Is Iraq in a Civil War?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Black&Tan, Aug 4, 2006.

  1. Black&Tan macrumors 6502a

    Black&Tan

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    #1
    At what point can we consider Iraq is enduring a civil war?

    According to Websters,

    Main Entry: civil war
    Function: noun
    : a war between opposing groups of citizens of the same country

    Isn't that what's going on now? Sunni's & Shiites are killing each other, and a hundred bodies are showing up daily. Blair and Bush are hedging the issue, but the US generals in-country appear to be laying the groundwork to declare a civil war.

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/usatoday/ir...UgefVes0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3ODdxdHBhBHNlYwM5NjQ-


    http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/usiraqm...Hu9vF6s0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3ODdxdHBhBHNlYwM5NjQ-

    So again, is the situation in Iraq now a civil war? Is this a political statement (similar to "Mission Accomplished") or a military judgement? At what point can you unequivocally state "this is a civil war"?
     
  2. yg17 macrumors G5

    yg17

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    #2

    A civil war has been going on since we took over.
     
  3. Black&Tan thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Black&Tan

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    #3
    So, is the current administration laying the groundwork to declare that there is a civil war, and use this as an excuse to redefine the occupation? And what ramifications might this foretell..

    1. Cut and Run
    2. Reinstitute the draft (the army has already said it will admit recruits up to the age of 42!) and pour troops into the country
    3. Maintain the status quo.
     
  4. XNine macrumors 68040

    XNine

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    #4
    Very likely scenarios. Rumsfeld kept saying at his press conference that it was not a civil war. But if you look at what's going on, the 50 people a day that are blown up on either side... yeah, it's a total civil war and this administration is guilty of causing it. At least when Saddam was in power there was control over the people...
     
  5. Black&Tan thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Black&Tan

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    #5
    Its a tough call what to do. We caused this situation, yes Saddam was a bad man, but he was no threat to the US or the international community. I feel we have an obligation to repair what we've screwed up. Its the "right" thing to do, regardless of our original idiotic intentions. To do that, we are in a tight spot. We don't have the resources to do the job at the moment and I doubt many in the international community would be willing to help this President. The draft may be a real possibility....I am certainly starting to feel a little concerned, even though I've been out for almost 13 years.
     
  6. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #6
    i don't think that's even possible. how many soldiers would it take to maintain the peace? 300k? a million? even then, is iraq irreparably fractured?

    oddly, though, i wonder if the time for withdrawal has indeed passed, at least for israel's sake. with their little misadventure in lebanon, and bush very "cleverly" allowing the shia to dominate iraq, there is now an unbroken line of shia influence from iran to the north of israel.

    i wonder, if the US did pull out by, say, this fall, if the shia in iraq wouldn't quickly put down the sunnis and kurds via ethnic cleansing, then the entire region focusing their anger at israel.

    we can thank bush "the uniter" for uniting muslim rage against israel while destabilizing the region.
     
  7. Black&Tan thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Black&Tan

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    #7
    Kind of ironic because Bush saw himself as a savior from God.

    "Nabil Shaath says: "President Bush said to all of us: 'I'm driven with a mission from God. God would tell me, "George, go and fight those terrorists in Afghanistan." And I did, and then God would tell me, "George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq …" And I did. And now, again, I feel God's words coming to me, "Go get the Palestinians their state and get the Israelis their security, and get peace in the Middle East." And by God I'm gonna do it."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/stories/2005/10_october/06/bush.shtml
     
  8. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #8
    At least this is what it takes to finally bring our troops home.

    George Stephanopoulos was on ABC World News last night, saying that he's been talking to representatives and senators up and down The Hill, and they are saying that "if" there is a civil war (read: if we formally admit it), whatever Congressional support there is for our involvement in Iraq will simply vanish like *that!*
     
  9. Black&Tan thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Black&Tan

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    #9
    In that case, it will be interesting to see how events are spun to show the American public that "we won," and this is not our generation's Vietnam.
     
  10. Dont Hurt Me macrumors 603

    Dont Hurt Me

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    I would delete all references to God and replace with Cheney, And Cheney would tell me,George go fight..........
     
  11. MACDRIVE macrumors 68000

    MACDRIVE

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    #11
    There's already been a civil war for quite some time now. Bush and Rumsfeld are too timid to use those words though. Remember when the insurgency was getting under way? Rumsfeld was too scared to use that word too. They weren't insurgents, they were "dead enders." :rolleyes:
     
  12. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #12
    it's been suggested that the comments from the generals are actually being directed by the whitehouse, to judge public reaction.

    that the generals are still active lends some support to that theory, imo.
     
  13. KingYaba macrumors 68040

    KingYaba

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  14. Dont Hurt Me macrumors 603

    Dont Hurt Me

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    #14
    Only reason it doesnt "look" like a civil war is because they dont have two large militarys going at it in major battles, just the hit run stuff by both sides while the Iraqi Govt is trying to figure out who's on first.
     
  15. XNine macrumors 68040

    XNine

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    #15
    Nope, not two MILITARIES, but actually, four different sides. You have the Shia, the Kurds, the Sunnis and the United Forces all duking it out, killing, bombing, maiming, raping... This is the WORST kind of civil war. The only reason it hasn't been officially labeled a World War is because it hasn't spilled over into other countries... yet.

    But this is indeed a civil war. I'm just hoping Zim isn't right about the genocide that will take place, though unfortunately it sounds exactly like what would happen if we did get out any time soon.
     
  16. MACDRIVE macrumors 68000

    MACDRIVE

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    #16
    Doesn't genocide mean killing people because of race or religion? 1000 Iraqi civilians have been killed in the month of July...

    CBS News
     
  17. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #17
    It's been a mixture of Shia, Sunni and Kurds. Genocide usually means killing off a particular group of people. Usually because of religion or ethnic background.

    What's happening in Iraq now is sectarian violence bordering on civil war.
     
  18. MACDRIVE macrumors 68000

    MACDRIVE

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    #18
    I know one thing for sure, this whole entire war has been a waste of American lives. :(
     
  19. Dont Hurt Me macrumors 603

    Dont Hurt Me

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    #19
    Im 100% with you, there was no reason to invade Iraq the WMD thing had been taken care of years earlier. George Bush had a agenda of going into Iraq before 911. This administration was spinning all evidence to drag the U.S. people into this. Who's to blame? Our Republican ran Govt is. Plus they havent checked on anything this president has been doing while removing Liberty and Freedoms here at home.

    What a mess brought to us by the very ones who were running under their desks during Nam but these same cowards talk pretty big when someone else is getting killed for their defunk policys. Vote out the Republican and the democrats acting like them is my view. Become Independent and forget partys. They both suck turds and both are owned by the corporations and both are watering down the Constitution.
     
  20. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #20
    Another corker from DHM. May I use that? ;)
     
  21. Dont Hurt Me macrumors 603

    Dont Hurt Me

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    #21
    Im surprised your even asking:D
     
  22. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #22
    Is George Clinton available to run? He did write a song about 1600 Pennsylvania Ave IIRC...
     
  23. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #23
    iraq is not in a civil war. how could they be? they had an election. if the US had an election in 1860, there wouldn't have been a civil war here.

    how can i be so sure? because bush said so!
     
  24. xsedrinam macrumors 601

    xsedrinam

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    #24
    Attempting to postulate a flawed foreign policy via sound bites is not likely to influence anyone or thing. "They the people" are certainly responding to sound bites though.....like "boom" and "bang" and "pow". This is more maddening than listening to NFL and Madden.
     

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