It's a computer, not a matter of national security.

Discussion in 'Hardware Rumors' started by kaisera, Jan 23, 2002.

  1. kaisera macrumors member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2001
    #1
    Hey all

    Why does Apple "not comment on future products." So many other companies make it clear what is in the pipeline. They issue roadmaps, etc. Intel and AMD, obviously they will release faster processors and you can look ahead at their new technology. If Apple would let people know where their products stand, they could certainly do better.

    I am a new convert. Bought an ibook back in October. Love it. I need a system that works for video editing (My AMD 1.4ghz crashes every 22 seconds in Premiere, so no good). I am literally sitting on money that I have been saving since october for a new tower. I am ready to go. But I don't know what to buy.

    It is obvious based on availability (not even rumor sites) that Powermac supply is low and a new update is coming soon.

    So I order a system now, wait the alleged 10 days and then something new will come out? Even if I never read any rumors, CNET posts items about imminent releases.

    Come on Apple, this is not a war with national secrets. Is the computer business where you have the most loyal following of any company.

    Reward us, tell us your plans. Its not a big deal!

    End Rant

    kaisera
     
  2. networkman macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2002
    Location:
    california, usa
    #2
    re: secrecy

    most don't really care in the silicon vallley anyway and the press and rumorboards make it seem bigger than it seems

    there is no doubt that there will be a g5, obviously after the g4, which was after the g3 (second gen powerpc chips were the 603 and 604 and the first generation was the 601)

    at least one rumorboard reveals the truth every time but since apple is down on their financial luck with the company being near its real dollar low stock value of all time and a cash reserve 2 billion below that of its bad 1996 pre-steve jobs fiscal year, things are tough if a secret does hurt sales even a little bit

    the mac market share, according to time magazine, is under five percent and even though the secrets revealed are not of national security nature, hurting apple right now is not a good idea

    the wall street journal, as well as the majority of the press, and some mac users since the beginning like me, are somewhat afraid of apple's future

    and if these forums say anything about apple, there is a lot of negative stuff against the new imac, the computer which supposed to innovate apple out of its slump
     
  3. eyelikeart Moderator emeritus

    eyelikeart

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2001
    Location:
    Metairie, LA
    #3
    my feelings....

    I am afraid of Apple's future myself....but I'm also a positive thinking person....so it's hard to choose one way to feel over the other.....rational or positive?
     
  4. mac15 macrumors 68040

    mac15

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2001
    Location:
    Sydney
    #4
    apple should tell everyone and brag about for a while som people can get $$$ together for it
     
  5. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #5
    Its Apples own fault

    Apple has no one to balme but its self for no market share. IF they had licensed out software than the market share would be higher. If they had a faster chip (mhz myth my ass), if apple had a faster chip sooner they would not be making excuses saying that ghz doesnt matter. It sounds like women when they say size doesn't matter even tho they no it does. If apple had a 1.0+ Ghz chip they would be screaming it from roof tops never mind expos. So the fact that apple has been so hush hush makes me believe that apple is no where close to a faster chip and they are just tring to stall like they always do. So if apple ever goes under they have no one to blame but themselves.
     
  6. quanta macrumors member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2002
    Location:
    Colorado
    #6
    know it all

    i wonder why the last guy even bothered to log on to MacRumors since he obviously knows it all already. Except how to spell. i'm not exactly an expert on Mhz, but i have seen research that shows a quite comparable speed benchmarking between sub-ghz G4's and super-ghz P4's, with the P4 having the advantage in some calculations, and the G4 in others. I've also read that the more cycles a processor performs, the more heat is generated, and it stands to reason that the more heat a processor has to live through, the shorter its lifespan will be (not to mention more delicate parts on the mother board). Most importantly, it is the efficiency of the work done per cycle which gives the G4 its advantage.

    As for the secrecy issue: you may have noticed that since the introduction of the mouse and the Macintosh in 1984, the Others have rushed to imitate the nuances which Mac has pioneered. As an artist i can tell you that there is a reason that you have a gallery opening or an unveiling—and that is because the process of creating something amazing isn't like packing for a vacation. It's messy, filled with setbacks (even mistakes), and sometimes you have to throw away the model and start all over again. In other words, if Apple wrote checks its butt couldn't cash.... well let's just say that 5% is a small number. Besides, what would we all have to speculate about here? It's like God... it's better to wonder what it is than to meet it, right?

    And to MacNut (should MN ever read this): Do you think you could convince a 16 year old kid to give up his video games for a work station? Or teach a boat load of retirees who barely understand how to get around Windows95 how to type in command prompts for OSX? Apple has a small market share, but they sell their computers to the smartest, most creative (i.e. smallest) group of people in the world. Most people drive GM... not everyone can (or should) drive a BMW.

    whatever.
     
  7. sparkleytone macrumors 68020

    sparkleytone

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2001
    Location:
    Greensboro, NC
    #7
    the secrecy is one of those things that makes Apple inherently cool. Think about it. If we all knew about the iPod way before it came out, knew what it looked like during testing phases, knew what to expect. What would be the big deal then?? By the time it came out, people would be like "big deal" and worse yet, someone else could have stolen the idea and gotten a lesser-engineered clone of it to market first. Learn your apple history.

    Plus, you gotta love that feeling. You know the one.:cool:
     
  8. atomwork macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2001
    Location:
    Miami Beach
    #8
    their own fault

    Hi guys,

    first off i am a huge mac addict and since 10 year on board. I like to give my toughts on this article because i really like this discussion. Please no commet on my spelling. Not everyone is native english speaking!!!! You are all right somehow however i feel that no one really mentioned that Apple is selling their products the last decade over still very high priced. Thats for me a major reason why they only have 5 percent of the market share. How can affort to buy their kids or themselfe:) each 2 years one or two G3, G4.... with large monitors and so for 4500 to 6500????

    If they could have produced them with lower prices but equal good i don't know. Still if the macworld was mostly only builded by professionals and only recently they picked up more users by introducing the iMac. Please don't forget this.

    The new iMac is a great utilite now for the low end. I hope the rest of the 95 % will finally get this. I was sitting on windows XP and got frighten to imagen that i would have to work with this if Apple will not survive. So horroble that program, no freedom on the desktop. Sucks to work on one or to have on. Now i can feel again why apple is apple™

    DS
     
  9. menoinjun macrumors 6502a

    menoinjun

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2001
    #9
    These are great ideas, and wonderful posts, but you are all missing the real point that Apple has in mind due to the secrecy. Would you really buy a G4 tower now if you KNEW FOR A FACT that new ones were coming tomorrow for the same price? Why reduce the amount of older models sold the weeks before a release by announcing it early? May as well keep it a secret and get as much money in as you possibly can from the older models.

    It does boggle my mind why they would cannibalize "older" iMacs by releasing the new ones and not shipping them immediately, but you have to look at the price points. You can see how they are really two completely different animals, and some people just don't need a new G4 iMac.

    -Pete

    P.S. Also...Macworlds are an event to be covered by the media. They wouldn't be if Apple released info earlier.
     
  10. -=AsukA=- macrumors member

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2002
    #10
    kaisera....

    Dearest kaisera,

    I know it must be killing to have to wait for a new computer, however if you do wait you will not be disapointed! give it till march, or MacWorld Tokyo, the G5 WILL prevail! and be released soon! your money will be put to good use when you buy the new GHz monter from apple. and it will just SREAM through Premiere (you should consider getting Final Cut Pro 3 or even 2 if you can find it foor a good price!) a new G5 would be blazingly fast in video editing. Yes if you dont wait and buy now, youl want to shoot yourself in the foot after the new G5 is released! So suck it up only 2 months to go and youl have the fastest ma in history and even better something to make your PEE-CEE friends pee there pants over! now you may be asking what makes me so sure the G5 is comming out? well consider this... the iMac is G4, the towers are G4, even if apple just mad the towers a little faster the Pro users (like your self) would not be to impressed. the time has come for apple to take the spotlight yet again with the new iMac as the worlds coolest computer. And the G5 being announced by motorolla, apple needs to grab the PEE CEE world by the balls and remind us all that they alone created the personal computer era, and they will recreat it with the fastes desktop in the world!


    yea you laugh at me now but when steve jobs shows the world his new tower you will ALL be amazed! remember when the G4 came out? they made the biggest deal about the G4 being a supper computer, well the G5 will be even bigger. I am willing to bet that the G5 will show its true colors againt the Best PEE CEE $ can buy in Photoshop 7.0 (under OS X.2) and believe me this thing WILL rape them all! (the G5 that is) The G5 will open a new era for apple, ther MHz #'s will climb dramaticly in the next year, most likely surpasing the P4 in the future. Dont believe me? consider this the Pentium was always based as a consumer chip, not profetional! every pro user knows that AMD and the itanium are the best chips out there! (in the PEE CEE world) why you ask? well the same reason Windows did so well, it ripped off the macs features. and now the chips are trying to be be like PPC's. the G5 will make a new level of divition between apple and the PEE CEE world. And will force them to go back to the drawing board, to try to come up with a way to be like apple once again. for all those who doubt apples future... apple is not in trouble finalcialy or economecly. they are makeing profits while other companys are slowly dieing in this unstable econemy, the iBook is the best consumer notebook, the iPod is the best portable MP3 HD player (for its size features and weight) the new and old iMac are insanly popular! every where you look, every comic strip you read, every movie you see, has a iMac in it now adays! why? they look cool! people want the latest coolest things, look at cars along time ago people where happy with tape decks and AC. now people want heated leather butt gripping seats and CD stereos.


    The G5 IS the next best thing to come from apple since the mouse! if you ask me anyone that buys a Pro powermac tower B4 the G5 comes out will be missing out BIG time! This is what we have all been waiting for the GHz era! and what better package than a 64 Bit altivec chip! (with 400MHz frontside bus and DDR-RAM) now tell me this would you still settle for a G4?
     
  11. DakotaGuy macrumors 68040

    DakotaGuy

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2002
    Location:
    South Dakota, USA
    #11
    Apple's not going away

    I look at it this way. Sure Apple is not doing as well in the markets as they were a couple of years back...but...name a computer maker that is doing better now then they were then??? At least I can't. What Apple has going for it is brand loyality like none other, quality, style, and value. Some may not say Apple is a value driven product, but when you look at the entire picture...life of the product, maintenance, performance and resale then the picture becomes much clearer.

    I think Apple has no choice when it comes to secrecy. If they had flashed the iPod all over months before it came out...the competition would have been right there waiting. Sure the competition will come out with products that are copies, but that lag in time is what puts a product ahead of the other in refinement and sales. The same is true with the new iMac...we will see copies from PC makers, but by the time they catch on...the iMac will be way ahead. Remember the iPaq?hehe

    Most companies are secret about new products. Look at car makers. Sure there are spy photos and rumors, but when a new product is about ready to come out it is usually shown to the public just shortly before it is on showroom floors. A good example of this is the just released 2003 Ford Expedition. I read an article where the project was kept under wraps as tight as possible so that GM would not find out that Ford planned a new independent rear suspension and a 3rd row seat that folds up with a push of a button. If Ford had blabbed this out a year ago...what they were planning to do what would the Tahoe have on it right now? Okay so I can't afford to drive a big-ol SUV, but I think it is a good example of other companies that keep secrets about future products.
     
  12. madamimadam macrumors 65816

    madamimadam

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2002
    #12
    Re: Its Apples own fault

    To make a summary version instead of blabbering like many others, Apple stay HUSH HUSH because when they release stuff we all go "OMG, WOW, I am getting one NOW". If they told us way ahead, as has been said, the ideas would be ripped off and people would be less excited.

    As for the MHz myth and ***** length, sounds like someone thinks they have a big package and that is why it mattered. ***** length means NOTHING unless it is an ABSOLUTE extreme. If it is WAY small then it will not fill enough of the vagina and if it is only a couple of cm bigger than the "average" size it is regularly too big for the female and hurts if thrusted too heavily. Similarly to computers, if the MHz are WAY to low, the computer is too slow and if they are WAY to high they are too slow because they just move, they do not hit the right spots. If, however, they are medium and they know how to hit the spots that count, they exceed the rest by many times over.
     
  13. networkman macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2002
    Location:
    california, usa
    #13
    sparkleytone has a point in the above post

    the cool factor, and i admit this as a techie, is half the reason why i buy a mac

    it's the design, the color, the ruggedness of the thick clear and colored plastic, and the secrecy which is 50 percent of the reason i buy...i admit it

    when i was at the microsoft school, the teacher, a pc engineer, said, it's all about what is under the hood...no wonder why pc machines are still mostly beige...but it does explain why they get the graphics cards first more often and why they are "faster" and have "better" ram

    the pc companies don't have to spend on industrial design
     
  14. grrr223 macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2002
    Location:
    Philadelphia
    #14
    I read somewhere, that IN CERTAIN INDUSTRIES (don't jump down my throat with counter examples, I'm not saying they don't exist) that it is more effective to just keep their product a secret than to patent it, because patents are publicly available. Secrets are very important in many industries. I agree with Ptrauber that they don't want to caniblize sales of current models they have in inventory, and I also agree with madamimadamtimallen that the secrecy is necessary to prevent cheap imitations. Every computer company copies Apple in sooo many ways. They need every advantage they can get, and even a few months is all that is necessary to stay ahead. Look at e-machines making ****ty ripoffs of the original imacs, or newer ones like dell I think has towers that open on the side. Or even more subtle things like the "breathing" power light on the monitor when it is sleeping (you have to see this to know what I'm talkign about, but it's cool).

    I work for the IT dept. at MIT, and i've been setting up G4s with Apple's 17 inch flat screen for a ton of people. They love them. One lady says that she likes to just sit back and stare at her Mac cuz it is so beautiful. If you've ever used the flatscreen, it's kickass. you just touch your finger to the power button on the monitor, and the computer turns on. and you do the same thing on a spot on the other side and the monitors control panel opens. m miy end to set up. There is exactly ONE cable that connects from the monitor to the tower that carries, the video information, POWER, as well as the USB for the two USB ports on the back of the monitor. For what me, and many other people use their computers for, i don't care about a lot of things as much as just the seamless integration of Apple's products. Dell offers flatscreen montiors too, but they don't offer any of the features I just mentioned or are they as gorgeous.

    If anyone read the article mentioned here in a thread about the differences between jobs and gates, one of them is that they have very different ideas of "winning." Gates wants to take over the world, while Jobs just wants to do what he is doing better every day, in his mind, he has already won. Soo many PC users bitch about mac's small market share. While it is not a desireable position, and we all konw that more market share means more capital, etc., Apple is not selling computers to every market. Apple does what it does better than most other companies out there.

    Someone else mentioned how, while Apple may not have the market share of some other competitors, it is doing better at the moment than a lot of other computer makers. If you want a cheap computer, go buy an e-machines which now offers a >1Ghz machine for $400. But you get what you pay for, me, on the other hand, I want something that actually works, and works well, so, when I do ever get the money, I will buy whatever Apple's latest machine is.

    I'll stop talking now :)
     
  15. thirdeg macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2002
    Location:
    Germany
    #15
    Because Ford has a larger market share than Aston Martin or Ferrari, does it mean they make better cars?
     
  16. DakotaGuy macrumors 68040

    DakotaGuy

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2002
    Location:
    South Dakota, USA
    #16
    Ford owns Aston Martin...oh I know this is not a vehicle board...but I just had to add that...
     
  17. thirdeg macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2002
    Location:
    Germany
    #17
    The only reason Ford bought them was because there was no way someone was going to pay $160,000 for a Ford never mind how fast they made it.
    It is all about style and refinement, that is what I think Ive is trying to achieve, to make the Mac more of a fashion accessory.
     
  18. madamimadam macrumors 65816

    madamimadam

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2002
    #18
    Excuse my ignorance but I regularly see MIT when I choose my job occupation on OS installs but never knew what it meant.
     
  19. madamimadam macrumors 65816

    madamimadam

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2002
    #19
    In the same sense, you would never see a cheap Ferrari and there is a good chance that if Apple released a $400 iMac the market share of it would be too small to keep it a current line.
     
  20. grrr223 macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2002
    Location:
    Philadelphia
    #20
    MIT is the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. It's only the best science and engineering school in the friggin' world :)! Just to let you know. Have a nice day. It's a fun place to be, every single person here is smarter than I am.
     
  21. networkman macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2002
    Location:
    california, usa
    #21
    mit?

    but the farm is much better

    btw, beat the bears
     
  22. networkman macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2002
    Location:
    california, usa
  23. networkman macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2002
    Location:
    california, usa
    #23
    none of them

    the best college in the world is the one with the best curling team...and that is the truth
     

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