Growing Frustration w/ Transition

Discussion in 'Mac Pro' started by Apple Corps, Jun 11, 2006.

  1. Apple Corps macrumors 68020

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    #1
    Here goes - not intended as a rant and not a troll given the number of Macs we run for personal and business use.

    I've tried and returned the MBP and one duo core mini due to the reasons well outlined on a number of sites. However - the lack of native software is more and more of a problem for my business. HD content has been and is available on standard dvds in WMV HD format - you download them to your hard drive and play away on Windows XP. Can I do that on a MAC with Bootcamp with native speed??. The HD QT trailers on the Apple site are cute but I need to use HD video clips that play native on INTEL Macs - very LIMITED available. I am now spending WAY TOO MUCH time sorting through all of the technical codec issues instead of working on content, flow and customer needs - not a formula for success. This is just the opposite of the APPLE experience we all have loved. As it stands - I am may purchase the new SONY AR for presentation use. I'll develop the majority of the presentation on my QUAD - export it to Powerpoint for Windows - make the necessary corrections - import the HD video clips (WMV HD) - and use the SONY at the customer presentation:eek:

    Beyond that - in layman's terms - I can pop Blueray HD DVDs into the new SONY next week and watch them - where is Apple on the leading edge?

    Is there HD QT content out there that we can run on Apple core duo machines machines? If so - where is it?

    Thoughts are invited - thanks.
     
  2. brbubba macrumors 6502

    brbubba

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    #2
    Considering BlueRay is hardly a defacto standard its a wise idea for any manufacturer to hold off on an overpriced upgrade that could be obsolete in two years. Also Sony has it in their laptops because its their own standard, they are desperately trying to push the tech so they can sit back and collect royalties which they need considering how badly the company is sinking.
     
  3. Apple Corps thread starter macrumors 68020

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    #3
    Apple is on the Blueray advisory board - my point is not Blueray vs HD DVD standard but rather where is Apple on the HD front for our new Intel Macs?

    I read yesterday that Apple market SHARE has actually dropped even though they are selling more notebooks. How much of their focus is on heat, whine and moos when they need to accelerate the needed software so we can get HD content running on the intel Macs?

    Running Powerpoint under Rosetta - especially with high resolution photographs - is so slow. Slide organizer takes forever - especially when you get up to 100 slides or so.

    The increasing number of hacks, plug-ins, emulators is :-(
     
  4. prostuff1 macrumors 65816

    prostuff1

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    #4
    But this is not Apples problem. Microsoft has known about the switch for some time now and it is there responsibility to make a UB.
     
  5. eva01 macrumors 601

    eva01

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    #5
    and Keynote is such a much prettier program than powerpoint.
     
  6. kevin.rivers macrumors 6502a

    kevin.rivers

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    #6
    It is hardly the time for Apple or anyone to jump on the HD bandwagon. With only a handful of HD titles out there, there would be no sense in dropping an overly expensive HD player/burner in any of there products.

    I am sure Apple is keeping up with HD and when they feel it is time to drop it in. I am sure they will. Intel Macs will be around for a while, so yes they will be on the HD front for upcoming Intel Macs.

    The software is already there. Implementing it won't be a problem.

    I am not sure if the current line of Macs support HDCP though.

    Anyhow, by the time it makes sense both cost wise and availablity wise to use an HD format. There will be a standard(I hope), the cost will not be exorbant, and those who bought current intel macs without HD will be looking to upgrade anyhow. So I wouldn't fret.
     
  7. sbb155 macrumors 6502

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    #7
    i find you need both

    I am a corporate user. "Switching" is just not possible for businesses in the real corporate world. I get BSOD less than I get the "rainbow ball" on macs.

    I love my macbook - for photo and video.

    I live my PCs for corporate stuff.

    I tried and could not switch all the way. Too expensive and time conusming.

    I like both products and use them differently.

    It does not surprise me at all that you have had issues. you always will if you go apple 100% for corporate usage.
     
  8. Apple Corps thread starter macrumors 68020

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    #8
    sbb155 - you probably hit it on the head - and that is what I may wind up doing. The SONY AR is stunning and if something goes wrong with the laptop there will be 50 backup machines ready to use for the presentation - not so with Macs. If Apple could just get this software transition accelerated - go fund F4M Intel and get things moving.

    All of that said - I want to read several weeks of experience reports about the new SONY AR as to heat, whine, mooing, build quality, and performance. A proper foot in each camp may be the way to go - they each have their strong points!
     
  9. treblah macrumors 65816

    treblah

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    #9
    First off, it's Blu-Ray.
    No e. :rolleyes:

    Next, please show me where you are finding ATA Blu-Ray drives for PCs and more importantly, media for said drives. :confused:

    If you need HD clips that run on Intel Macs, MAKE some! What the hell kind of presentations are you doing with other peoples content, and free consumer content at that?
     
  10. Apple Corps thread starter macrumors 68020

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    #10
    I would say with 3% market share IT IS APPLE'S PROBLEM - they can ill afford to lose any corporate customers. Keep in mind - even with all of this Intel hoopla - Apple's share of the market IS DROPPING. Microsoft may or may not deliver the goods - Apple (and their customers) are the ones without software solutions:eek:
     
  11. Apple Corps thread starter macrumors 68020

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    #11
    The SONY VAIO comes with Blu-ray.

    Media is just now arriving BUT content is what I have commented on:


    Blu-ray
    What's new
    What is Blu-ray?
    Blu-ray FAQ

    Blu-ray Players
    Blu-ray Movies
    Blu-ray Recorders
    Blu-ray Drives
    Blu-ray Media

    Blu-ray Forum


    Blu-ray Reports
    CES 2006
    IFA 2005
    Ceatec 2004



    Movies
    Blu-ray movies


    Seven of the eight major movie studios have announced that they will release movies in the Blu-ray Disc format as soon as hardware becomes available. The movies will feature high definition video and audio as well as advanced interactive features. Compared to standard definition (SD), which is the resolution used in today's TVs and DVDs, high definition (HD) offers five times the amount of detail. A standard TV uses either NTSC which is 480i (640×480) or PAL/SECAM which is 576i (768×576). The "i" stands for interlaced, which means that only half of the lines are updated for each frame alternating between the odd and even lines. Blu-ray movies will be in 1080p (1920×1080), which is the highest of the HD resolutions. The "p" stands for progressive, which means that every line and pixel will be updated for each frame.

    The content that I use is "copyrighted" / licensed and paid for as appropriate. The current HD content that prompted this OP is in WMV HD format and you just can not get it to work on a Mac - professionals can not afford to put their business as Apple figures out how to get HD software going.












    Blu-ray titles announced

    Title Studio Info
    50 First Dates Sony Release date: June 20, 2006
    A Knight's Tale Sony Release date: June 20, 2006
    Aeon Flux Paramount
    Amityville Horror MGM Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Angel Seekers Air TBS Japan only
    Armageddon Disney
    Basic Instinct Lionsgate Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Basic Instinct 2 MGM Release date: July 11, 2006
    Batman Begins Warner
    Behind Enemy Lines Fox
    Benchwarmers Sony Release date: July 25, 2006
    Big Hit Sony Release date: August 15, 2006
    Black Hawk Down Sony Release date: August 15, 2006
    Blazing Saddles Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats
    Bram Stoker's Dracula Sony
    Bridge on the River Kwai Sony
    Brothers Grimm Disney
    Charlie and the Chocolate Factory Warner
    Chicken Little Disney Not a launch title, to be released later in 2006
    Chronos Goldhil Documentary, Release date: May 23, 2006
    Constantine Warner
    Crash Lionsgate Release date: June 27, 2006
    Crimson Tide Disney Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Dark Water Disney
    Desperado Sony
    Devil's Rejects Lionsgate
    Dinosaur Disney
    Dukes of Hazzard Warner
    Dune Lionsgate TV miniseries aka Frank Herbert's Dune, Release date: June/July
    Everest Disney Documentary
    Fantastic Four Fox
    Fifth Element Sony Release date: June 20, 2006
    Flightplan Disney Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    For a Few Dollars More MGM
    Four Brothers Paramount
    Full Metal Jacket Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats
    Goodfellas Warner Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Great Raid Disney
    Green Mile Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats
    Guns of Navarone Sony
    Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats
    Hero Disney
    Hitch Sony Release date: June 20, 2006
    House of Flying Daggers Sony Release date: June 20, 2006
    Ice Age Fox
    Incredibles Disney Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Into The Blue Sony Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Italian Job Paramount
    Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back Disney
    Kill Bill Vol. 1 Disney
    King Arthur Disney Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Kiss Kiss Bang Bang Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats
    Kiss of the Dragon Fox
    Kung Fu Hustle Sony Release date: June 27, 2006
    Ladder 49 Disney
    Last Samurai Warner
    Last Waltz MGM Documentary, Release date: June 20, 2006
    League of Extraordinary Gentlemen Fox
    Legends of the Fall Sony Release date: June 27, 2006
    Lethal Weapon Warner
    Lord of War Lionsgate Release date: June 27, 2006
    Manchurian Candidate Paramount
    Matrix Warner
    Matrix Reloaded Warner Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Memento Sony Release date: August 15, 2006
    Million Dollar Baby Warner
    Mission Impossible Paramount Not a launch title, to be released later in 2006
    Mission Impossible II Paramount Not a launch title, to be released later in 2006
    Mission Impossible III Paramount Not a launch title, to be released later in 2006
    New Cinema Paradise Asmik Ace Japan only
    Ocean's Twelve Warner
    Phantom of the Opera Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats
    Pirates of the Caribbean Disney Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Punisher Lionsgate Release date: June 27, 2006
    Rambo: First Blood Lionsgate
    Reservoir Dogs Lionsgate Release date: June/July
    Resident Evil Sony Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Resident Evil: Apocalypse Sony Release date: June 20, 2006
    Robocop MGM Release date: June 27, 2006
    Rumor Has It Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats
    S.W.A.T. Sony Release date: June 27, 2006
    Sahara Paramount
    Saw Lionsgate Release date: June 27, 2006
    See No Evil Lionsgate
    Sense and Sensibility Sony Release date: August 15, 2006
    Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow Paramount
    Sleepy Hollow Paramount
    Species MGM Release date: June 27, 2006
    Spider-Man Sony Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Stargate Atlantis MGM TV series, Release date: June/July
    Stealth Sony Release date: June 27, 2006
    Steamboy Bandai Visual Japan only
    Step Into Liquid Lionsgate
    Swordfish Warner
    Syriana Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats
    Terminator MGM Release date: June 27, 2006
    Terminator 2: Judgment Day Lionsgate Release date: June 27, 2006
    Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines Warner
    Tomb Raider Paramount
    Total Recall Lionsgate Release date: June/July
    Training Day Warner
    Troy Warner
    Twister Warner
    U2: Rattle and Hum Paramount Documentary
    Ultraviolet Sony Release date: June 27, 2006
    Underworld: Evolution Sony Release date: June 20, 2006
    Unforgiven Warner
    We Were Soldiers Paramount
    xXx Sony Release date: June 20, 2006
    xXx: State of the Union Sony Not y

    In addition to these is a list of custom HD 1080p custom footage available today. I do not make my money shooting HD footage - I use footage / ultra high resolution photographs as part of my work. It works on PCs now - I need it on Apple today. The market is moving on.
     
  12. eva01 macrumors 601

    eva01

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    #12
    wait

    Since when did Dark Water become a Disney production O_O

    Japanese Horror Movie is Disney. ADV owns the rights to that movie i could have sworn


    And nice to know the only anime i saw on that list is going to Japan only

    However some crap Live Action is coming to blu-ray

    Stargate and Dune are the only remotely interesting things on that list :/

    Once ADV, Geneon, Bandai, Manga, and other anime companies join on the HD bandwagon will i care. And not upscaled HD, i want pure made in HD.
     
  13. treblah macrumors 65816

    treblah

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    #13
    As far as I can tell you want Apple to invest in an untested highly competitive format war so you can rip off movies for your 'presentations'? :confused:

    And your Quad can't handle high-res photos?
     
  14. Apple Corps thread starter macrumors 68020

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    #14
    treblah - I can't carry my QUAD on the road - it handles ultra high resolution perfectly. Slow down and READ my response to you - I pay for HD clips per whatever the copyright provisions are. HD footage is available for $15 - $40 per second depending on clip and use - that IS NOT ripping anything. Do you have any experience doing this? We are currently in a situation that Apple can not HANDLE WMV HD - that is a problem. The issue is the lack of software for the Intel Macs - it is still not there. F4M / Intel may get us there - but the need is yesterday and PC users can do all of this NOW with XP - that is my point.
     
  15. Sun Baked macrumors G5

    Sun Baked

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    #15
    You also have to remember, this is a major switch ... and MS is always slow, with Quark taking up last place.

    Quicktime is easily extended, MS can make a plugin or sell one to Mac users. But they don't.

    For awhile Apple had some MS formats and a bunch of others formats, codecs, and such in Quicktime, then those people requested an increase in royalties (or they became too expensive) and Apple dropped them from Quicktime. Though some come with Pro now.

    It is also possible that MS wanted Mac users to run their files solely through their own player instead of Quicktime -- but MS abandoned that recently.

    It's not always Apple's fault, if the codec is free and the company wants Quicktime support and Apple snubs then -- then it's Apple's fault.
     
  16. Counterfit macrumors G3

    Counterfit

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    #16
    Wow, talk about oranges and mangoes. :rolleyes:
    As long as you install XP, yes. Bootcamp is a tool to install drivers and help you install Windows on your Mac. You can even get rid of OS X completely if you want to (but if you're so up on Blu-Ray, why the **** did you buy a Mac instead of a Sony?)
    And a crappy point it is. If you need full WMV support, it's NOT going to happen on any OS other than Windows, and Apple can't do a damn thing about it. If you want software for OS X to handle WMV perfectly, don't bitch about Apple, because they don't have anything to do with it.
     
  17. treblah macrumors 65816

    treblah

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    #17
    So you use Flip4Mac on the Quad?

    And it is Apple's fault that MS/Telestream has not release a Universal Binary yet?
     
  18. macenforcer macrumors 65816

    macenforcer

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    #18
    I agree with the OP. I thought my macbook could take over the role of my Thinkpad but it hasn't. When I hook up a usb hub to the macbook in bootcamp xp it causes xp to crash. I can't afford this in a production environment. I even went to parallels but that is too slow despite its speed increase over Virtual PC. Everything I need is still rosetta translated.

    On the blue ray front. Yes, apple should have the drives now. Is this the year of HD? Or was it last year? Sick of waiting, lets see it now despite the costs. People who need it will dish it out.

    As far as wmv is concerned, are you telling me apple can't add that? Kind of like all the plugins are extras. Yeah, its apples fault.
     
  19. Apple Corps thread starter macrumors 68020

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    #19
    counterfit - the Blu-ray list was just to show that content is out there - HD DVD also has a list of releases. What I am struggling with is getting HD content working on the intel mini for the moment. The plan is to move the mini to a backup status when on the road and go with either a MBP (once more of the issues are better sorted) OR convert things over to Windows and purchase the SONY. The Blu-ray is a nice to have but not the issue - even though it did contribute to the "fruit punch":rolleyes: - I agree.

    My plan is to check in with F4M in the morning and see what the status of their intel version is - a beta is floating around. If I understand it correctly, WMV HD > F4M intel > convert to QT HD - onto the intel machines.
     
  20. gekko513 macrumors 603

    gekko513

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    #20
    If the F4M lets you convert, you could just as well convert from WMV HD to QT HD on your Quad and not have to wait for F4M Intel, but I think what is ment is that the F4M codec lets you play WMV HD in Quicktime without any conversion.
     
  21. Apple Corps thread starter macrumors 68020

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    #21
    treblah - go back to the title of my thread - Growing frustration w/ transition. Thats all. The "plug n play" experience that I have had with Apple for many years is not as apparent as in the past. The amount of technical effort is far greater than any of my past experiences with Apple. The new Conroe or Woodcrest Mac Pros will complete the line I guess BUT the transition will continue for many many months waiting for software to go native. This frustration is amplified by the couple of returns that I have had to go through to get a working Intel Mac.

    So who's fault is it? All I know is that Apple market share is just under 3% and dropping despite this transition to Intel (yes - they had to do it). When you are that small a player you really need to go the extra miles to get things right and anticipate customers needs and add value. Amazon has announced an arrangement with someone to convert HD content to whatever platforms you want. I thought Apple was going to have the lead on iMovie downloads the way it was sounding. I was pumped - Apple was going to finally make a major breakthrough in video. I just have not seen that yet.
     
  22. Chasealicious macrumors member

    Chasealicious

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    #22
    Using the whole "Apple's market share is dropping" line in this discussion is irrelevant. Market share does not in any way accurately indicate the health of a company. For example...

    Not every household and person in this country owns a computer. All the time, new people are finally jumping in and joining the modern world. Apple could sell 2 million more computers this year than it did last year, but 6 million people may have bought a computer (Windows PC) for the first time in the same year. If that happened, Apple's market share could drop even though the number of actual Mac users has shot through the roof and 25% of new computer customers bought a Mac.

    Think about it. A decline in market share means doesn't necessarily mean anything, too many variables.

    I like small fuzzy creatures.
     
  23. bbrosemer macrumors 6502a

    bbrosemer

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    #23
    Id rather be shot then ever use a PC again, I love my MBP and who cares that I cant play WMA its a stupid propertiary format that sucks anyway, just like everything else Microsoft does other then OVERPRICED Office.
     
  24. macenforcer macrumors 65816

    macenforcer

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    #24

    Too bad wmv is pretty much the web standard.


    ... yes it is.
     
  25. balamw Moderator

    balamw

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    #25

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