Next-Generation Apple TV Said to Launch in October for $149 or $199

[chagla]

rather than getting a glorified streaming box, one can get a full blown PC for tvs. it's called "intel compute stick"

http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/compute-stick/intel-compute-stick.html

Amazon sells them for ~$150.

 

[malexandria]

This is where something like the XboxOne and PS4 have blurred lines. $399 gets you a much more powerful box that can do full gaming, has all the same streaming optins and more.... and full app stores. (X1 will also run Win10 in a few months and Win10 apps). You can also already put Plex on Xbox One. All the apps you'll see hit the app store are things you can also get from Windows store already. Once you hit a $200 option (gonna bet $149 without gaming controller and $199 with gaming controller) you are almost better off just springing for a console unless you have no desire to game.... and than if you are that person, $60 for the old ATV or getting a Roku (which has far more to offer at this current time than ATV) would be your best option.

The Problem is, iTunes Digital files will only work with ATV and I have a lot invested in it - mainly because I have a lot of Blu-rays with Digital copies and lately the Digital deals have been too good to pass up.

 

[maxsix]

Who would buy a device released three-and-a-half years ago knowing that it will most likely lose support next year?

I'm not surprised, it's just a matter of learning the obsolescence model that Apple uses.
Keeping their robust profits is crucial.

 

[JoeShades]

rather than getting a glorified streaming box, one can get a full blown PC for tvs. it's called "intel compute stick"

http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/compute-stick/intel-compute-stick.html

Amazon sells them for ~$150.

A new one is coming out in the fall with More RAM and Windows 10

 

[Juicy Box]

Who would buy a device released three-and-a-half years ago knowing that it will most likely lose support next year? They should just discontinue the device now before those who buy it complain that it's not compatible with the next upgrade.

Although it isn't new from Apple, older iPods sell well on ebay

 

[brendu]

It would work with lower storage IF it could pull data off a local NAS (network attached storage) such as off an Apple Time Capsule or similar device. Streaming sections of a game over a WiFi network (or even better, wired) from a massive home storage system is completely viable. Keep in mind the Blueray drive of the PS3 allowed for games ranging from 20 to 60 GB of data (mostly in textures). While the Internet is getting robust, I'm not convinced its ready for a flood of Digital only "casual" game players pulling down that much information per game. Even with services like Steam, seeing a 60 GB install hurts.

The PS3/X360 get away with it because they use and ship physical media which takes a big load off storage and data transmission.

Now if this new AppleTV comes with a Fusion Drive solution, combined Flash and Hard Disk, I could see that being a good reason to bump up the price 50 or so dollars. Off NewEgg I can find a 2 TB 2.5" HDD for ~ $110. I'm sure Apple can get better deals. Getting a Fusion Drive in the AppleTV would solve many storage issues including 4k and 5k TV/Movies. You could even easily wrap AppleTV hardware around a more traditionally sized 3.5" HDD and get 4 TB for that price.

The reason to move away from HDD is power use, especially in laptops and other batter powered devices. Spinner platter drives just eat more power. However an AppleTV is stationary and plugged into power.

I hadn't thought of a fusion drive. That's very possible if the rumors of a redesign turn out true.

 

[wxman2003]

No thanks Apple. A new ATV that can't support 4K? DOA

 

[virduk]

No thanks Apple. A new ATV that can't support 4K? DOA

Certainly it would be odd if Apple at the same introduces 4k recording iPhones. Otherwise I can understand it. Its not like Apple is to sell 4k content on iTunes anytime soon, and 4k streaming content will be limited for a good while. Though with the 4k discs shipping at the end of the year that will mean more prepared 4k content for services to license.

So they could wait a year or two to introduce a 4k model.

 

[virduk]

Most people who have an interest in games are satisfied by something more like Angry Birds on their mobile phones. The percentage of the population who needs games that push the GPU of a PS4 is getting pretty small. An A8-based game rig will be good enough for the bulk of the population, including those who spend Billions on iOS App store games.. with a price equal or lower than that of a subsidized iPhone or iPod Touch.

A gen 4 Apple TV may put the same screws to the big budget Xbox/PS gaming industry that the iPhone (and Android) did to Blackberry, Symbian and Brew developers. I wouldn't depend on their being as much new content for your $300+ game console in a few years.

I just wonder how many phone game players who don't own a console or a gaming pc actually want to play games on their TV. Its like all the other microconsoles in that respect. Especially if the games are developed with the TV and its interface in mind rather than ports of Angry Birds.

I also wonder about having a game focused TV device thats weaker than the current portable iOS devices. So you will possibly have games that run worse on a ATV than they do on a same gen iPad or iPhone.

 

[Juicy Box]

No thanks Apple. A new ATV that can't support 4K? DOA

I am not saying that the new Apple TV won't support 4K, but I would be a little surprise if it did.
The 2nd Gen Apple TV was only 720p, because that was what iTunes had at the time.

Honestly, I am surprised about all the posts about 4K. I am not sure I even know anyone that has a 4K TV yet.

 

[Keirasplace]

A new one is coming out in the fall with More RAM and Windows 10

Reviews aren't that great.... Also, if people wanted a computer plugged on their TV, they'd put one there already... Doesn'T help with a crap interface and no software to get a computer there...

 

[Keirasplace]

Nice thread so far. Here's a theory:

Tim wonders "How much should we price this thing?" The Project Manager groans, then leaves the meeting. Getting back to the cubicle, the PM yells to one of his subordinates "Hey, go fishing and call that guy over at 9to5Mac and "leak" a pricing range of $150 to $200 and let's see what kind of blowback we get on the web." The call gets made, and the leak is parroted on Mac sites with forums. Mac forums blow up over the weekend with features and comments on pricing.

Meanwhile, back in his castle, Tim sits back and reads a transcript of the comments and feedback, then calls up the PM and says "Nice marketing ploy! Now, add some more memory to that damned thing or we're going to sell about 75 of them."

Man, that's so not how things are done at Apple, even in bizarro world Apple...

 

[firewood]

rather than getting a glorified streaming box, one can get a full blown PC for tvs.

The last thing most of Apple's high value customers would want is another full blown generic PC. For TV or anything else.

 

[wxman2003]

Certainly it would be odd if Apple at the same introduces 4k recording iPhones. Otherwise I can understand it. Its not like Apple is to sell 4k content on iTunes anytime soon, and 4k streaming content will be limited for a good while. Though with the 4k discs shipping at the end of the year that will mean more prepared 4k content for services to license.

So they could wait a year or two to introduce a 4k model.

Actually there will be a lot of 4K content. Many older movies were filmed in 4K. Netflix is already streaming 4K content, but what make 4K content even more impressive is 4K content with HDR. And Netflix will be starting 4K HDR streaming soon. Amazon has already started doing that. I have a 4K tv, and 4K streaming looks really good. 4K blu ray will be even more impressive.

Here are a few shots of 4K with HDR on my TV. Shot with my iPhone 6 Plus. The camera doesn't do those photos justice.

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...30c-x940c-owners-thread-117.html#post36880442

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...30c-x940c-owners-thread-117.html#post36881042

 

[wiredup72]

native FLAC, native MKV? still don't see anything I care about except an upgraded processor. I sure as heck aint going to subscribe to any streaming service. Siri? bleh. hopefully in five years siri and other voice control will actually work the way it is supposed to, "computer... frap me up a frappe and play dead 82772"

 

[Juicy Box]

Actually there will be a lot of 4K content. Many older movies were filmed in 4K. Netflix is already streaming 4K content, but what make 4K content even more impressive is 4K content with HDR. And Netflix will be starting 4K HDR streaming soon. Amazon has already started doing that. I have a 4K tv, and 4K streaming looks really good. 4K blu ray will be even more impressive.

Here are a few shots of 4K with HDR on my TV. Shot with my iPhone 6 Plus. The camera doesn't do those photos justice.

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...30c-x940c-owners-thread-117.html#post36880442

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...30c-x940c-owners-thread-117.html#post36881042

I think they look great, and I think that 4K is not a gimmick like 3D TVs like others have mentioned. I think in about 5 years or so 4K will be king, and 1080p will be where 720p is now.

But as of right now, I feel like most 4K content sources are probably being used by AV enthusiasts and pro-types, and not the average consumer.

It seems like to me that Apple doesn't release new products for the enthusiasts anymore. I would bet no 4K for this model.

I was a little disappointed when Apple announced the Apple TV2 with only 720p. I had a first gen and I am pretty sure it had 1080p, the second gen having only 720p seemed strange considering 1080p TVs were out for a while and many people had them. I assume it was because iTunes content was only in 720p at the time.

It makes me think that many people on this forum will be disappointed if it doesn't have 4K.

 

[brentsg]

Which is kind of funny. I mean I imagine peoples familiarity with phone interfaces and the apps probably was looked on as a positive and not a negative.

Maybe it is for some, but believe it or not, there are still some people that use a phone because they have to. I'm one of these. It's a requirement, and it's good to have when I'm away from the house. At home though, I don't touch the thing unless it rings. Even then it's a toss-up.

 

[campyguy]

Man, that's so not how things are done at Apple, even in bizarro world Apple...

Girl, I was so being glib, even with the billions of dollars of engineering projects I've worked on and the crap I've seen my PMs pull in 25+ years , and the stories I could tell if anybody really gave a rat's ***...

 

[Keirasplace]

Girl, I was so being glib, even with the billions of dollars of engineering projects I've worked on and the crap I've seen my PMs pull in 25+ years , and the stories I could tell if anybody really gave a rat's ***...

I've been at at most senior tech roles in companies for more than a decade, and worked in four small to very large startups in 28 years.... Yes, I am an adrenaline junkie.

So, hey! I've seen my share of crap too (and produced some of my own too ;-) .Nothing brings on the crazy more than piles of money poured unto a interesting but ill defined idea using brand new tech/science. If you're doing all this in crazyland that was Silicon Valley in the late 1990s, you get bonus points and an insanity defense you can use later on...

Anyway, the intersection of tech and business is almost more art than anything. Everything you think you know, invariably turns up wrong in some inexplicable way...

Apple by now is way out of that "awkward" phase , so they'll be all right.

 

[ggibson913]

Whether $149 - $199 is too expensive or not depends. What do I get for the extra $50 - $100 over a Roku? Fire TV? How will Apple TV be different than these other devices and what value can they provide me? More important, how does an Apple TV solve my streaming needs better than other less expensive solutions?

 

[Ed217]

In terms of features:

1. Streaming
2. Apple TV service
3. App store options
4. Siri
5. Better hardware
6. Better remote
7. Homekit

Most today use ATV for 1 and that works well. The new TV service will also work with current ATV.

App store options is a plus for gamers and those that want more than just good TV on their TV monitor. Not sure how this fits in the average family room setting.

Siri is weak in both phone and watch. Unless it gets a lot better, may be of less value.

Better hardware is always a plus, but not that big a deal for those that just use TV for TV.

Same for remote, which I never use at all, instead relying on either iPhone or Harmony Smart Remote. New remote is good for gamers, but perhaps less so for TV folks.

Homekit may be a factor in the future, but for now is nearly useless for most homes.

What I use today, 90% of the time:

1. Streaming from Netflix, Amazon and other services
2. DVR playback via Tivo
3. Occasional live TV via digital OTA antenna.

I have neither cable TV or DirecTV service and rely solely on OTA and streaming.

I might consider the new ATV at $99. At 150$ maybe, and less likely at 199$.

 

[Carlanga]

Cord cutters are weird. Or you just like to wait while the stream Is buffering. I will stick to my tried and true cable TV that plays full HD with no buffering, no artifacts, and keeps my bandwidth free for my kids to attempt to watch YouTube videos.

I agree that sometimes there is buffer. But, what company do you have that does FULL HD? I don't think there are any channels that do FULL HD.

 

[Uofmtiger]

I am not saying that the new Apple TV won't support 4K, but I would be a little surprise if it did.
The 2nd Gen Apple TV was only 720p, because that was what iTunes had at the time.

Honestly, I am surprised about all the posts about 4K. I am not sure I even know anyone that has a 4K TV yet.

4k is where things are going and Apple doesn't update the AppleTV very often. The Nvidea Shield has a 4k machine that is selling for $199, has an app store, some games, etc. If the AppleTV doesn't have 4k, I am curious to see what justifies that price tag.

 

[consoleboi]

Sorry I don't understand why anyone would buy this. If you buy a modern smartTV it has most of the apps/features anyone could ever ask for.

I put away my locked down ATV ever since I upgraded to a STV. ATV you have to get a streaming server to play anything non-Apple standard.

So who's this product for other than loyalists who can't resist buying another version of an Apple product they don't yet own?

 

[Alexwastaken]

The landscape has changes since the first Apple TV was released. The Roku didn't even exist then. I suspect that those who have stuck with Apple TV this long will most likely find enough in this next gen to upgrade. Those who have held out any streaming device may be drawn to it. For the rest of us, I doubt there's enough to warrant a purchase.

The "ecosystem" consists of a limited number of channels, iTunes music and video. iTunes media is available to the Roku via Plex. I don't know of any channels that are AppleTV exclusive.

If by ecosystem you mean apps, then it is yet to be determined if iOS apps will be available for the ATV.

I was indeed talking about iTunes, and iOS when speaking about the ecosystem. Since this entire article is speculation I still consider them valid points. I would also consider Mirroring and home kit as part of the ecosystem as well.