More Ted Haggard fallout!

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by leekohler, Dec 12, 2006.

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  1. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #1
    How many of the mighty will fall? ;)

    http://www.planetout.com/news/article.html?date=2006/12/11/4

    Second Colo. pastor resigns over gay-sex scandal

     
  2. Thanatoast macrumors 6502a

    Thanatoast

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    #2
    I don't like religions that are supposed to be unifying and uplifting to torture people. Decades of anguish because what you feel is frowned upon according to a book written by men thousands of years ago is unacceptable.
     
  3. Queso macrumors G4

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    #3
    If I were God, I'd remove all religion from the Earth. It causes people too much pain.
     
  4. leekohler thread starter macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #4
    Well, given that Barnes is now 54 years old, when exactly does he think that God will "take this away"? When will he figure out that God won't take it away? Sad, really.
     
  5. Queso macrumors G4

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    #5
    He can't see it as anything other than a bad thing, that's the tragedy, and there are thousands of others like him crying themselves to sleep too, if not millions.
     
  6. princealfie macrumors 68030

    princealfie

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  7. leekohler thread starter macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #7
    Do you have something of relevance to add? I'm getting a sense you might be getting ready for another one of your threadjackings, given your discomfort in the past with this subject matter. If that's the case, please don't.
     
  8. princealfie macrumors 68030

    princealfie

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    Of course, I find the hypocrisy of such men puzzling. And that is my 2 cents on the whole matter. :mad:
     
  9. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    #9
  10. princealfie macrumors 68030

    princealfie

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    #10
    Should we be feeding them dim-sum instead? Geewhiz. One for the vegans then.
     
  11. stillwater macrumors regular

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    #11
    This makes me wonder how much homophobia is the result of self loathing.

    Its almost at the point where you can calculate the probability of a pastor being gay by how strongly he preaches against homosexuality.
     
  12. Queso macrumors G4

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    #12
  13. Dont Hurt Me macrumors 603

    Dont Hurt Me

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    #13
    Lets face it selling of religion is a big business for gay and non gay folks.
     
  14. princealfie macrumors 68030

    princealfie

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    #14
    Thank goodness I'm not that kind of religious :cool:
     
  15. Kalns macrumors regular

    Kalns

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    #15
    I don't understand why you all seem so happy over the destruction of a man's life. Though I've eased my views as of late I would be very tempted to actively work against you if you persisted in delighting over the suffering of my brothers and sisters in Christ.
     
  16. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #16
    perhaps it may have been his public anti-gay attitude, which may have indicated he wished for the destruction of the lives of gays.

    maybe.
     
  17. leekohler thread starter macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #17
    He's brought a lot of suffering to others as well, like zim said. This particular kind of "Christian" deserves much worse than a bit of ridicule, although I do see what you're saying.

    But the key quote was when he said he'd been dealing with it since he was a small child. What he needs to understand is that God will never make him straight because he was never meant to be. He's now how old? What isn't he getting at this point in his life? Kalns, you know my story and I have little to no sympathy for someone who's done as much harm as he has condemning people for being something that he himself, is.

    However, were he to apologize to those of us who have accepted ourselves and live honest lives, he would have not only my sympathy but also my respect. That is certainly not too much to ask.
     
  18. Kalns macrumors regular

    Kalns

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    #18
    Contrary to what you may think, in both Haggard's case and this case, it wasn't the destruction of gays they wanted, but rather the salvation. I mean let's make it really simple. Is Ted Haggard somehow denied access to heaven because he was found out to be having a gay affair? No, of course not. BUT, the cost of his sin was the loss of his leadership positions at both the church and as the leader of the national association of evangelicals.

    Despite the fact that I'm a premillenial kind of guy, quite honestly, if I continue to see the kind of vitriol from the gay community towards Christians that I currently see, I'm fully willing to take on a postmillenial attitude in dealing with that issue.
     
  19. Kalns macrumors regular

    Kalns

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    #19

    I'm a liar and yet I condemn lying.
    I've stolen and yet I condemn stealing.
    I've struggled with lust and yet I condemn lusting.
    I've struggled with alchohol and yet I condemn drunkeness.

    All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.


    Knowing the right path and walking it are two seperate things. I'm well aware of what God teaches and yet I consistently fail to live up to that standard. Reason being that the standard is Christ. And yet, despite my many failures, do I give up? No, because I also have hope in Christ and for that reason I continue to strive to be like Him and little by little, day by day, I'm getting there.
     
  20. vniow macrumors G4

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    Uhh, what exactly is this supposed to mean? Salvation as in turning straight and normal and living a Godly life? If so then that is a destruction of being gay.
     
  21. leekohler thread starter macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #21
    Kalns, I'm curious- how do you think this animosity started? Do you think we gays just decided out of the blue to hate Christians? You don't see any cause for any of us to be angry? Now perhaps we should all take the high road, no arguement there. But you know what? We're human too. And I react quite negatively when someone wants to deny me rights, call me names, or worse. And I'm sorry kalns, but a lot of that comes from people who claim to be "Christian". So forgive us if we get a bit upset from time to time.

    That said, I know plenty of true Christians like yourself who are nothing like this man.
     
  22. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #22
    whatever the rationalization, it's still using one's position of power to effect change and direct negative attention to people who want neither. i don't know of any gay groups trying to get haggard or any other christian leader to switch to atheism.
     
  23. Kalns macrumors regular

    Kalns

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    #23
    Quite honestly Leekoler I think it started with Leviticus and was reinforced with Romans and was then used by ignorant Christians and ignorant gays (who both ignored vital pieces of the gospel message) as a means of polarizing and demonizing one group or the other for the sake of having a tangible community at which to direct their ire. Any Christian who hates a gay person for being gay is quite simply wrong to do so. Similarly, any gay person who hates a Christian just because they are a Christian is wrong as well.

    I'm currently enrolled in one of the top Christian universities in the country and religion is my major. I only just started at this school and with this major this semester (though I've already completed three years elsewhere) and what I'm finding is that much of the truth behind the Bible is not taught in churches. In my own experience, it seems as if the message has to be watered down terribly to cater towards those in attendance which might not have a solid theological and Biblical foundation. I understand why this is the case of course, but it comes at a heavy cost. In place of sound doctrine, people arm themselves with ignorance and they never bother to fill in the blanks, always assuming that it must just be another "mystery of God". Are there mysteries of God? Certainly, but not as much as some may think. For instance, in Revelation it speaks of a swarm of locusts with long hair and faces like men. Most people would read that and think "what the hell?" But if you understand the historical and literary context, you know this to be a prophecy of the fall of Rome at the hands of the "barbarians" aka the locusts with faces like men.

    The point of all of that was that the vast majority of Christians are not educated about their faith and sadly these are the ones who become the poster children of it. For instance, ever seen that Jesus Camp movie? I cringe watching it because the people being portrayed simply don't understand their faith.
     
  24. Kalns macrumors regular

    Kalns

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    A pastor is in the business of preaching the gospel, teaching the body and helping those who would accept it find salvation in Christ. It makes sense why they would try to effect change in people's lives. Yes, some do it in terrible and ungodly ways, but the masses should not suffer because of the actions of the ignorant.
     
  25. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    i'm not certain who you're referring to with the masses and the ignorant.
     
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