i will vote for w in nov if...

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by jefhatfield, May 10, 2004.

  1. jefhatfield Retired

    jefhatfield

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    #1
    he fires rumsfeld

    w has not been the best prez, but not the worst either, but to get his administation on my side, he needs to dump rummy
     
  2. Frohickey macrumors 6502a

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    #2
    I think Rumsfeld is just fine.

    The one that GWBush has to fire is Mineta. He's the one that has been stonewalling the arming of pilots, and the one that turned airports into Gestapo checkpoints. :mad:
     
  3. IJ Reilly macrumors P6

    IJ Reilly

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    #3
    Now that's a pretty low threshold of satisfaction.
     
  4. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #4
    I'll vote for Dubya in November if he's a Buddihst by then.
     
  5. Krizoitz macrumors 6502a

    Krizoitz

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    #5
    How is he not the worst?
     
  6. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #6
    harding was pretty corrupt, too
     
  7. blackfox macrumors 65816

    blackfox

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    #7
    While I agree that Rumsfeld should be held responsible, so should GW...if he was not directly involved, he was at least complicit. As Truman said: "The buck stops here." If you are going to take credit for the good...you must for the bad.
     
  8. diamond geezer macrumors regular

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  9. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #9
    i'll vote for him if i get another $300.

    not really.
     
  10. jefhatfield thread starter Retired

    jefhatfield

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    #10
    me- moderate middle of the road

    w has been good in rallying usa after 9-11, getting saddam, finally bringing back economy

    but bad at bringing back economy...hey, 3+ years? til growth, wasting money on iraq by invading??, catering too much to religious right

    all w mistakes in his admin isn't all him...he has staff that makes desicsions, too and while there are some bloopers, rummy is his achille's heel ...one poster doesn't like mineta and some may not like norm

    but yes, i have low expectations for w ;) but i am forgiving, but that is most likely due to me not being far right or far left in my viewpoints
     
  11. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #11
    oh, it's back? DOW closed below 10,000 for the first time since december amid inflation fears and rumor of rising interest rates. and it's been creeping downward for a couple months now. i'm not so sure we're out of this.
     
  12. jefhatfield thread starter Retired

    jefhatfield

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    #12
    it's not the great economy of reagan or clinton, but not a total disaster

    some of the good things/growth may, ironically, happen after january 2005 and kerry may be in office then ;)

    and for the record, gore would have done better simply by not attacking iraq with 100+ billion in a lost adventure in iraq, vietnam style

    for god's sake, we should have just killed the bastard (saddam)...is it worth it that us troops get killed nearly every day in iraq during the so called occupation? many gop members also don't agree with the expensive quagmire that has become iraq

    w's numbers will go back up again when we turn iraq over to the iraqis, and the us economy goes up...but maybe not enough to save his presidency

    some key conservative fugures, like two star head of 82nd airborne, sen mccain, and former speaker gingrich, have not been 100 percent supportive of all of the president's actions...this dissent cannot be good for w
     
  13. Frohickey macrumors 6502a

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    #13
    I've been watching various documentaries recently, and what was enlightening was that Reagan's tax cuts didn't give instant results. It took close to 3 years before it started taking effect.
     
  14. Frohickey macrumors 6502a

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    #14
    Inflation fears and rising interest rates always depresses the stock market. That, and a MacWorld Expo or WWDC is always sure to drive the price of AAPL downward. :eek:
     
  15. wwworry macrumors regular

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    #15
    why forgive him? Why not get someone better?

    What were his qualifications coming into office?
    Not many.

    And it's a lot easier to bring back the economy running a $450 billion deficit and the lowest interest rates in 40 years. Let's see how he gets rid of that deficit. As I recall, the last administration had lots of job creation and a budget surplus! I don't see what GWBush has done for the economy being very much to talk about.

    Not to mention a lousey environmental record.
    Not to mention all the lies, no WMDs, no link to Al Qeada, a third of Afghanistan in the hands of outlaws and the Taliban, remember that guy Ossama Bin Laden?, the rest of the world hates us, he is not at all a moderate, the jokers he tries to appoint as federal judges, the biggest jump in Federal spending since LBJ, the list goes on and on.

    The the last thing - he is one of those guys who never really takes responsibility for the things he does. All those Bush supporters will tell you "It's not Bush's fault because he got bad advice." That sounds like the typical corrupt CEO defence. Bush is indeed responsible for the crap that comes out of his administration and, like school children, must be held accountable.
     
  16. jefhatfield thread starter Retired

    jefhatfield

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    #16
    carter messed up the economy and reagan brought it back within a year...but reagan's overspending on the military is what upped our defecit and poor bush sr was in office when the results of that took full negative effect...reagan escaped being tarred and feathered for this and the basic reagan recovery from carter overshadowed anything bad reagan did by overspending later

    i think the 3+ years of bad economy was due to a sluggish bush jr on the economy but in his last months, at least something good is starting to happen now and i wouldn't go so far as to call it a full recovery and bull market, but i do give w some credit

    bush did apologize fo prisoners, but to take full responsibility, he should fire the hapless rumsfeld...someimes leadership takes firing bad employees/staff
     
  17. wwworry macrumors regular

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    #17
    What's going to happen to the housing market when interest rates skyrocket because of his irresponsible spending habits?

    And Iraq - he, perhaps, illegally diverted funds earmarked for Afghanistan to fight this war in Iraq. His war planners threw out a year of postwar planning because of inter-agency squabbling. We saw huge amounts of looting and loss of security because of ideological dogmatism. We are now paying for that with our tax dollars. This was a $25 billion dollar boo boo.

    Question:

    Why would you give a guy who just wasted a least $25 billion dollars of your money another chance?

    Why did he fire the general who dared to give accurate numbers about the cost of the war and the number of troops that would be needed to fight it?

    Why was the person who had accurate numbers about the cost of the medicare bill threatened will dismissal?

    Why was the wife of the person who told the truth about the bogus Niger Uranium claim in the state of the union speech illegally revealed as a CIA operative?

    Why does Dick Cheney insist on keeping secret who was at the energy policy meetings?
     
  18. jefhatfield thread starter Retired

    jefhatfield

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    #18
    sure w has messed some things up but he picks staff to "staff his weaknesses" and rummy should run dod with resposibility which he hasn't

    against army-cos shinsheki's wishes, rummy had 1/3 the army strength (to save money) go into iraq causing unnecessary us casualties, rummy also did not address air force acad. rapes, and rummy regularized special forces into a conventional fighting force which is the opposite of what should be done to fight terrorism

    if rummy should have taken a conservative's dod approach, he should have followed weinberger's tactics/powell doctrine (overwhelming force)
     
  19. wwworry macrumors regular

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    #19
    Why deos Carter get the balme for messing up the economy but not Bush?

    Didn't Carter have to contend with the price controls initiated with Nixon that turned out to be unworkable? When price controls were removed inflation shot up and interest rates rose to quell inflation. The OPEC price hikes did not help either. Didn't Carter also have to contend with the OPEC squeeze? What about the fact that the Japaneese came into their own as a manufacturing economy while the Americans were turning out junk?

    Under Reagan we saw huge debt unrivaled by any since GWB. We also saw that middle and lower class incomes were stagnent thoughout his so called "recovery". Yes, a few people got rich but what about the rest of us?

    The last time we saw all income groups rise was under Clinton. It is not truely a recovery unless everyone benefits.
     
  20. jefhatfield thread starter Retired

    jefhatfield

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    #20
    i wouldn't put w in the same category of the poor performance carter, but also not in the same category of a successful clinton, either

    bush runs near a 50 percent approval rating overall so he has a fighting chance at re-election..if kerry came across stronger, i would dump bush no matter what...let's see who kerry picks as partner and i think much of usa is thinking same thing, too
     
  21. Neserk macrumors 6502a

    Neserk

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    #21
    And we are still down 1.6 MILLION jobs... that is *not* back!
     
  22. wwworry macrumors regular

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    #22
    There were a lot of people who were predicting the kinds of things we are seeing now. I was one of them but not so eloquently or as knowledgably as some. A lot of people doubted the WMD story. A lot of people knew our troops would not be greeted with flowers (remember that one by Cheney?). A lot of people knew Iraqi oil money would not be able to pay for this war (remember that by Wolfowitz?). A lot of people doubted the Al Qeada connection.

    Bush choose to listen to and to appoint the wrong people. Bush needs to be held accountable. Saying he is sorry is just about worthless. WE NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE. WE THE VOTERS NEED TO TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE LIES THAT GOT US INTO THIS WAR AND THE HUGE DEFICITS BEING FOISTED ONTO OUR CHILDREN. Let us not drift along giving encouragement to an administration that consistently says whatever kind of falsehood they want, telling untruths to US, to achieve their ends. It is just not right.
     
  23. Neserk macrumors 6502a

    Neserk

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    #23
    I think you are crazy :D Bush doesn't have a snowball's chance for getting elected (it isn't "re" if it doesn't happen the first time) because he is a dictator and American's are *finally* coming to their senses after a year of brainwashing.
     
  24. Krizoitz macrumors 6502a

    Krizoitz

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    #24
    I voted for McCain in the primaries, then I voted for Gore. I'm pretty much a moderate myself. I had some serious doubts about GW, but he won, so what can you do. Well he has had four years to impress me and has done nothing but dissapoint me.

    Despite the fact I didn't like him I actually supported the Iraq war initially because I thought "Gee if the President says we have evidence of WMD he probably has evidence, I mean he wouldn't lie about something so serious and send us to war without a good reason".

    WRONG

    On top of that his economic policy has been a joke, his "compassionate" conservativism" was all a lie. The energy crisis is a huge deal. Corruption run amok (Haliburton anyone).

    What has he done RIGHT?
     
  25. wwworry macrumors regular

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    #25
    jefhatfield, you need to take some responsibility for what's going on.
     

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