Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

jiminaus

macrumors 65816
Dec 16, 2010
1,449
1
Sydney
Am I not getting something in your question?
 

Attachments

  • Capture.png
    Capture.png
    49.9 KB · Views: 74

farmerdoug

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Sep 16, 2008
541
0
Obviously, but Xcode 3 had open recent files and well as open recent projects.
It seems that they made Xcode 4 much less user friendly, targeting high powered application developers, not hackers like me.
 

robvas

macrumors 68040
Mar 29, 2009
3,240
629
USA
Obviously, but Xcode 3 had open recent files and well as open recent projects.
It seems that they made Xcode 4 much less user friendly, targeting high powered application developers, not hackers like me.

Seriously?
 

farmerdoug

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Sep 16, 2008
541
0
Yes seriously, the interface is far too complicated- having far more information than I would ever use.

The directory structure has become Byzantine.
The executables are placed some where in left field make them difficult to find for command line running.

The change from Xcode 3 to 4 had done absolutely nothing for me as a user.
 

KnightWRX

macrumors Pentium
Jan 28, 2009
15,046
4
Quebec, Canada
XCode is a IDE, it's not meant to be friendly, it's meant to be powerful.

As a hacker, you should have no trouble with XCode.
 

farmerdoug

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Sep 16, 2008
541
0
I get what I need out of it but newer is not always better. In this case Xcode3 was sufficient for me and I'd rather have it back.
 

jiminaus

macrumors 65816
Dec 16, 2010
1,449
1
Sydney
Obviously, but Xcode 3 had open recent files and well as open recent projects.

No, not obviously, at least not from your initial question. Why didn't you tell us this necessary detail in the first place?

If you're using XCode correctly, you rarely need to use these commands because everything you need should be in the project you're working on.


It seems that they made Xcode 4 much less user friendly, targeting high powered application developers, not hackers like me.

Yes, you're not the target audience.


The executables are placed some where in left field make them difficult to find for command line running.

You can revert XCode 4.2 to something similar to the XCode 3 behaviour. Changed the derived data location from default to relative in XCode's preferences.
 

Attachments

  • Capture.png
    Capture.png
    57.4 KB · Views: 95

farmerdoug

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Sep 16, 2008
541
0
I'm not coherent in the best of times; this is definitely not the best of times for me.
Always grateful
doug
 

Red Menace

macrumors 6502a
May 29, 2011
578
226
Colorado, USA
Tabs are your friend. There is a lot of stuff in there that I don't use, but I'm finding it a lot easier after reading the documentation and figuring out what I can do to tailor the interface - and I'm not even up to hacker standards. The help is also a bit better and you can always show any file in the Finder.

When I first saw Xcode 4, I also thought I would have to keep a copy of Xcode 3 around, but I haven't looked back.
 

farmerdoug

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Sep 16, 2008
541
0
I don't understand. You are supposed to read the manuals?
I once opened a box to find a piece of paper that said : "For those of you that don't read manuals: READ THIS FIRST".

Clearly reading is a good idea. The days are over when you could easy figure things out by scanning the menu bar. When I have to go three layers down to do something, I am in trouble. Definitely violates the KISS principle.

A problem I find with all this, is that when I search the documentation for help specific to my needs, I am overwhelmed with links to iphones and ipads and all sort of things that I didn't know even existed - let alone need. I still have yet to find where the man pages are for C code functions in XCode 4.

Chown: if I'm smart I will look at the documentations you sent. It remains to be seen how smart I am. Besides, I have to find out to get the data from adjacent spectra from slipping into each other. Fortunately, you guys are always there for me.
 

KnightWRX

macrumors Pentium
Jan 28, 2009
15,046
4
Quebec, Canada
I don't understand. You are supposed to read the manuals?
[...]
The days are over when you could easy figure things out by scanning the menu bar. When I have to go three layers down to do something, I am in trouble. Definitely violates the KISS principle.

You do realise we're talking about programming and the tools to do with here right ?

I have a book (yes a whole book) on how to write a proper Makefile. Let alone the material about GNU's autoconf and automake which "streamline" the creation of complex Makefiles for bigger projects with dependencies...

Then there's the whole pesky language you have to learn, the APIs...

If you don't like reading, I don't think programming is what you need to be getting into.

----------

I still have yet to find where the man pages are for C code functions in XCode 4.

Same place they have always been. The man command is adept at finding them, just type "man function" into your favorite command interpreter.
 

farmerdoug

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Sep 16, 2008
541
0
Please understand that much of the time I am being factious.

To serious issues.


In Xcode 3 you could go to the man page for a c function from the help tab. I haven't found it in Xcode4. Xcode 4 was no help. I've not googled it yet.


"I don't think programming is what you need to be getting into." I wrote my first programs on punch cards so I think we can conclude that its too late to worry about getting into coding.

My c coding now, I as far as I know doesn't use anything beyond what's in K&R.
All I want from these GUI's is a decent editor. I like the colors but that's about it. I don't want most, if not all of the bells and whistles: the auto complete; auto suggest; the real time compiling which is faster to find an error that find out that you've fixed it; the auto tabbing. I find most of these features distracting and I haven't figure out how to turn off them off or haven't looked hard enough but I didn't find it in preferences. (Forgive the run-on sentence) Past the editor, I just want a way to add libraries, a save button, a build button, and a run button. I imagine if I learned how to use the debugger I would be better off but there, too, I have found them so complicated compared to older ones that I rather just use print statements.
What might really help, color coded brakets, parenthesis and curly brackets have yet to show up.

As far make files go. Here is the make file I use for one code. I do not foresee needing anything more complicated.

#Makefile for the Project 1640 data pipeline

PIPELINEPATH = PIPELINEDIR=.
DATAPATH = ROOTDATADIR=/DATA0/PHASE2DATA
LIBRARYPATH = LIBRARYDIR=./LIBRARY

CC = gcc -arch x86_64
CFLAGS = -Wall -g -O1
IDIR = ./include
LIBS = -lm -lcfitsio -lgsl -lgslcblas -lmpfit -lfftw3

EXECS = pcxp
OBJS = pcxp.o

pcxp: pcxp.c
${CC} ${CFLAGS} -I${IDIR} -D${PIPELINEPATH} -D${DATAPATH} -D${LIBRARYPATH} pcxp.c ${LIBS} -o pcxp
# ${CC} ${CFLAGS} -I${IDIR} -DMEMWATCH -D${PIPELINEPATH} -D${DATAPATH} -D${LIBRARYPATH} pcxp.c memwatch.c ${LIBS} -o pcxp

all: ${EXECS}

clean:
rm -f ${OBJS} ${EXECS}
 

farmerdoug

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Sep 16, 2008
541
0
More X-4 crap.
I can't open more than one .c or .h file, if it's not part of an X-4 project?
 

robvas

macrumors 68040
Mar 29, 2009
3,240
629
USA
More X-4 crap.
I can't open more than one .c or .h file, if it's not part of an X-4 project?

I just opened 5 .m files that were all over the place on my hard drive. I think you just like complaining.

Why don't you install Xcode 3?
 

farmerdoug

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Sep 16, 2008
541
0
Guilty as charged. However I went to open, opened a .c file; then went back and opened a .h file. The .c file was closed. However, I repeated the experiment and got a different answer. I don't complain solely for the sake of complaining.

Why am I using a full blown IDL; Why not VIM? I don't know. I never heard of VIM
I can still use forty year old volt meters and oscilloscopes. I use a 60 year old telescope that still beats just about anything out there. But a new operating system and changes in the software every few years is unnecessary. Only the speed matters; I couldn't function without it;

At one previous job, I wrote code for take measurements. The system still runs on a 20 old computer a 20 year old operating system. I get as much greif adapting to new OS and commercial software as I get writing code.

Do you understand from where I'm coming? I know how to measure a 5 volt sine way but can someone please tell me how to go to the man page in Xcode 4 like I did in Xcode 3?
 

chown33

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 9, 2009
10,706
8,346
A sea of green
At one previous job, I wrote code for take measurements. The system still runs on a 20 old computer a 20 year old operating system. I get as much greif adapting to new OS and commercial software as I get writing code.

Can you go back one step and explain how or why you upgraded to Xcode 4 at all? Was it because you got a new computer with a new OS that only allows Xcode 4? Was it a mandate from a superior?

This thread started with a context-free complaint against Xcode 4. Given your stated satisfaction with older equipment and software, some context for why you're using Xcode 4 at all would go a long way here.

Finally, there are other editors capable of syntax-coloring code, starting makefiles, command-lines, etc. Smultron, BBEdit, and TextMate immediately spring to mind. You can search the MacRumors archives for those names, in conjunction with the word "code", and probably find a dozen threads that mention other editor names. Or google it.
 

farmerdoug

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Sep 16, 2008
541
0
Good question. Two answers.
1. My old laptap was dying.
2. Speed. It takes about 15 mins (more probably much more when I'm finished)
to process an image 2k x 2k array of data. (16.8 MB). We came home from our last run with 78 GB of data. Fortunately, not all has to be processed.
 

farmerdoug

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Sep 16, 2008
541
0
But I'm on LION. You don't think I would have downloaded Xcode 4 on purpose do you? Can I go back to 3 on LION.
 

chown33

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 9, 2009
10,706
8,346
A sea of green
Good question. Two answers.
1. My old laptap was dying.
2. Speed. It takes about 15 mins (more probably much more when I'm finished)
to process an image 2k x 2k array of data. (16.8 MB). We came home from our last run with 78 GB of data. Fortunately, not all has to be processed.

1. Probably should have bought a refurb, or a used one from a private seller. Some model that would undoubtedly run Snow Leopard.

2. "Speed" and "laptop" are in conflict. If I really want speed, I don't think of laptops. "I really need huge amounts of speed, so I'll buy a laptop, or maybe connect multiple laptops together". Doesn't happen. Well, the thinking process might, but the desired speed, not so much.

Significant speed increases are unlikely to come from CPU speed alone. You'll probably have to switch to programming in OpenCL, or some other GPU-compatible language.

CPU improvements, unless it involves multiple heavy parallelism, are unlikely to net anything more than 2-3X. And laptop CPUs simply aren't going to provide multiple parallelism, because they don't have the power budget, either in battery power or in heat dissipation.


Are you mistaking the Apple docs for 'man pages'?

The simple way to read man pages in your web browser:
http://bruji.com/bwana/
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.