G.O.P. to Make Ethics Inquiries Harder to Begin

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by zimv20, Dec 30, 2004.

  1. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #1
    link

    i'd like to see a GOP'er assert, with a straight face, that this is not another power grab.

    GOP: all the power, none of the accountability. america über alles!
     
  2. Xtremehkr macrumors 68000

    Xtremehkr

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    #2
    Is this strengthening or weakening values? I'm confused.
     
  3. Thanatoast macrumors 6502a

    Thanatoast

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    #3
    It's strengthening the values of some people's checkbooks, that's for sure.

    I like how the Republican solution to being caught cheating is to change the rules to either allow the cheating, or disallow the punishment. How about not committing crimes in the first place?
     
  4. pseudobrit macrumors 68040

    pseudobrit

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    #4
    You answered your own question. If it's not illegal, it's not a crime.
     
  5. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #5
    Hypocrites

    More of that faux morality. Defend the guilty when they're on your side. Then when anyone objects, just blame it on the opposition. Hey, it worked for the Democrats. Clinton gets caught, they claim it's a Neo-Con conspiracy, expose the critics as hypocrites because they're guilty of doing the same things (sometimes worse), claim moral superiority from your limo while drinking Champagne.

    They both make me sick, but at least all Clinton did was cheat on his wife. In retrospect, it could have been much worse. I used to not like the guy, now I actually kinda miss him.
     
  6. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #6
    I'm with solvs. Bad enough that Clinton got impeached for lying about cheating on his wife, while Dubya gets a pass for lying to the whole country about a war. But this, this, is the equivalent of the GOP mooning the country and saying, "We can get away with anything, and you can't stop us."

    It's absolutely disgusting. :mad:
     
  7. Thanatoast macrumors 6502a

    Thanatoast

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    #7
    So what do you guys think? Devolution into anarchy followed by military coup? Is a coup a viable option in this country? :confused:
     
  8. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #8
    I thought that was the whole reason for the 2nd amendment...
     
  9. pseudobrit macrumors 68040

    pseudobrit

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    #9
    The Declaration of Independence says we not only have the right, but a responsibility to overthrow tyrrany.
     
  10. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #10
    I never thought I'd see the day when defending the Constitution might mean overthrowing the government. But the more things like this happen, the more it proves to me that it's all falling apart, that the Founding Fathers would be absolutely sickened if they saw what their noble ambitions have turned into.

    The more brazen the neo-cons get, the more I fear that we will, indeed, have to take action some day.

    Hopefully there will be a more peaceful settlement than that. I'm still all in favor of blue state secession.
     
  11. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #11
    I have a feeling they'll make the same mistakes they always do and take it too far. Then there will be a backlash against them and things will swing the other direction.

    I'm sure there is a way to change things lawfully, that's the best part of our system. Between the legal system and organizations like the ACLU, we can always fight back. Things like this will just blow up in their faces anyway. Their own people start to turn on them. And the moderates will be forced to choose the opposition.

    This was originally supposed to be an effort to show their moral superiority. Guess they realize now they have to change it. Since, you know, they talk big... but they are just as immoral as those they claim to be against.
     
  12. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #12
    Two things make me think you might be wrong this time, solvs:

    One is that the right controls all three branches of government. The neo-cons control the executive and, apparently, legislative branches, and while the conservative Supreme Court isn't actually neo-con, Bush has the opportunity to make some appointments in the near future.

    The other is the "What's the Matter with Kansas?" syndrome, in which average folks -- factory workers, store clerks, etc. -- have wholeheartedly taken the neo-con agenda to their hearts and will defend it mightily, even though it does nothing but harm them. This new neo-con voter base seems to blindly overlook all the corruption that is going on among their leaders. (I've been reading Thomas Franks' book, and it's genuinely frightening in its depiction of a voter base that is so thoroughly brainwashed that it begs parallels to the way cults indoctrinate their followers.)

    I do get what you mean about the "pendulum" effect whereby the country periodically swings from one direction to the other, but I've never seen the country swing this far, for this long, this blindly, without signs of stopping.

    I hope I'm wrong.
     
  13. Desertrat macrumors newbie

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    #13
    The political leadership swung left from 1932 until well into the Clinton era, generally; say, until Gingrich's "1994 revolution". Not uninterruptedly, of course, but that was the general trend.

    The NeoCons are an amazing bunch. There's little that's truly conservative about them. They're as eager to use the government in social-program efforts as any Democrat ever was, as in "No Child Left Behind" or the Old Farts' Free Medicine programs. (The latter was an Al Gore campaign promise, given while speaking to Florida's retirees.)

    Democrats were generally hawkish all through the Cold War era, as were the Republicans--albeit both from patriotism; the NeoCons strike me as being incompetently Hawkish: They can go into a war situation, but the endgames are poorly thought out.

    While I think the status oughta remain quo as to the Ethics Committee voting, I think that phoney or overblown accusations should get some sort of penalty. Congress forever has had trouble in policing its own; too many of them owe favors to one another for anything from mutual support on pork to cooperation on votes on various programs. It's the ancient "go along to get along" and I have no clue as to any real-world way to change that. Folks spend their legislative careers in compromise, and at some point it's principles which suffer.

    'Rat
     
  14. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #14
    Is this how you feel about the Clinton impeachment?
     
  15. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #15
    Couldn't agree with you more. As Bill Maher would say, I would be a Republican if only they would. The problem is that most of the people who support them don't realize it yet.

    Thomas I hope that they do realize it, and that pedulum swings back... more towards the middle at least. I have to hope that will happen, or God help us all. This counrty will no longer be what it is supposed to be, and those that think what is happening now is what they want, will soon learn just how mistaken they are. I'm thinking we just need that shock ala the Nixon tapes, but it is kind of hard to see why everything that's happened so far hasn't done it yet. I would hope it would never get to the point of a Holocaust type situation, but it has happened before, and it could happen again.

    Those who say it can't, are part of the reason it could.
     
  16. Xtremehkr macrumors 68000

    Xtremehkr

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    #16
    Link

    Reversed!

    Seems they can go too far afterall which is an encouraging sign.
     
  17. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #17
    Wait a sec... isn't that a flip flop? I thought flip flopping was bad? :eek:
     
  18. 3rdpath macrumors 68000

    3rdpath

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    #18
    the republican party sure seems hellbent on losing any post-election momentum they may have had...which is fine by me.
     
  19. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #19
    Well, that's welcome news.

    Nice to see that public opinion still counts for something, no matter how little.
     
  20. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #20
    Good for them, no matter what the reason. Even if it's just to save face, I'm glad they stuck to their (original) guns. I'm also glad they're back to the realization that they can't do anything they want without repercussions. Here's hoping the next time they try to go too far, people keep pushing back to stop them.

    That's what happens when you lose (Dems), you're supposed to fight back, and fight back harder. Good to see Liberals are learning from their mistakes as well. Just don't give up on Gonzales yet.
     
  21. Xtremehkr macrumors 68000

    Xtremehkr

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    #21
    Cept, the caveat of course, they are still pushing for party line votes to get inquiries started.

    Give an inch in order to try and take a mile.

    Always read deeper and never look a gift GOP in the mouth.
     

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