I hope this is fake

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Roger1, Sep 7, 2005.

  1. Roger1 macrumors 65816

    Roger1

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    #1
    Firefighters endure a day of FEMA training, which included a course on sexual harassment. Some firefighters say their skills are being wasted. (Leah Hogsten/The Salt Lake Tribune)

    ATLANTA - Not long after some 1,000 firefighters sat down for eight hours of training, the whispering began: "What are we doing here?"
    As New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin pleaded on national television for firefighters - his own are exhausted after working around the clock for a week - a battalion of highly trained men and women sat idle Sunday in a muggy Sheraton Hotel conference room in Atlanta.

    It gets better. Read the whole article

    http://www.sltrib.com/utah/ci_3004197
     
  2. Sayhey macrumors 68000

    Sayhey

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    #2
    It's not a joke. It's been reported from many sources. Sad stuff.
     
  3. Don't panic macrumors 603

    Don't panic

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    #3
    revolting.
     
  4. JesseJames macrumors 6502a

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    How'd I get here? How can I leave?
  5. xsedrinam macrumors 601

    xsedrinam

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    #5
    I found #5 apropos
    gov·ern v
    1. to be responsible officially for directing the affairs, policies, and economy of a state, country, or organization
    2. to control, regulate, or direct something
    3. to control something by restraint
    4. to have or exercise an influence over something
    5. to maintain the speed of an engine or keep it from going above a specific level by controlling the fuel or steam supply
    6. to be the defining rule for something
    7. to dictate the inflection, mood, or case of another word
    Encarta® World English Dictionary
     
  6. pseudobrit macrumors 68040

    pseudobrit

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    #6
    Now when they're handing out pamphlets with FEMA's 800 number (an heroic endeavour), there's less chance any of these firefighters will foolishly fall into the role of the sexual harrasser.

    Victim: Oh, thank God you're here!
    Firefighter: You know, I've been thinking: With your good looks, you could be going places. I think you should try dressing a little more sexy around the disaster area.
    Victim: ... {shrinks into uncomfortable feeling of being violated}

    Also, it lessens the danger that any of the firefighters being setup for photo-ops will try to play a little grabass with GW's tight buns.
     
  7. stubeeef macrumors 68030

    stubeeef

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    #7
    I say it time after time. The answer is not more government, the answer is less government. Overpaying tax dollars for inept bureacrats is insane.
     
  8. Sayhey macrumors 68000

    Sayhey

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    #8
    And you would be wrong. The answer is a competent agency, properly funded and staffed, to do what only the federal government can do in the time of a major emergency like this. The only real waste in FEMA's and Homeland Security's budgets is in the salaries paid to the incompetents appointed as political payoffs.
     
  9. pseudobrit macrumors 68040

    pseudobrit

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    #9
    And to think, all this time the perfect answer was right under our noses; it took stubeef to point it out to us.

    Privatize FEMA! Have an IPO for the Army Corp of Engineers, Inc.! Damn, that would work so much better than a bureaucracy.
     
  10. takao macrumors 68040

    takao

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    #10
    *cough* boston blackout *cough*

    seriously if other countries can do it (like the german THW) then the US should be able as well to create one

    handing out phone numbers ... you've gotta be kidding me ... looks like the FEMA is living in it's own little world and lacking the most important things for such situations: common sense and a plan
     
  11. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #11
    These two things need not be synonymous. How on earth would "less government" help the present situation? Charity is not enough. The government has a DUTY to look after the human and civil rights of its people, if nothing more. What kind of Third World do you want? Beggars in the streets? Toxic swamplands? Abandoned citizens? Street riots? Cholera?
     
  12. Roger1 thread starter macrumors 65816

    Roger1

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    #12
    I'm going to side with Stu on this one, at least in part. I think for less government, I think getting rid of some of the beaurocratic layers would be an immense help. In my opinion privatizing would be a mistake. I agree with overpaying tax dollars is insane. On the flip side, there needs to be enough money there to do the job effectively.
     
  13. wrxguy macrumors 6502a

    wrxguy

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    #13
    wow...it just gets better and better...the bush administration does it again...
     
  14. katchow macrumors 6502

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    #14
    i've gotta say stu's sig got me to thinking...how afraid those stranded in NO must have been when the gov't showed up to help. How terribly frightening! :eek:
     
  15. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #15
    Of course the department has to be sorted out, given the right priority and adequate powers to do its job. Of course it needs to be properly run. That's not really the point here. The point is that this can only be a federal responsibility. Take it away from federal level, and you might as well forget the Union. Some states are a good deal more prone to disasters than others. Or do you think they should be abandoned?
     
  16. katchow macrumors 6502

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    #16
    i always wondered what a libertarian take on natural disasters would be. C'est la vie?
     
  17. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #17
    Au contraire, mon ami, c'est la Mort.


    "Live and Let Die"
     
  18. katchow macrumors 6502

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    #18
    brings new meaning to "sink or swim"
     
  19. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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  20. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #20
    we have got to separate the ideas of bureaucracy and ineptitude. bureaucracy can be good, and our gov't was designed w/ that in mind. i.e. give a group of people w/ varying interests time to consider an issue, and they'll come up w/ a good solution.

    the flipside, giving a group complete power to wield their ideology w/o opposing viewpoints, is the very thing that the framers were trying to avoid.

    what we've seen in FEMA is ineptitude. remember when, after 9/11, everyone was gung-ho to form the Dept of Homeland Security and to change FEMA's mission to mostly be anti-terrorism? oops! what a mistake. some bureaucracy would have been useful then, eh?
     
  21. takao macrumors 68040

    takao

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    #21
    actually bureaucracy or the lack of it isn't the real problem it was IMHO a lack of understanding of the situation, lack of worst case planning (something you learn as a software developer), lack of will to actually do something

    and of course most important: speed .. or better the lack of it ...

    normally when such a disaster comes or is predictable (like rising rivers etc.) everything should already be on full throttle to prevent the worst ... and not sitting around waiting for it to happen
    i'm pretty sure even a highly trained US soldier can fill up sand bags with shovels
    the organization simply is extremely chaotic..

    the real sad thing is that saw years ago a documentary on german TV about the system in place in New Orleans and how old and in desperate need in repair it is and that if it ever comes to "the water is coming" that the city will be in great danger
     
  22. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #22
    response speed, absolutely. in no way did i mean to imply that, at go time, bureaucracy is good. all that bureaucracy should have happened in pre-production, not production, if you get my drift.
     
  23. stubeeef macrumors 68030

    stubeeef

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    #23
    been traveling alot the last 2 days. just getting back.

    More government IS the problem.

    Turns out the RedCross was ready to go in on the day after to give water and food to the superdoom but the state version on homeland security would not let them in. there are thousands of examples of ineptitude on all levels. Granted the area of devistation is the size of Great Britan, but why we hinder ourselves is inexplicable to me.

    Too many layers, to much overlap, to many turf battles.

    Effective government is a dream, we should work towards it, but it is a journey and not a destination.
     
  24. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #24
    It's interesting how the size and nature of the impacts from Katrina shrink and swell depending on who is talking and what they are trying to prove.

    Just for the record, the "area the size of Great Britain" figure thrown around so often is the number of square miles covered by emergency declarations. In fact the huge area cited was impacted by Katrina but by no means was all of it "devastated." This number covers a swath of the United States all the way from Florida to the Canadian border which was affected in a variety of ways by Katrina, but the vast majority was by no means affected to the same degree as the Gulf Coast, which truly was devastated by any definition of the word, at least where it was exposed to the storm surge. I've also seen claims that "an area the size of Great Britain" was put "under water" by Katrina -- which is obviously absurd, but is being said in places nonetheless.
     
  25. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #25
    I wonder if BushCo really are smarter than we thought and this is all part of their plan. Make gov look inept once again, get people thinking like stu. Think it's working? Yeah, me neither.

    (sorta being sarcastic... but sorta not)
     

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