North Korea and electricity

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Dane D., Oct 12, 2006.

  1. Dane D. macrumors 6502a

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    #1
  2. virus1 macrumors 65816

    virus1

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    #2
    bizzare you brought that up. we were taking a look at that in history today and having a chat about it.
     
  3. mischief macrumors 68030

    mischief

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    #3
    They had a bomb. Research indicates that they now are without materials enough to construct a second.

    When you piss off every country around you including the one that's been advocating for you in the international arena that's generally where you end up. Castro at least has the brains to realize that some allies are better than none at all and trade is essential to survival. KJI has forgotten the basic rules of engagement with the international community and will cost his country a heavy price for posturing (bluffing) with his single powerful card. Like Iraq before we invaded, he now has nothing to defend himself with and has effectively invited a violent response to his ongoing actions.
     
  4. Danksi macrumors 68000

    Danksi

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    #4
    I'm sure Canada would look pretty much the same at night...

    ... of course it could be a deliberate 'black-out' policy for N.Korea.. like the blitz of WWII in the UK.:rolleyes:
     
  5. Desertrat macrumors newbie

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    Kinda hard to figure what that megalomaniac really thinks. If he were to use a nuke on South Korea, China wouldn't be happy about fallout.

    And the Chinese are probably influenced more by Bentonville, Arkansas, than by Pyongyang, North Korea...

    'Rat
     
  6. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    Nothing to defend himself with?

    North Korea:

    Army:
    950,000 Active in 20 Corps. 600,000 Reserve in 40 infantry divisions, 18 infantry brigages.
    3,500 Main Battle Tanks ranging from WWII-era T-34s to 70s/80s T-62s
    560 light tanks
    4,400 self-propelled artillary
    3,500 pieces of towed artillary
    2,500 miltiple rocket launchers
    7,500 mortars
    2,500 armored personel carriers
    10,000+ surface to air missiles
    11,000 air defense guns

    Navy:
    46,000 active, 65,000 reserve
    26 submarines
    3 frigates
    6 corvettes
    43 missile craft
    103 torpedo craft
    15 patrol craft
    23 mine warfare craft
    10 amphibious landing craft

    Airforce:
    86,000
    107 MiG-17, 159 MiG-19, 130 MiG-21, 46 MiG-23, 30 MiG-29
    18 Su-7, 35 Su-25
    300 transport planes
    306 helicopters

    Paramilitary:
    189,000 active security troops
    3,500,000 worker and peasant red guards

    Edit: of course, I understand this is to some degree a paper army, without fuel to fly and lots of this equipment is unusable. Still.
     
  7. mischief macrumors 68030

    mischief

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    #7
    There are issues with that:

    1. North Korea's missile tests have been disasterous. They're as bad or worse than SCUDs.

    2. The scale of the blast observed earlier this week fits a very small fissile device of no more than about fourty five kilos of Plutonium involved. This is almost exactly what an independant research group estimated their stockpile to be by this summer assuming a 35 kilo stockpile when they visited a couple of years ago plus another 12 kilos produced in the intervening two years.

    3. The minimum plutonium core-mass for a fissile bomb of any military use at all is about thirty kilos. At a rate of 6 kilos per year (rate quoted from independant sourcing referenced here) NK has a five year wait to build a second device.

    4. Delivery of such a device (garbage can sized) will likely have to be by car or by boat as NK's missiles are a miserable failure. Shielding would be minimal so range would be limited by the lifespan of the creature or mechanism used to trigger the device. Similar US devices (Davy Crockett Nuke) required manual triggering in their "satchell nuke" form.


    In short: NK just barely made it into the nuclear arena.... but they are now effectively unarmed.

    edit: milo,

    yes. NK had a very large paper conventional force in comparisson with the size of the country... however: once you choose to play a nuclear gambit your conventional forces mean little or nothing until you can play the MAD game because the major nuclear powers maintain conventional forces that make that look like stone-axe-wielding aborigines facing their first gatling gun.
     
  8. AP_piano295 macrumors 65816

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    #8
    So i take it that theyre banking on the fact no one knows (and I mean really knowsss) for sure that they have no more nuke juice.

    ...i just dont get all the political posturing here I mean we're not going to invade north korea...they arent going to invade the south...were sure as hell not going to nuke them so what's the big deal?

    If they have nuke's theyre like every atomic power, they cant use the weapon because if they do some one will use it back.
     
  9. calculus Guest

    calculus

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    #9
    Awhile back I heard North Korea described (on Radio 4!) as the world's most 'secret' country. That's why they leave the lights off, so nobody knows where it is.
     
  10. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #10
    Funny but very, very sad.
     
  11. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #11
    what would you expect to see?
     
  12. Mechcozmo macrumors 603

    Mechcozmo

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    #12
    Couldn't their 'nuke' explosion just be a really big conventional bomb? It was only ~550 tons of TNT... nothing close to 14 kilotons (14,000 tons) like Little Boy.
     
  13. bemylover macrumors regular

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    #13
    Here are some real pics from NK taken by a tourist. If you read Russian you can read comments, they're interesting. There are several pages, you can go to next ones from the bottom of the page.

    This is quite sad in fact. Millions of wasted lives.

    http://www.tema.ru/travel/choson-1/
     
  14. iMeowbot macrumors G3

    iMeowbot

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    #14
    Yes, in the north. The southern band looks pretty bright though. link
     
  15. mischief macrumors 68030

    mischief

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    It was between .8 and 1.2 kt. Roughly the size of the smallest non-hydrogen bombs built during the cold war. These bombs were built for use by the US army either in a trashcan sized "satchell" form factor or, in the case of the Davy Crockett nuke, it was mounted on a shoulder fired rocket (like a bazooka round). These are the smallest size practical as a certain mass of Plutonium is needed to gain a self-propogating fission reaction.
     
  16. KingYaba macrumors 68040

    KingYaba

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  17. bemylover macrumors regular

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    #17
    locals get very excited when they see a westerner(that's the idea of the whole pic). That fellow is a baby bear statue, I guess.
     
  18. Shadow macrumors 68000

    Shadow

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    #18
    "Only".... Seriously though, didn't they discover fallout and all that jazz?
     
  19. Dont Hurt Me macrumors 603

    Dont Hurt Me

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    Yeah they think it was a dud, A sorry attempt at a Nuke. Maybe we should just Nuke em now before they get it right. Show em how its suppose to be done.
     
  20. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    Nope, no fallout recorded either on the SK or Chinese side.
     
  21. Dane D. thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #21
    Those pictures from the Russia photgrapher were quite good. Especially the ones from the high rise looking back down at slums. We need not bomb them, they will become like the Soviet Union, another failed experiment at communism.
     
  22. exabytes18 macrumors 6502

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    #22
    North Korea is going to kill a whole lot of us! Ahhhhhh!!!! Be afraid, be very afraid.
     
  23. it5five macrumors 65816

    it5five

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    #23
    The Soviet Union or North Korea are hardly true experiments at communism. They are both failed experiments of totalitarianism and Stalinism. An attempt at true Marxist communism still hasn't been made.
     
  24. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #24
    perhaps i'm ignorant of the physics and all, but why would an underground test produce fallout?
     
  25. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #25
    Well, the tests were airborne, so I suppose it's not fallout so much as leakage. Those little nuclei get everywhere.
     

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