Pat Tillman -- Against the Iraq War?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by mactastic, Sep 26, 2005.

  1. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #1
    Link'd
    As more comes to light about the circumstances surrounding Pat Tillman's death, the conclusion that he was used for propaganda by this administration at a time when they desperately needed something to deflect from the scandal at Abu Ghraib that was about to break. The family and the American public was lied to about the circumstances surrounding his death and... oh hell, just read the article:
    And once again the little guys take the blame and the whitewash allows those at the top to continue their careers at the expense of others. Goes against everything the military says it stands for.
     
  2. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    #2
    I had no idea. Sounds like a truly remarkable guy.
     
  3. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #3
    I have to wonder if some who were praising him would now turn on him. Doubt this will get much press, but I can't see Ann defending him anymore. I'd say the same about liberals now defending him... but except for a few nutjobs, I didn't exactly see a lot of them attacking the guy. This is different than Vietnam. People support the troops either way. One side by showing their support of what they're trying to do, the other just wanting to keep them safe and bring them home.

    Though I still see a lot of people who support the war over supporting the troops. It's not the same. In some ways, it's the exact opposite (i.e. lack of armor, cutting vets benefits, etc.).
     
  4. stubeeef macrumors 68030

    stubeeef

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    #4
    I have and wear his bracelet from hero bracelets in my signature. I admire a citizen who gives up money for service to and for his country. I think no less or more of him, I had already thought VERY highly of him and still do.

    I also think highly of those who join the PeaceCorp, The Military, Teachers in less than wonderful nieghborhoods, mostly those that actively with their hands and time "do" things instead of mouth off about them.
     
  5. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    #5
    Thanks! I appreciate it! :)
     
  6. stubeeef macrumors 68030

    stubeeef

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    #6
    I greatly admire those that do the world and our country a great service in the peace corps! I think that they are people of action and conviction, and strive to make things better!

    If you are one of the many that have done so, I thank you for putting your actions and your deeds where your heart is, not just a lot of hot air. Good Job.
     
  7. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    #7
    Having been in the Peace Corps, I would say that not all of the individuals within it are worthy of admiration. But I do agree with the basic idea. Anyone who signs up for service that are hard, or dangerous, or difficult, or risky--service that at its core is dedicated to helping others deserves credit. And I think that credit is generally given. There are also selfish reasons, or practical reasons, or misguided reasons that all play a part too in these decisions to "serve", but that doesn't mean those noble and self-sacrificing reasons aren't there too (although I'm sure they were there less for me than they were for others).

    Tillman definitely seems like someone a good deal more than the default amount of credit. But any time any side wants to make someone a hero, watch out. If the left-wing goes Tillman crazy, they'll no doubt distort who he was just as the Republicans did (although perhaps not as much). Setting up people to be heros is never noble, even if the heros themselves were.
     
  8. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #8
    Then I wasn't talking about you. ;)
     
  9. Xtremehkr macrumors 68000

    Xtremehkr

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    #9
    Pointing out that this is old news may seem snobbish, but yeah, somehow the liberal media overlooked broadcasting this to the point where it was common knowledge.
     
  10. stubeeef macrumors 68030

    stubeeef

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    #10
    I know, you where wondering if "some" thought different, just adding my $.02!
    :)
     
  11. JesseJames macrumors 6502a

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    #11
    Having been a former Infantryman myself not too long ago, I can absolutely relate to the last comments from the soldiers.
    It's rarely the soldiers fault. There were many instances when I was training out in the field and was thinking, "This is the Army???"
    It's all about leadership. Good leadership makes good soldiers. The NCO's all do admirable tough jobs. The officers, uhg. They run the whole gammut, ass kissers, ticket punchers, brown nosers, the corporate mentality of the brass can get nauseating for the enlisted guys WHO DO ALL THE HEAVY LIFTING.
    I remember when me and some of the guys in my platoon were tasked to defend a road obstacle.
    This squad from another company led by a new 2nd lieutenant just walked right up on us. I killed one outright with my SAW. The Lieuy gestured frustratingly to his other men to flank us. We picked them off. Then they took up a defensive position because we killed more than half his squad.
    WE went on the hunt then.
    If I had real grenades to toss, we would've wiped them out. But since it was all blanks and MILES equipment I just John Wayned it and charged them in the bushes on full automatic. I got the drop on them. I'll never forget the look on the lieutenant's face as he turned his head from talking into the radio.
    It was an arrogant look. Like, how dare you? I'm suppose to win here.
    If it was for real, we wiped them out. But guess what? Since they had to take the obstacle to keep the training mission going, they just declared that they took it and commenced with the game plan instead of dealing with a new situation. That Lieuy was all smiles talking into the radio to his commander no doubt on how they took the obstacle. I just shook my head in disgust.
    That was one of many disillusioning moments in my military stint. At the end of my contract I got out. Vowing never to risk my life that way again unless my country absolutely needed me.
    To further give you an idea of the gulf between the enlisted guys and the officers. We unaffectionately dubbed our Captain "Super Dave" after the comic character who does prank stunts. His first name was David by the way. I'll never know if he knew that.
     
  12. stonyc macrumors 65816

    stonyc

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    #12
    Until you wrote the word "MILES", I was thinking "Uh, why are you shooting on your own men?" :)
     
  13. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #13
    Thank you, I appreciate it.

    And JesseJames, that's exactly what I've heard from everyone I've talked to in the armed forces. Friends and family. It's sad that the military is being run like some of the companies I temp for. In other words, not so good.
     
  14. diamond geezer macrumors regular

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    #14
    Amazing arrogance. Substitute the word American for German or Aryan and it all sounds very familiar.
     
  15. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #15
    Still have to wonder if she'll take it back now. He's one of those unAmerican, hippy, liberals who don't care about the troops now. :rolleyes: God I hate that woman.
     

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