GainSaver (or Gain$aver) = Fraud?

Discussion in 'Buying Tips and Advice' started by Heb1228, Feb 27, 2006.

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  1. macrumors 68020

    Heb1228

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2004
    Location:
    Virginia Beach, VA
    #1
    I was just wondering is anyone had heard of this place or ordered there before. I'm a little worried cause I just placed an order for a 700 MHz iMac G4 with 256 MB and DVD/CD-RW for about $185 shipped. This sounded too good to be true, but I didn't think I could pass it up. I'm just hoping this isn't a scam. What do you guys think? Do I need to call and cancel my credit card or anything?

    EDIT: Former thread title: Anyone heard of or dealt with GainSaver.com?
    I wanted to change the thread title to more accurately reflect its contents and to make sure people searching could see easily not to order from this company.
     
  2. macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2006
    #2
    They haven't been around long -- the domain was registered December 12, 2005. I'd try giving them a call, they list a toll free number on their Contact Us page. If you don't get a satisfactory response by phone, I'd immediately call the credit card company and cancel the card. Better safe than sorry.
     
  3. macrumors G5

    CanadaRAM

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2004
    Location:
    On the Left Coast - Victoria BC Canada
    #3
    OK, well, Heb, the time to ask this question is really before you whip out the charge card, ya with me on that one?

    First of all, look up the domain gainsaver.com

    They are using a proxy service to hide their identity from the Whois database. That's not a positive sign.

    The domain was created 2 months ago Created 12-dec-2005. That's not a good sign either.

    Registrant:
    Domains by Proxy, Inc.

    DomainsByProxy.com
    15111 N. Hayden Rd., Ste 160, PMB 353
    Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
    United States

    Registered through: Secure Online Web Hosting
    Domain Name: GAINSAVER.COM
    Created on: 12-Dec-05
    Expires on: 13-Dec-06
    Last Updated on: 12-Dec-05

    Administrative Contact:
    Private, Registration GAINSAVER.COM@domainsbyproxy.com
    Domains by Proxy, Inc.
    DomainsByProxy.com
    15111 N. Hayden Rd., Ste 160, PMB 353
    Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
    United States
    (480) 624-2599

    A traceroute is blocked at a certain point.
    The website is hosted by bnet software, a shopping cart supplier and hoster, so that's a dead end.

    They give the following address

    Gain Saver
    1117 Desert Lane
    Suite 1590
    Las Vegas, NV 89102
    United States
    Toll Free: 877-657-1464
    Fax 702-925-2942

    although on their terms and conditions they state
    GainSaver
    1601 Lockness Place
    Torrance, CA 90501

    They charge $10 plus 15% restocking fee plus freight if you return something and want your money back - whether or not you opened the box.

    Then work the other websites: Google, resellerratings.com, epinions.com, bbb.org, whitepages.com

    They do not have a rating at resellerratings.com or epinions.com

    They do not have a listing at the Better Business Bureau by name or phone number or URL. www.bbb.org - that is not positive.

    They do not have a phone number listed under the name GainSaver in whitepages.com, anywhere in the USA. That means they could be operating from a cellphone or a rent by the month tollfree number. Or it could mean they are a legitimate business that just set up a month ago and the directories haven't caught up.

    The address 1117 Desert Lane Las Vegas has over 100 businesses at it, it is either a large building or simply a mailbox outlet.

    The address in Torrance California has three computer firms at it. The name of one of the firms, Complete Computer Cure was the name of a company sued by Microsoft in 2004 for piracy - although there is no way to make certain that this is aone and the same firm.


    So: There is no positive indication that this is a scam. Neither is there any indication that this company has been in business for more than two months, and no way to identify positively who and where they are.

    You can call the City of Las Vegas and see if the firm has a business license to operate there (or it may be a state thing. Don't know.)
     
  4. thread starter macrumors 68020

    Heb1228

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2004
    Location:
    Virginia Beach, VA
    #4
    You're exactly right. Thanks for looking into all that. You're the man.

    The thing that worried me initially was the price, but it looks like it may have been a pricing error on the website. Most everything else on there is priced more reasonably. I think someone entered the price for the G3 iMacs for the G4.

    I don't have anything else on that card, so I know of any weird shows up there's a problem and it has fraud protection on it so I might just see what happens over the next day or two before I do anything drastic.
     
  5. macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2005
    #5
    With the things that CanadaRAM pointed out, I would be real concerned with that site. Most of the details like very recently registered website and using a maildrop for an address are commonly found in scam websites that people have dealt with in these forums.

    Best case I would hold off on ordering anything from that site until a MacRumors regular from the area can verify if they exist.
     
  6. macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2005
    #6
    If you use Google and look at the satelite or aerial image of the building, it does not look large enough to contain all of the businesses that list at that address. That would make it appear more likely that is a mail drop location and that isn't a good sign. A Google search on that address shows a variety of things ranging from an animal rescue group, a recording studio, AV services, consulting and so on.

    The actual location appears to be about 4 or 5 times the size of a McDonalds that is a block down the street.

    Also found a reference to the same street address:
    http://lasvegas.craigslist.org/vol/134808789.html

    Also check out:
    http://www.nvfst.com/
     
  7. thread starter macrumors 68020

    Heb1228

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2004
    Location:
    Virginia Beach, VA
    #7
    Figured it was time for an update...

    I've contacted the company through the website and only get brief, terse responses and no indication anything is really happening. Their website advertises "Same Day Shipping." I ordered yesterday and it didn't ship. It doesn't look like has shipped today and when I ask why they say "Because we test Apple products before we ship them."

    I'm gonna give them to tomorrow to ship it and if not I'm gonna dispute the charge on my card.
     
  8. macrumors 6502a

    discoforce

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2004
    Location:
    Vermont, USA
    #8
    Only positive I see here is that they seem to take credit cards. Now if they come back saying, "There was a problem with your card, please send us a money order."

    RUN! :eek:
     
  9. macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2005
    #9
    That is a godaddy.com hosted website. Godaddy offers to block personal info for like 3 bucks when you register a domain

    Mine is hosted through go daddy and this is what i got with the whois

    Domain ID:D107806218-LROR
    Domain Name:EXTEMPORE.ORG
    Created On:13-Oct-2005 18:32:08 UTC
    Last Updated On:27-Feb-2006 21:47:34 UTC
    Expiration Date:13-Oct-2006 18:32:08 UTC
    Sponsoring Registrar:Go Daddy Software, Inc. (R91-LROR)
    Status:CLIENT DELETE PROHIBITED
    Status:CLIENT RENEW PROHIBITED
    Status:CLIENT TRANSFER PROHIBITED
    Status:CLIENT UPDATE PROHIBITED
    Registrant ID:GODA-014627201
    Registrant Name:Registration Private
    Registrant Organization:Domains by Proxy, Inc.
    Registrant Street1:DomainsByProxy.com
    Registrant Street2:15111 N. Hayden Rd., Ste 160, PMB 353
    Registrant Street3:
    Registrant City:Scottsdale
    Registrant State/Province:Arizona
    Registrant Postal Code:85260
    Registrant Country:US
    Registrant Phone:+1.4806242599
    Registrant Phone Ext.:
    Registrant FAX:
    Registrant FAX Ext.:
    Registrant Email:EXTEMPORE.ORG@domainsbyproxy.com
    Admin ID:GODA-214627201
    Admin Name:Registration Private
    Admin Organization:Domains by Proxy, Inc.
    Admin Street1:DomainsByProxy.com
    Admin Street2:15111 N. Hayden Rd., Ste 160, PMB 353
    Admin Street3:
    Admin City:Scottsdale
    Admin State/Province:Arizona
    Admin Postal Code:85260
    Admin Country:US
    Admin Phone:+1.4806242599
    Admin Phone Ext.:
    Admin FAX:
    Admin FAX Ext.:
    Admin Email:EXTEMPORE.ORG@domainsbyproxy.com
    Tech ID:GODA-114627201
    Tech Name:Registration Private
    Tech Organization:Domains by Proxy, Inc.
    Tech Street1:DomainsByProxy.com
    Tech Street2:15111 N. Hayden Rd., Ste 160, PMB 353
    Tech Street3:
    Tech City:Scottsdale
    Tech State/Province:Arizona
    Tech Postal Code:85260
    Tech Country:US
    Tech Phone:+1.4806242599
    Tech Phone Ext.:
    Tech FAX:
    Tech FAX Ext.:
    Tech Email:EXTEMPORE.ORG@domainsbyproxy.com
    Name Server:WSC1.JOMAX.NET
    Name Server:WSC2.JOMAX.NET
    Name Server:
    Name Server:
    Name Server:
    Name Server:
    Name Server:
    Name Server:
    Name Server:
    Name Server:
    Name Server:
    Name Server:
    Name Server:


    The previous information has been obtained either directly from the registrant or a registrar of the domain name other than Network Solutions. Network Solutions, therefore, does not guarantee its accuracy or completeness.

    Show underlying registry data for this record


    IP Address: 64.202.163.148 (ARIN & RIPE IP search)
    IP Location: US(UNITED STATES)-ARIZONA-SCOTTSDALE
    DMOZ no listings
    Y! Directory: see listings
    Data as of: 14-Jun-2005
     
  10. macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2006
    #10
    I ordered from them too!!!!

    Hi,

    I know how you feel Heb because last week I was looking for used emacs
    on an internet search and very reputable web site directed me to the "lowest pricel" and the name of the company selling the emacs was called Gainsaver.com.

    I must add that I had been on ebay for 3 weeks looking for a particular model of emac and losing out by getting outbid so I was a little desperate, so seeing this site with it's "lowest price" made me feel hopeful.

    I ordered a emac for a little over $300 with postage and put it on my credit card.
    I know, I jumped the gun but I also felt confident that this other reputable web site would not have directed me to Gainsaver.com if it wasn't legit.

    It said on their site that it would take 3 to 5 days to ship and that my item was in stock. I got an immediate confirmation of the order and my status was "being prepared for shipment" the next day. I waited..... When no tracking info. came I sent them a message the following morning. They gave me the same message as Heb. –They needed a couple of days to test my Macintosh, and would inform me if there were any problems.–
    My credit card has not been charged, yet. If they are legit they certainly aren't very communicative, and I fear I might have to cancel my credit card now because of this. What else can I do? Also what I find kinda mysterious
    is that they still are selling some things like cell phones & speakers but the emac list that I saw on their site last week is gone???
     
  11. macrumors 6502a

    discoforce

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2004
    Location:
    Vermont, USA
  12. macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2004
    Location:
    Jacksonville, FL
    #12
    It'll be really interesting to see how this turns out. Hopefully they don't send you a P-P-P-P-PowerBook.
     
  13. thread starter macrumors 68020

    Heb1228

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2004
    Location:
    Virginia Beach, VA
    #13
    So here's how it turned out... I never got my iMac form gainsaver.com. They were "testing" it for a week and a half (supposedly). Two days ago I get this email saying that its failed its testing and they will not be able to ship it.

    The more I looked into it, the more red flags went up. Their parent "company" bNet software is supposedly a shopping cart hosting company or something like that... except there are no other websites that use this place. They give one example of a "customer" and its not even a real website... full of fake links and everything.

    DO NOT BUY FROM THEM!

    I've been searching google for anywhere I can leave feedback on this place and I get all kinds of hits but most of the references have been taken off the pages. I guess maybe more people have figured out this place is a scam.

    Hope someone else can learn from my stupidity.

    I posted this short webpage talking about gainsaver:

    http://www.brenthobbs.com/gainsaver.htm

    I'm hoping it will get picked up by search engines so people will be able to find out about this place before they try and order.
     
  14. Administrator/Editor

    WildCowboy

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2005
    #14
    Did they charge your credit card? And if so, did you contact your credit card company to go after them?
     
  15. thread starter macrumors 68020

    Heb1228

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2004
    Location:
    Virginia Beach, VA
    #15
    No, the charge was pending for a week and a half and then it disappeared. I'm not sure if they were just after the info to sell it or what. I've already let the credit card company know that I'm not using it for anything right now, so ANY charge that appears is fraudulent they said not to worry since i have fraud protection.
     
  16. macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2006
    #16
    Not really a scam

    Hi,
    I just received my new/used emac from GainSaver today, and it looks to be in good shape. It was packaged well-and seems in order. Time will tell– as far a putting it through the real test. I kept in communication with a young man (Steve Harper) at that toll
    free # they gave on my order and he helped a lot when I was in doubt about anything.

    I think they are a really new business and need
    to iron out some kinks in their record keeping.

    But all and all I can't say that this was
    a bad deal at all-just a new business that needs to get their act together in
    order to compete with other more established businesses. I don't
    blame anyone for being skeptical, as I was really worried there for
    awhile. As I say time will tell if this computer measures up to par.
    I got a terrific deal if it does......
     
  17. Moderator emeritus

    yellow

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2003
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    #17
    Sorry if this sounds cynical, but I wouldn't take the word of a newb that gainsaver is OK. There's been plenty of scamish sites like this that end up as threads on here and some n00b "magically" arrives to first post suspicions about the site, and then a 'hey they're OK! I got my impossibly-underpriced junk' post. Ockham's Razor people, Ockham's Razor.

    I for one believe you're involved with them. Sorry if you're not.
     
  18. macrumors 6502a

    discoforce

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2004
    Location:
    Vermont, USA
  19. macrumors 65816

    plinkoman

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2003
    Location:
    New York
    #19
    i call a complete BS :rolleyes:

    no one registers here to post only twice in a thread about how one retailer isn't really a scam, without being involved with them :rolleyes:

    do you take us all for fools or something?
     
  20. macrumors 604

    zap2

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2005
    Location:
    Washington D.C
  21. macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2005
    #21
    Gainsaver = Fraud, do not buy from them!

    Has anyone bought anything from Gainsaver.com? The prices are incredibly low, but I can't find any reviews/ratings from them. It seems like a scam, just want to know if anyone has had any experience.
     
  22. thread starter macrumors 68020

    Heb1228

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2004
    Location:
    Virginia Beach, VA
    #22
  23. macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2006
    #23
    Buyer Beware!!!!!

    I went through with buying a ibook from gainsaver. I placed the order and got 3 emails verify my order and saying it was getting ready to ship. I called back 3 days later and they said it's shipping out tomorrow. I called 3 days later... this time they didn't know when it was going to ship. The people who work there didn't really seem to know what was going on and they didn't seem to upset about my laptop being over a week late on shipping out. In the end I cancelled the order and alerted my credi card compnay on any fradualnt charges. Also I will keep an eye on my credit report too. These guys are lame! Do not buy from them because you will not get your computer.
     
  24. macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2006
    #24
    Do Not Buy From Them

    I tried to buy a laptop from them and it was a no show after a week and half. It hadn't shipped and they didn't know when it was going to ship. They are bogus and it was all very shifty. I talked to someone 4 different times and each time they were clueless about my order. The prices are to good to be true because they do not ship the computer. Spend the extra $ and get a refurbished one directly from apple or buy the new one. Also there warranty is good for 90 days only.
     
  25. macrumors G5

    CanadaRAM

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2004
    Location:
    On the Left Coast - Victoria BC Canada
    #25

    :D :D :D :D :D :rolleyes: Classic!
     
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