Panther how i hate thee, let me count the ways

Discussion in 'Mac OS X 10.3 (Panther) Discussion' started by mashinhead, Nov 6, 2003.

  1. mashinhead macrumors 68020

    Oct 7, 2003
    I, like most of you, recently installed panther on my machine. Its not that i really think it's all that bad really, it has definately made my computer faster, but i really do regret it and i definately don't think it was worth it. Apple boasts of 150 new features, most of which are not indepth on there website, and i'm sure 90% of which aren't even useful to most users, developers excluded.

    I personally purchased it for a few of the highlighted features, namely

    font book- i hate using third party font software, believe me i've tried EVERYTHING and damn near all of it sucks, i saw this feature and thought that apple had finally done it right and all my font problems would be over.

    I was wrong, font book is HUGE disappointment, that slowed my computer down so much. i have been on the phone with apple for the past two days and i'm still having font problems.

    file vault - was a good idea in theory, but then so was communism. ideas are worthless without proper execution.

    i find that connecting to other computers on my network at work was far easier before panther came along.

    Don't get me wrong, its not really the OS i hate as much as the hassle that comes along with switching to it. Overall its been headaches, my time wasted on the phone, and my work slowed down, for really nothing much. I'm out some money, and to use some of the new features, such as ichat a/v, i have to shell out $150 bucks. on top of it a lot of the features don't work as advertised. When i pay $3000 for a computer and $120 for software i don't want to have to deal with this stuff, I want ease of use, i want reliability, and i don't want my time waste, and that is my right as a consumer.

    Apple is professional company about ease of use and such neglegance really is intolerable. it should be painless to switch. i think that the technology industry has had such mishaps in the past that should have been learned from. Which is to say they should have tested their product better.

    Please if you're going to reply to this post, please do not reply telling me how great apple is. I know everyone on here is a mac lover, and with good reason. I am one too. But i hate posts from people who just love anything and everything mac does, if you can't be objective about them then you really don't have an opinion. While they're far better than anything else out there, they're definatelly not perfect.

    sorry just had to vent.
  2. edesignuk Moderator emeritus


    Mar 25, 2002
    London, England
    Re: Panther how i hate thee, let me count the ways

    Well, I hate to break it to you, but nothing in this world's perfect :eek: ;)
  3. bitfactory macrumors 6502


    Jul 22, 2002
    font book does nothing to my system - never used filevault and probably never will - connecting to a network is far EASIER with Panther.

    i just don't get all the bitching about Panther - i think it kicks the sh*t out of Jaguar.

    oh well.
  4. agreenster macrumors 68000


    Dec 6, 2001
    Walt Disney Animation Studios
    How did you install Panther? Archive and Install, Clean Install, or overwrite Jaguar?

    Ive heard the only way to do it is either Archive or Clean. Installing over Jaguar screws things up.

    Dont know if this helps.....:confused:
  5. brogers macrumors regular

    Apr 6, 2002
    Greensboro, NC
    I installed over Jag. The "Update" is selected by defualt and you have to click and options button to make changes to the way it installs. I think I am right about that.

    Anyway, I have had no problems at all. Font Book works fine. Expose is flawless and my overall system performance got a nice boost. It is taking me some time to get use to the new Finder but it's not a problem.

    I am sorry you are having so much trouble but Panther has been a great and worth it update.
  6. mainstreetmark macrumors 68020


    May 7, 2003
    Saint Augustine, FL
    I've 'Updated' on both my new PB17 that had Jag on it, and a iBook that has been upgraded from 9.2->Jag. No problems for me.

    The problems people have reported are usually greatly exaggerated, so I don't know what people mean. The original poster here seems to have avoided using exaggerations, which sure is a nice change from the standard "The new finder is a million times worse than the old finder and why would apple be so sucky and release software without testing it at all" threads.
  7. snickelfritz macrumors 65816


    Oct 24, 2003
    Tucson AZ
    I think we have to look at Panther as a basis for future system software improvements.
    It's core technology.

    As a developer, (I assume by the reference in your post) you must realize that at some point, Apple must make a decision to release software, even though it is still under development, either due to economics or agreements with other developers who are also developing applications for this new architecture.

    BTW, I agree that Panther is not perfect, but if apple waited until it was perfected, we would not yet be running OSX at all.
    (previous releases all felt distinctly "beta" compared to Panther IMO)

    Also, upgrading Jaguar works fine, as long as disk permissions are good repair.
    (there are a few inherent problems with "upgrading", but they're fixable)
    Apple is in fact distributing upgrade-only CD's in the "up to date" program, lending further credence to the theoretical viability of upgrade installs over healthy installations of Jaguar.
  8. MacsRgr8 macrumors 604


    Sep 8, 2002
    The Netherlands
    I think this is an excellent point.

    Good advice: Repair 10.2.x disk permissions before upgrading to Panther.

    Just two more things...
    1) Panther defenitely is an UPgrade
    2) Software is always under development. Its a balance as to where the bug fixes end, and the new features start... triggering new bugs... etc.

  9. jayscheuerle macrumors 68020


    Panther's pissing me off too...

    I want to love it, but it broke my 2nd monitor. ExposŽ helps, but I think I'm going to move back to Jag unless there's a fix for it soon.
  10. illumin8 macrumors 6502

    Apr 20, 2003
    East Coast, US
    Actually, I got Panther through the up-to-date program (new PowerBook) and I can tell you how it works.

    You must have Mac OS X already installed on your hard drive. It checks this when you first load the CD in before the reboot. After it reboots to CDROM you can choose to do an archive install or a clean install, or an upgrade, just like the normal Panther installation.

    I chose to do a clean install because it's a brand new PowerBook anyway and there's no point in keeping all the crappy software they bundle with your PowerBook anyway (other than maybe iDVD).

    The only difference between the upgrade version and the full retail version is that you can't install the upgrade version on a totally blank hard drive. You have to install Jaguar first, then you can format the hard drive and install Panther with the clean install option if you want to.
  11. MacsRgr8 macrumors 604


    Sep 8, 2002
    The Netherlands
    I read about your 2nd monitor trouble....
    Are you sure the specific grfx card is still officially suported in 10.3?
  12. jayscheuerle macrumors 68020


    I'm sure it's not. :eek:

    And that's the peeve.
    Especially if there's an easy solve out there.
    Works in 10.2, not in 10.3?

    Unlike most of Apple's heavy-handed upgrade forcing, they stand nothing to gain by people buying more 3rd party cards, so I'm not sure what's up.

    XPostFacto showed that OSX could be run on less than G3s, so I'm naturally wary when Apple ceases any type of support for anything. I'll just keep my eyes open for the next couple weeks... :)
  13. wPod macrumors 68000


    Aug 19, 2003
    Denver, CO
    I have seen too many problems with Panther. If anyone has tried to use FileVault you will know what I am talking about. . . DO NOT TUNR FileVault ON!!!! After fixing those problems from my backup. . . Panther seems to work well. But not the tremendous upgrade Apple advertised and certainly NOT worth the $130. . . I would be mad except I only paid $20 through the up-to-date program. I probably will NOT be 1st in line for the 10.4 upgrade whenever it comes around. If they would have waited and tested one more month I am sure the release would have been better.
  14. chickengrease16 macrumors member

    Apr 21, 2003
    Tallahassee, FL
    font book - ive installed, managed fonts fine with no problems, no slow downs, it runs great and is a great piece of software.

    the new finder - much easier to manage your data, and connecting to network servers is almost painless now, dont know what you're talking about.

    everything works perfect for me, even with all of the futzing i'm doing with the system with fink and stuff. and yes, i UPGRADED from jaguar, without doing a thing to jag before upgrading.
  15. Les Kern macrumors 68040

    Les Kern

    Apr 26, 2002
    Once again I am happily put in the "delighted" column. Panther was installed on 2 of my Macs, both as upgrades, and absolutely everything works perfectly. As for Panther itself, I think it's the finest OS I have ever seen. Navigation improvements alone have helped my productivity quite a bit. The other "candy" is not an issue. The points you make are valid for you, but on closer analysis, "font book" and "getting on servers" is hardly cause to dismiss the entire OS as "bad". Font Book is free and will never be as good as third party (maybe) and I actually think that server navigation is WAY more intuitive. "GO"? Better to set your window in column view. Can't be easier. "File Vault"? What could possibly be the problem there?
    Anyway, Panther has had a bigger impact on my computing life than the second-place OS, System 7.
    Onward and upward!
  16. mainstreetmark macrumors 68020


    May 7, 2003
    Saint Augustine, FL
    Wait... are you saying you like Sys7 second best, or are you saying you like the upgrade from J to P better than from 6 to 7?

    I remember the 7 upgrade too - it was massive. Hierarchial menus, desktop printing... what is this magic?
  17. Les Kern macrumors 68040

    Les Kern

    Apr 26, 2002
    Thinking back, and using "productivity" as the main criteria, Sytem 7 had a HUGE impact. But so many generations of the Mac OS have come along that it's really impossible to compare. Jaguar, by it's mere "moderness" is WAY WAY cooler. So a tie in productivity enhancement, Jaguar on the cool stuff. Jag wins.
  18. towalu macrumors newbie

    Oct 29, 2003
    Did 3 installs and threw out 2 apps before 10.3 worked fine, still to me it's a very good step in the right direction.

    Expect great changes and total backwards compatibility for all apps and devices don't go well together.

    I'd rather blame (some) third-party soft- and hardware developers for not keeping the pace. (E.g.: Norton still hasn't updated Personal Firewall for Macinstosh... which was the reason or my 3 installs....)

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