afica. A long ways to go? More like we're going in the opposite direction.
     
  4. FoxyKaye macrumors 68000

    FoxyKaye

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    #4
    I've been making a real effort to understand American Christian victim mentality lately, since it seems to me I'd be celebrating right and left with Bush in the White House, an entire Office of Faith-Based Initiatives, federal funding for abstinance (sp?)-only sex education, the Kansas School Board creationism decision, Roberts and possibly Alito in the Supreme Court, anti-gay marriage constitutional amendments passing every state election, marriage requirements for receiving welfare, abortion access being slowly eroded, and AIDS funding slashed (to name a few).

    Then it hit me. We're in the Dispensationalist Era. For any number of American Christians, these are the End of Days. It's not about freedom of religion anymore, it's a literal and dogmatic war against the forces of perceived evil and coming antiChrist. I'm really not making this up - Tim LaHaye's Left Behind series is a great example. The kind of situations about which he writes aren't hypothetical or fantastical - to a great many people, they're a prediction of what's to come unless the perceived degeneration of society is stopped.

    It makes perfect sense that Christianity is perceived to be under attack, because to the respondants, this is a war.
     
  5. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #5
    I bought a copy of "Bad Santa." Does this mean I'm fighting in the front lines of the War on Christmas?
     
  6. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #6
    You're either with Santa or against him.
     
  7. tristan macrumors 6502a

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    #7
    We'll stand down when the elves stand up.

    Oh, they are standing up... they're so short I... never mind...
     
  8. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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  9. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #10
    I think fundamentalists mix up an attack on them with an attack on what they claim to stand for. Even if it's the exact opposite. Like when you hate Bush because you love America. These people pervert Christianity just like they pervert the freedoms the US really stand for. Freedom of religion means freedom for everyone. It means getting to say Merry Christmas, but having to hear Happy Holidays.

    But playing the oppressed victim when you are clearly the majority is a proven tactic.
     
  10. joepunk macrumors 68030

    joepunk

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    #11
    Jeeeeeesus Christ! (sorry to anyone who is offended by my usage of the lords name in vain or however it goes)

    I love it when people like use quotes from the Bible. I highly doubt that anyone was writing down in mass quantities what Jesus was saying at the time and he never had a biographer.
     
  11. tristan macrumors 6502a

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    #12
    Don't underestimate the level of development of the period. We have many books today that are original, word for word translations of famous people at the time, including Caesar, Cicero, Ovid, Virgil, Horace, etc. If the bible is considered as a biography, then while we may not have Jesus' exact words, we do have the exact words of four of his biographers (disciples).
     
  12. aquajet macrumors 68020

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  13. xsedrinam macrumors 601

    xsedrinam

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    #14
    As long as it doesn't include Oral Roberts, Oral History has its place.
     
  14. edesignuk Moderator emeritus

    edesignuk

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    #15
    Government policy and the law should have no influence from religion. Grrrrrrr. I don't have much more to say than that, it just really pisses me off.
     
  15. xsedrinam macrumors 601

    xsedrinam

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    #16
    :D And he shall rein, deer, for ever and ever.
     
  16. rickvanr macrumors 68040

    rickvanr

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    #17
    America is crazy. Church and State should be completely separate.

    Edit:: I'm in the same mood as edesignuk on this subject, it just makes me mad.
     
  17. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #18
    Rudolph the Red knows rain, dear.
     
  18. takao macrumors 68040

    takao

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    #19
    shh don't tell anybody but "santa" is a anagram of "satan"


    satan claus ...




    uh oh when i think about it.. the 6th (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Nicholas) is just 2 days away ... time to get carefull again... i guess the Perchten,Krampusse,Tuifel are already hitting the streets and deliviering a few beatings
     
  19. Sayhey macrumors 68000

    Sayhey

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    #20
    Not to underestimate anyone, but my understanding is that it is more like the words of a conglomeration of many early christian leaders over the period of 100+ years, a few who may have been alive during the lifetime of Jesus. The argument then becomes one of whether they are "divinely inspired" texts, not if they are original texts with the verbatim transcripts of a historical Jesus.
     
  20. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #21
    Or indeed if they are not transcripts at all, but coded references to the political affiliations and schismatic dogmata of the time. My favourite analysis at the moment is Jesus The Man by Barbara Thiering. Well worth a read for a different angle.
    http://www.randomhouse.ca/catalog/display.pperl?isbn=9780552139502
     
  21. Sayhey macrumors 68000

    Sayhey

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    #22
    Thanks for the link, skunk, that looks interesting!
     
  22. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #23
    just wanted to post this bit from the link, for those who don't feel like clicking:
     
  23. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #24
  24. NewbieNerd macrumors 6502a

    NewbieNerd

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    #25
    Great example of an attack on Christianity. Some radical who completely misrepresents and lies about Christian faith produces such a website, and then it is passed around as a supposed bash against all Christians and no one complains.

    Suppose there was a website, like www.muslimshateamericans.com (I don't know if this is a real website or not). People would FLIP because you are misjudging and mislabeling all muslims because of a few radicals, terrorists, who also misrepresent their faith. For some reason it is okay to step on the toes of Christianity, men, and whites in America simply because they are either in the majority or have the most power here, but dare a person to say the same things about everyone else and you are a hater.

    Point: If you don't think all Muslims are terrorists, don't think that all Christians think God hates homosexuals. He certainly does not.
     

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