Intel Unveils Full Lineup of Skylake Processors for Notebooks and Desktops, Early 2016 Likely for Most Macs

[manu chao]

Things will not be the same since it is not the same process when it comes to ARM/Intel. In the Rosetta age applications were written and compiled down to byte code (down to the machine language) by the application developer. Rosetta was more of a processor emulator which means that the code itself did not run on the processor, but ran on another program that saw PowerPC code and then emulated the PowerPC and translated it to the Intel platform. Since around 2008, Apple has switched from compile technology that compiles down to bytecode to a bitcode (a cross processor architecture assembly language/binary) that the LLVM compiles into specific processor technology. Usually right now those two steps are done on the developers computer and then uploaded to the app store. The change has all applications being uploaded to the app store as the LLVM bitcode and then as advancements occur in optimization the app store "compiles" it down to the binary (though technically this could be done both as part of installation on OS X as well - technically the same) for a specific processor. As time goes on all the applications as they are updated all will be in that format, then at a certain point Apple will drop any applications that have not been updated (similar to what they did with 32 vs 64 bit). That means that all applications in the app store are basically natively compiled down to whatever processor the customer's computer is running - it is not emulating a processor to run the application... it is not translating different operating systems... it is native operating system (OS 9 and OS X were different operating systems). It will no longer require rosetta or similar transitional technology for changes from processor families like before.

That is what some people thought when Apple added that requirement. In reality, the differences in processors that this process currently can deal with is that between different versions of ARM processors. The system might evolve into something that is able to bridge the gap between ARM and Intel, but that is still a long way off.

One is fanless technology, one requires cooling to be built into the case.... two completely different case designs. Fan requires a bigger case, so you might call it the same but it would look different the size would be different which means you would just be renaming the air and not changing the design.

Yes, 15 W would need a fan but the TDP between the 13" and 15" MBP is quite different as well, in particular once you add the discrete GPU. And re-classification of existing laptop designs has happened before, note the 13" MB that turned into the 13" MBP.

There could be a 5-ish Watt 14" Mac laptop alongside a 15-Watt 13/14" model and alongside a 27-Watt 13" one. But usually Apple tries to keep its model lineup very slim (so it has been messier with drawn-out successions, see the 13" non-retina MBP). Segmenting power envelope by screen size a standard way to do so. Note the absence of a 15" MBA (there certainly is demand for a MBA-like processing power combined with a 15" screen, but Apple decided not to cater to that).

The wattage on the CPUs has to be with heat generated - not the power to run them (though their is a correlation obviously)

I am fully aware of that, that is why it is called Thermal Design Power (TDP).

 

[bkkcanuck8]

That is what some people thought when Apple added that requirement. In reality, the differences in processors that this process currently can deal with is that between different versions of ARM processors. The system might evolve into something that is able to bridge the gap between ARM and Intel, but that is still a long way off.

I did not say it was immediate, but it is not that far away - maybe 2 years.....

Yes, 15 W would need a fan but the TDP between the 13" and 15" MBP is quite different as well, in particular once you add the discrete GPU. And re-classification of existing laptop designs has happened before, note the 13" MB that turned into the 13" MBP.

There could be a 5-ish Watt 14" Mac laptop alongside a 15-Watt 13/14" model and alongside a 27-Watt 13" one. But usually Apple tries to keep its model lineup very slim (so it has been messier with drawn-out successions, see the 13" non-retina MBP). Segmenting power envelope by screen size a standard way to do so. Note the absence of a 15" MBA (there certainly is demand for a MBA-like processing power combined with a 15" screen, but Apple decided not to cater to that).


I am fully aware of that, that is why it is called Thermal Design Power (TDP).

Apple is/was not going to add more models while the supply chain is already constrained for one model - it would not make sense.... Why have two models if you are not going to sell any more in total units - and the blended price would be lower. Once they are able to supply the existing market, then they will likely introduce the rest of the lineup. The case changes for MBP also could not happen until Skylake is out since the Broadwell chip install was only really a bridge update, just updating the processor but nothing else really. It is really all a matter of component supply chain being ready before you can release new models.

 

[Hitman4000]

Mb is a very light and thin laptop to do light work on.
Mba is a moderately thin and light laptop to do regular work on.
Mbp normal laptop form factor, to do heavy / pro work on.




if say a dual core cpu existed that was powerful as your 8core machine. And supports 3 4K monitors. Would that be sufficient ? Not saying this cpu exists though.


The current MacBook pros are great machines



I am one of those folks.
I do think the MacBook Air will get phased out, but I think it will get 1 more generation with skylake cpu. It just makes me sad that they won't also out a Retina display and force touch trackpad in it.

It's true the current Macbook Pro's are great. I might have to get one if the Skylake doesn't come out soon, but I really hate having to spend 2.5 grand on something that will be obsolete and beaten by something 2 months later that will be on average 20-40% faster/better.

 

[Mattsasa]

Definitely wouldn't play LoL without a mouse.

Als, the MBA screen is crappy for games in more ways than just the resolution.

What does a mouse have to do with anything? of course, most pc games are no good without a mouse.
but what does a mouse have to with the laptop? you have to plug in a mouse, just like you would have to do with a gaming notebook...

and I agree, the MBA screen is poor, I wish it was updated. but I am talking about the form factor / cpu and cpu performance of the laptop. This is why I wish the MBA was updated with a retina display keeping the form factor with the ports it has. and the 15W CPU.

yes a retina display would mean weaker battery, but thats fine MBA has plenty. and Skylake is more energy efficient.

Given that the MBP line has two different models, one with a 28 W CPU and one with a 47-ish W CPU (dual-core vs quad-core, Intel GPU vs discrete GPU), a retina Macbook line could have two different models, one with a 4.5 W CPU and one with a 15 W CPU.

ooo, that is a good point. I would be totally content if Apple comes out with a 13" or 14" laptop, that is similar to the MacBook, but with a 15W CPU, and atleast 1 full size usb port. hopefully even more though. and labeled it apart of the macbook line.

yea the 15W 13"/14" MB would be thicker and have a fan, but it could still be thinner than the current MBA

then they could make a redesigned MBP with a 28W cpu, then the 15" with 35 or 45W cpu

It's true the current Macbook Pro's are great. I might have to get one if the Skylake doesn't come out soon, but I really hate having to spend 2.5 grand on something that will be obsolete and beaten by something 2 months later that will be on average 20-40% faster/better.

It won't be 2 months later. the new MBP won't be out until mid 2016 or later.

and it won't be obsolete it will just be 1 generation behind, which is always going to happen

 

[nutjob]

But the applications that weren't rebuilt yet continued to run without almost no limitations or downsides making it possible to stretch out that transition over multiple years without suffering performance reductions. The Classic Environment was available in OS X 10.0 through 10.4, ie, for more than six years. That is quite a long period, giving developers a lot of time to re-write their applications.

Switching to ARM is a smaller change for applications but those applications that have not been modified will run with a significant performance penalty.

That's not really true. OS 9 apps would run, but until about 10.4 OS X was largely broken, so there was no point running them anyway, especially since there weren't any really compelling apps on OS X at that time (besides some hyped stuff from Next that dropped off pretty quickly).

There wouldn't be any performance penalty. Since Apple design their own ARMs they can build some hotter cores that have good single thread performance and also include more efficient cores, much like the big/little arrangements you see today.

I guess people will argue until they go blue in the face about this, but an ARM transition inevitable. Let's revisit this thread in 5 years time.

Meanwhile I've actually seen the work others are doing that will knock Apple off their perch if they don't make this transition, but my lips are NDA'd.

 

[manu chao]

That's not really true. OS 9 apps would run, but until about 10.4 OS X was largely broken, so there was no point running them anyway, especially since there weren't any really compelling apps on OS X at that time (besides some hyped stuff from Next that dropped off pretty quickly).

Are you saying that until OS X 10.4, most people stuck with OS 9? I highly doubt that. The last update to OS 9 came in December 2001, more than three years before 10.4 was released. As much as I can ascertain, from early 2003 and later (under OS X 10.2) new Macs released didn't run OS 9 anymore, three years before 10.4 was released.

I switched to OS X with 10.0.4, though admittedly, I did find it to somewhat challenging to use until 10.1 was released (which was a free update).

There wouldn't be any performance penalty. Since Apple design their own ARMs they can build some hotter cores that have good single thread performance and also include more efficient cores, much like the big/little arrangements you see today.

Sure as soon ARM gets roughly twice the performance per power consumption than Intel, this transition could happen without a performance penalty. But I like to see proof of that before I believe that this is just around the corner.

 

[bkkcanuck8]

It won't be 2 months later. the new MBP won't be out until mid 2016 or later.

and it won't be obsolete it will just be 1 generation behind, which is always going to happen

Depends on which rumours you believe. Some say Oct/Nov for the "2016" MBP some say next year. Since Apple has pre-release versions of chips the MBP design for the next one is probably finished and only waiting for the chips to be released. The rest of the HQ series of chips with Iris Pro graphics are "scheduled" to be released near the end of Oct. And it is very likely if the chips are released in Oct, that high-end manufacturers will start receiving them beforehand (while retail will start receiving them after announcement)... which is not unusual..... So it is conceivable they could be out at the end of Oct or November.

 

[nutjob]

Are you saying that until OS X 10.4, most people stuck with OS 9? I highly doubt that. The last update to OS 9 came in December 2001, more than three years before 10.4 was released. As much as I can ascertain, from early 2003 and later (under OS X 10.2) new Macs released didn't run OS 9 anymore, three years before 10.4 was released.

I switched to OS X with 10.0.4, though admittedly, I did find it to somewhat challenging to use until 10.1 was released (which was a free update).



Sure as soon ARM gets roughly twice the performance per power consumption than Intel, this transition could happen without a performance penalty. But I like to see proof of that before I believe that this is just around the corner.

LOL, what a joke, ARM already gets 5-10x Intel, watt for watt, because they don't go for single thread performance, but it can be done if you sacrifice efficiency, thus my comment. If what you said was remotely true why would Apple use ARMs in phones? They'd have i7's!

Think what you want, soak up as much Intel marketing drivel you want. We'll see what Apple does next.

 

[Michael Goff]

What does a mouse have to do with anything? of course, most pc games are no good without a mouse.
but what does a mouse have to with the laptop? you have to plug in a mouse, just like you would have to do with a gaming notebook...

and I agree, the MBA screen is poor, I wish it was updated. but I am talking about the form factor / cpu and cpu performance of the laptop. This is why I wish the MBA was updated with a retina display keeping the form factor with the ports it has. and the 15W CPU.

yes a retina display would mean weaker battery, but thats fine MBA has plenty. and Skylake is more energy efficient.



ooo, that is a good point. I would be totally content if Apple comes out with a 13" or 14" laptop, that is similar to the MacBook, but with a 15W CPU, and atleast 1 full size usb port. hopefully even more though. and labeled it apart of the macbook line.

yea the 15W 13"/14" MB would be thicker and have a fan, but it could still be thinner than the current MBA

then they could make a redesigned MBP with a 28W cpu, then the 15" with 35 or 45W cpu

If you gave the MBA a retina screen, it'd have worse battery life than a MacBook.

 

[unplugme71]

OK then - how about tell me if you are travelling with the laptop during the day (not home -> office and back - which I consider to be a desktop replacement) .... what do you plug in? I don't see people walking around with printers and plugging them in on the road, flash drives sure but usually to copy things to/from and remove, camera same-same, power if your laptop does not last the full day and you are not at the office/home, external webcam... never see people plug those in when not at home or office, microphone - same, what???). If I go away on the road and stay at a hotel, I will throw extra stuff in the suitcase and then leave them at the hotel .... but I don't lug them around with me in the middle of the day.

I use my laptop at home, work, hotels, remote sites, when visiting family for long periods of time, etc. I even use it in the car while not driving or sometimes I want to leave my house and work at a starbucks or some place similar. I use flash drives, external 2.5" hd for time machine - i like to backup often, especially on certain projects that change a lot. I carry a TB to Ethernet adapter for times when I need to VPN and pull heavy amounts of data or when wifi is not that great. I tether my iPhone while in the car over USB - more reliable and less prone to hacks. I used to have a portable printer that I carried at times, but with more people accepting email transactions and digital signatures, there's less of a need for paper copies. I use my SD card reader a lot for when i take pictures without my iPhone.

I could go on with other devices but I think I ran through enough uses for more than 1 port.

I have a 5000MaH battery that I could plug into the MB and make it get better battery life than any Air. Also, you're not likely to get the estimated 12 hours if you're pushing the CPU.

Anyway, as I've pointed out, the difference is only really there when comparing the i7 version in multithreaded performance.

None of what you said remotely talks about a role, though. See, when people talk about a role of something they point out something it does. Like if you buy something for the role of playing games, or typing a novel. Those are roles. What you gave is nonspecific nonsense.

The role of my laptop is to keep me connected and perform the tasks I need to do for work and personal reasons. What I do exactly is somewhat confidential actually now that I'm under contract for the next 8 years. The extra specs make my job away from a more powerful stationary system easier.

A faster CPU check - that is just specs - what does that faster CPU do for you.... it is not really fast, just faster - but even if it is 25% faster than the Macbook -- the overall performance boost it will give you on an average application will be significantly less. At least I provided a list of USES that would tax or not tax the CPU and which category you would have to move to.... for most everything the jump for things that MUST have a faster CPU for -- you would have to make a jump to pro or above. Just measuring specs is like comparing your weiner... most people's CPU idle 80 - 90% on average... so now you will be down to 80% instead of 90% idle time.... the problem is.... it is not noticeable except for boot time.... but then I put laptops to sleep until I have to patch it.

Better IG... again it is really what it gives you. Things that bog down the Macbook tend to bog down the Macbook air - things like video editing... photo editing can be done quite well on the Macbook.

That battery life will be much shorter once you go retina.... poof advantage all gone.

Connectivity - you mean ports..... If you are looking for a desktop replacement you really should go with the pro or above.... The vast majority of people don't use any ports when they use the laptop as a laptop - instead of a desktop and to be quite honest I would get a dock. Of course that one is really up to the individual to determine their use cases.... I find some people freaking out about the lack of ports and when I ask them what they plug into the computer when not at their desk.... they can't think of anything.... when they are at their desk.... well... they might end up using more than 2 USB ports and every laptop has limitations.

I would like the next version replace that USB port with a USB/Thunderbolt port - that will give you much greater expansion possibilities.

Every little bit of CPU and IG helps with virtualization.

I prefer the smaller unit as its more portable. Try carrying a 15" laptop all day and you'll quickly trade up for a 13".

 

[dukeOfPrunes]

There seems to be some consensus that it makes a lot of sense with a larger retina MacBook (possibly 15 W), while the Airs are gradually phased out and the Pros remain quite similar (slightly thinner, color options etc.). That would make for a lean 2-tier lineup.

So I am wondering about the size vs battery challenge for a hypothetical 13/14" MacBook Retina with 15 W chip. How much thicker and/or heavier would it need to be to drive that 13/14" screen and 3-times-higher TPD chip compared to the current MacBook?

The current 13" Air has a 7150 mAh battery, while the Retina MacBook has a 5263 mAh battery. I guess it would need to be similar to the current Air, possibly with a slightly smaller base area (smaller edge around the screen)?

 

[bkkcanuck8]

The current 13" Air has a 7150 mAh battery, while the Retina MacBook has a 5263 mAh battery. I guess it would need to be similar to the current Air, possibly with a slightly smaller base area (smaller edge around the screen)?

Hence if any Macbook air models were to be absorbed would be the low end of the Macbook Pro line..... Macbook will be reserved for ultra-light laptops.

Adding a retina screen to the Macbook Air would drop the battery specs to around 7 hours.... and Apple is aiming for 9 or 10 hours.... while Skylake is spec'd to add around 1.4 hours.... that leaves between 1.5 and 2 hours that they have to make up or enlarge the macbook air battery.

 

[Technarchy]

While the new processors are exciting, I just today updated from my 2012 Macbook Air to a 2015 Macbook Pro so I am out of the market for a new laptop till 2018 at the earliest.

By then I think the DNA of the 12" Macbook will creep quite a bit into the Macbook Air and Macbook Pro giving us plenty of USB-C and more compact designs. Who knows what the future holds outside of that though.

 

[Michael Goff]

The role of my laptop is to keep me connected and perform the tasks I need to do for work and personal reasons. What I do exactly is somewhat confidential actually now that I'm under contract for the next 8 years. The extra specs make my job away from a more powerful stationary system easier.

Thank you.

 

[Mattsasa]

If you gave the MBA a retina screen, it'd have worse battery life than a MacBook.

so what??
also I am not convinced yes the battery life would go down. but even battery life was cut in half, it would still be an ideal machine

Depends on which rumours you believe. Some say Oct/Nov for the "2016" MBP some say next year. Since Apple has pre-release versions of chips the MBP design for the next one is probably finished and only waiting for the chips to be released. The rest of the HQ series of chips with Iris Pro graphics are "scheduled" to be released near the end of Oct. And it is very likely if the chips are released in Oct, that high-end manufacturers will start receiving them beforehand (while retail will start receiving them after announcement)... which is not unusual..... So it is conceivable they could be out at the end of Oct or November.

Ha,
It's not about believing rumors. It's about knowing intels patterns. There is no way those iris pro CPUs will begin shipping until mid-2016.

I bet none of the 28W and 35/45W skylake processors will be shipping until 2016

 

[DCIFRTHS]

I have been living on a 2008 core2duo model, hopefully I can last another few months for the skylakes... I want to hear it announced in September though.

Me too. 2008 C2D Mac Book Pro

 

[Steve121178]

Depends on which rumours you believe. Some say Oct/Nov for the "2016" MBP some say next year. Since Apple has pre-release versions of chips the MBP design for the next one is probably finished and only waiting for the chips to be released. The rest of the HQ series of chips with Iris Pro graphics are "scheduled" to be released near the end of Oct. And it is very likely if the chips are released in Oct, that high-end manufacturers will start receiving them beforehand (while retail will start receiving them after announcement)... which is not unusual..... So it is conceivable they could be out at the end of Oct or November.

We won't see a new redesigned Skylake based rMBP until late Q1 2016 at the earliest.

 

[MacBH928]

a December release would sound very reasonable. IN time for the holidays and 6 months away from the last minor update

 

[msalman]

Late 2008 Officially classified as 'Vintage' by apple!

Looks like I am not the only one who's still using that model

 

[MacBH928]

Looks like I am not the only one who's still using that model

I wonder what would they call my '02 lamp iMac...

but seriously the '08 macbook is still very strong. I did upgrade the HDD and RAM but everything else is fine and works like the day I got it. Only the battery got weak and the charging cable stopped working for some reason. I replaced them. I love quality products

 

[TheGamerzZ]

It seem's that we need to wait until 2016... Nothing in the keynote about mac o skylake o something... I hate my life

 

[Made In Machines]

Any thoughts on a new date to hope for? Apple releasing apple tv in late october but announcing it now doesn't fill me with hope as they could have done the same with the macbook pro. It probably doesn't mean anything though.

 

[neversink]

oops...

Wonderful chip designed by Intel's Israeli team in Haifa, which also designed the last two chips.
This chip will revolutionize computing. Thank You. I cannot wait.

 

[Codeseven]

Looks like I am not the only one who's still using that model

Yup, me too, late 2008 MBP It's been one of the best money investments I (actually, a birthday present from my wife) have ever made. Dropped, abused, spilled on and overheated, it just keeps plugging away, amazing. Pretty much guarantees me only buying an Apple product to replace it.

 

[Made In Machines]

Yup, me too, late 2008 MBP It's been one of the best money investments I (actually, a birthday present from my wife) have ever made. Dropped, abused, spilled on and overheated, it just keeps plugging away, amazing. Pretty much guarantees me only buying an Apple product to replace it.

Me too. My next laptop has to be a macbook pro. It's just been a joy to use. Mine needed a keyboard replacement after a severe beer spill though.