Native Instruments Guitar Rig Available June 14th!

Discussion in 'Mac Apps and Mac App Store' started by sonofsam, Jun 8, 2004.

  1. sonofsam macrumors member

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    #1
  2. fingers macrumors regular

    fingers

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    #2
    Will i ever lose my gear lust? I doubt it - I have a HUGE wishlist... G5, 30" monitor and now GuitarRig...

    I wonder how it compares to amplitude? Anyone tried them both yet?
     
  3. sonofsam thread starter macrumors member

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    #3
    I haven't tried Amplitube but I was over at a friend's house trying out Guitar Rig and I must say it kicks some serious ass! This thing is really amazing sounding and I didn't even scratch the surface. You could spend endless hours tweaking the sounds and effects.

    The Mesa hi-gain and clean sounds were very impressive. This thing sounds amazing in headphones. The effects are lush and full sounding and top notch quailty. You can drag and drop components into your virtual rack and switch the order and individual presets for each effect/amp. It was so much fun that I didn't want to stop playing it.

    I want a G5 and a 30" too! But this is first on my list.
     
  4. fingers macrumors regular

    fingers

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    #4
    It must be good! :D
     
  5. fingers macrumors regular

    fingers

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    #5
    There is a time limited demo available now - so we can now have a play... :eek:
     
  6. Xenious macrumors 6502a

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    #6
    So are they going to make a hardware input device for getting the guitar level signal into the computer?


    Never mind, its built into the foot controller.

    mmmmm guitar rig.
     
  7. D*I*S_Frontman macrumors 6502

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    #7
    My take on the demo Guitar Rig

    Thought I'd weigh in here.

    Just so you know where I'm coming from, I was an early adopter of the digital modeling amp concept via Line 6. For decades before, amp makers kept telling musicians that they could get "tube" sounds out of a solid state amp. Lies. All lies. Until Line 6 came along.

    As far as hardware solutions are concerned, I think it's safe to say that the current genereation of Line 6 gear (Vetta II amps and Pod XT Pro rack modules) are the top of the line. But in the software-only world, I think NI's Guitar Rig may be the new champ, especially for Mac users (Line 6 STILL has not ported Amp Farm over to Mac yet or they would have been a big contender for NI).

    I have demoed Guitar Rig using my MOTU 896HD as an interface, which in and of itself was very interesting, seeing that the interface can sample at 192k/24bit resolution. Guitar Rig can actually process at that speed as well, but it puts a crush on your processers like you wouldn't believe! I have since played with Guitar Rig at more reasonable resolutions, and have been very impressed.

    I am a huge Brian May/Queen fan, and the first thing I tried was copping his sound. The demo has a "ACBox" amp model that is supposed to be a Vox AC30 Top Boost amp. More importantly, they also have a corresponding treble booster pedal model. Using them in exactly the same way Brian sets his up (Normal channel up full, Brilliant up full, all other knobs at 0, and the treble booster set on the "Hot but Mellow" preset) then miking it similarly (edge miked with a Neumann 87 with a 3db boost on bass & treble, distanced miked with another 87 flat eq with lots of air, with the distance miking signal quieted to -15db) I nailed it. Now keep in mind that my guitar has three vintage-wound kent Armstrong reissue Burns TriSonic pick-ups, which makes up a big part of the sound. Still, the tone I got sounds remarkably better than any set up I have ever tried.

    Another weird thing about this--the model is noisy, but with exactly the same operation noise the REAL gear would create in a studio. I have the Brian May instructional video, and in it you occasionally hear the hiss from his amp when he isn't playing. The noise from the ACBox + Treble Booster set-up in Guitar Rig sounds EXACTLY the same.

    There is an American stereotype about Germans--that they are precision detail freaks--which is why we Yanks love Posches, BMW's, Audis, Mercedes, and VWs so much. Well, it would seem that German audio software engineers have the same uncompromising commitment to perfection that their automotive engineer counterparts possess. I was blown away by the realism of this product at high resolution. Ahh, the benefits of Teutonic pride...

    The product was pretty user friendly, too. Some of the effect parameters didn't make perfect sense at first glance, but the basic amp and distortion pedals were very intuitive, and setting up your "rig" by pulling options over from a list on the left to a "rack" on the right was also very simple.

    I can't wait to use this product on our next album project. The idea of being able to switch amps and/or tweak inline effects AT MIXDOWN (and not be committed to anything beforehand) without retracking any parts--well, that's a DREAM...!
     
  8. fingers macrumors regular

    fingers

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    #8
    Thanks for your detailed observations :)

    When I first heard about Guitar Rig - I thought - ok another amp simulator. Yawn - I'll stick with my sans amp...

    Now I am gonna be dreaming about this sucker too... The creative possibilities are pretty mind boggling and like you said the Teutonic design and detail they have crafted into this app seems pretty amazing.

    Brian May's guitar sound has got to be one of the holy grails for many guitarists. For a software product to emulate his old school ac30 all tube class A amp sound (and his treble boost pedal) is incredible. I can't wait to try the amps, bassman cabs, the Tubescreamer "pedal" et al (i could go on...)

    I will download the demo tonight - but how am I gonna convince my wife that I simply MUST have the full product? LOL
     
  9. sonofsam thread starter macrumors member

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    #9
    This thing is truly amazing. The 1.1 update has the Vox amp model and a few new effects including a Psychodelic Delay with a reverse button on it to get Jamman type of looping effects.

    Emulating the noise of an amp setup eh? That is too cool, I don't know what to say about that other than wow...
     
  10. fingers macrumors regular

    fingers

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    #10
    My sentiments exactly - I spent about 15 minutes with the demo yesterday and was lost for words - just clicking through the presets was a blast. Tried it on a couple of guitar tracks on a GarageBand song and it added a classy dimension to my mix.

    I will do a full report soon but it really is good and a lot of fun.
     
  11. D*I*S_Frontman macrumors 6502

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    #11
    Brian May Rip-off Tone Settings

    OK, I've tweaked and tweaked. Here is a revision of my tone settings suggestions:

    Treble Booster:
    "Crispy"

    AC Box:
    Both channel volumes up, everything else down to 0

    Cab/Mic (just one):
    Cab 6 (2x12 60's Brit), size=0 (normal size)
    Edge-Miked
    Mic 4 (Condensor 87)
    EQ flat
    Air=depends on the song, anywhere from 30-100%

    The thing that makes it really work is their "Air" setting. Gives you lots of "room" sound. Some Queen songs ("Brighton Rock", "We Will Rock You") have a ton of room ambience, most of the others less, but you need at least 25-30% air to bring out the cab sound, IMHO.

    Again, a disclaimer: use a guitar with TriSonics in it to have any hope of REALLY nailing the tone perfectly. But this is by FAR the cheapest way to get a great BHM tone to tape--one Burns May guitar ($700) and Guitar Rig ($400) will get you there. At that point, your playing will make more of a difference than your gear (c.f. sites that demo May guitars through the real Booster/Vox combo).

    Guitar Rig is incredible. But quite the resource hog @ 192k/24bit!!

    Bart of DIS
     
  12. sonofsam thread starter macrumors member

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    #12
    I am going to try your settings and see how that sounds, thanks for the info.

    I have noticed that it is quite the resource hog at 30-40% in GB, and usually 40-50% in Cubase. Lucky for me it has not crashed or anything.

    I can't stop playing with the reverse delay...
     
  13. D*I*S_Frontman macrumors 6502

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    #13
    Try two single coils, series, one out of phase, neck and middle positions with that setting.

    Can you say
    "TIE YOUR MOTHER DOWN!" or
    "DEATH ON TWO LEGS!"

    Then try middle/bridge pickups, in phase, in series, and crank the "air" to 100%

    "WE WILL ROCK YOU!"

    I have spent about 50 man hours A/B'ing these settings with the Queen studio tracks via iTunes and these are amazingly close if you have the right pickups. Find a friend who bought one of those cheap $700 Burns May guitars and try it out. I doubt a Strat or Les Paul will really do this justice, although a rear humbucker guitar might be able to pull off the "We Will Rock You" sound somewhat.

    I can't believe what a blast I am having with this thing!
     
  14. sonofsam thread starter macrumors member

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    #14
    I admire the fact that you are taking your time tweaking it. I don't have the patience to do that at the moment.

    I will try what you said. I have 4 guitars with different pickups so I will go through them all. Guitar Rig is addicting isn't it???

    I can't stop...
     
  15. fingers macrumors regular

    fingers

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    #15
    I can't wait to try these settings out - thanks!

    Probably won't sound as good on my wife's Squier Strat but it'll be a lot closer to his tone than I could possibly dial in.

    Now if I could just borrow Mr Brian May's fingers... :D
     
  16. D*I*S_Frontman macrumors 6502

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    #16
    Fingers, Sonofsam:

    Please post your reflections after you use my suggested settings. I am curious if you can obtain the same results with non-Burns pickup configs.
     
  17. Snarf! macrumors member

    Snarf!

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    #17
    OMG OMG OMG

    I spendt 2000$ on a MArshall TSL122 mainly for use in my studio two years ago. And I always thought that those amps where the best (combos atleast) in the world. but Now I`m playing with the guitar RIG demo, and its freaking me out BIG time. It sounds awesome with my Les Paul. Now I`m considering buying it for studio use. I never thought a computer app could sound this good. Even on my 12" iBook at home it runs smoooooth..
    Gotta love them germans..
     
  18. fingers macrumors regular

    fingers

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    #18
    I had a quick go last night - I did a recording of Tie Your Mother Down using your settings. I will try and upload it at my .mac account tonight if I get a chance - just for for academic purposes of course. ;) I will let you know the url when I have posted it. I used my wife's Squier Strat (£125 new!) and the pickups are a bit brittle sounding. I used the out of phase setting between the neck and middle pickups as you suggested. I need to buy the original recording off the itms to see how close I came - I know for a fact that it won't sound like Brian - but I had a lot of fun - before my daughter decided I needed to help her with her colouring in :) .

    I used to play this song live about 10 years ago as a duo - it's a lot of fun and I have forgotten many of the changes but I am sure my mistakes will make you laugh!

    Thanks for the settings - it won't change a cheap strat into a Brian May replica - but it's a great tone anyway! :) What I like about it is that it doesn't sound like a software setting - it sounds like the real thing to me. I am sure if I still had my Les Paul Classic (i reversed one of the pickups to try and get that Peter Green out o phase sound) It would have sounded fantastic - the guitar tone anyway - not my playing ;)

    Thanks again!
     
  19. sonofsam thread starter macrumors member

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    #19
    I have got to agree with fingers... It is a very cool tone but I wasn't really getting the Brian May sound mainly in my case because I have EMG's in 2 of my guitars, and DiMarzio's and cheap Fender strat pickups in my other 2 guitars.

    I thought your settings were very interesting! Once I dialed it in I saw what you were going for. Nice job!

    :)
     
  20. fingers macrumors regular

    fingers

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    #20
    Here's my attempt at nailing "Tie your mother". As I mentioned before I haven't played this song in years, it's on a cheap guitar and I'm even cheaper... But anyway don't laugh too much at the mistakes - (I am sure they will make you cringe!) and Brian - I am truly sorry! LOL

    I'll take it down in a couple of days.

    Tie your guitarist down
     
  21. sonofsam thread starter macrumors member

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    #21
    Hey man, I enjoyed it! It sounds a lot closer to the sound than it did for me. The sound is pretty close to the original for sure.

    :)
     
  22. fingers macrumors regular

    fingers

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    #22
    Thanks Dude :)

    It's a lot of fun to play - and probably a lot more fun to listen to it - I am really proud of all the fluffed changes. :) I need to check the tone out to compare it to the original recording - I set the 'air' to 50% which seemed ok to me, and i purposely didn't add any reverb or anything so you could hear just the effect.
     
  23. D*I*S_Frontman macrumors 6502

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    #23
    Dude, send me an mp3 of that backing track and let me give it a shot with my Red Special Wannabie! PLEASE?! PRETTY PLEASE??!!!
     
  24. sonofsam thread starter macrumors member

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  25. fingers macrumors regular

    fingers

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    #25
    Seeing as you asked so nicely - try the link above again ;) Can't wait to hear what your gonna do with it!

    Tip: Ignore the very first click, then when the clicks start again start on the 2nd bar. The first click was just so that I knew the song was starting when we did it 'live'.
     

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