Photo Depicting iPhone 5S Camera Module Hints at Separate Dual-LED Flash Component

[Mtmspa]

This looks terrible! Apple needs to learn what design is. It will only allow you to take the pictures Apple says is okay. I want to tweak it and change it as I see fit. Android would let me take crappy pictures if I wanted to. Closed system for sheeple.

Oops, I thought this was the iOS7 complaining thread.

 

[BrentT]

I would guess that the reddish LED is for anti-redeye. It may also be used for color correcting flash for different white balance situations.

 

[GuitarDTO]

A megapixel bump is just consumer hokus pokus. I hope they plan to make actual improvements to the lens and sensor. Besides, 8 is plenty. Why do I need my photos taking up more memory?

This is ignorant. Some people actually do want and need more resolution. I am a getty images contributor through Flickr, and just recently Getty has started to solicit photo submissions taken and edited using cell phones for consideration into salable/licensed material. Resolution is currently one of the limiting factors to good quality material that can be licensed. When phones reach the point where they can take 20 MP pictures with good low light performance, the potential is huge for a lot of people. For folks like you who don't want the pictures taking too much space, have the quality set to a lower resolution. Phone camera technology is increasing at a rapid pace right now, and Apple knows this.

 

[Jimbo47]

More "innovation" from apple. Yawn, boring.

That's what I'm saying. People keep saying that the new iPhone will have just an upgraded processor, dual LED flash, and an upgraded camera. That is NOT innovation. And as Phil Schiller said "Can't innovate anymore my ass." There is definitely something else they have to do with the new phone. Whether it be a finger print sensor or something else.

 

[avanpelt]

How many times has the iPhone pictured in the MR story been dropped?

 

[Wayfarer]

And the pieces keep coming .

That's what she...

Never mind. Glad they're putting more flash in the camera.

 

[inlinevolvo]

This is ignorant. Some people actually do want and need more resolution. I am a getty images contributor through Flickr, and just recently Getty has started to solicit photo submissions taken and edited using cell phones for consideration into salable/licensed material. Resolution is currently one of the limiting factors to good quality material that can be licensed. When phones reach the point where they can take 20 MP pictures with good low light performance, the potential is huge for a lot of people. For folks like you who don't want the pictures taking too much space, have the quality set to a lower resolution. Phone camera technology is increasing at a rapid pace right now, and Apple knows this.

I can reduce the image quality? You should be on the lumia 1020 forums. The sensor and image quality is a bigger detriment than megapixels on these cameras. My iphone 5 takes images on par in quality with my fujifilm digital 3.2 mp from 10 years ago. You'd have better images with a larger sensor. Increasing the mp without the sensor will degrade image quality.

 

[blue22]

good points...

Bigger sensor won't be possible since camera has to fit into cell phone foam factor. The only way to get bigger sensor is to lower the number of mega pixel in camera. However, this will not go well with uninformed consumers, wall street analyst, journalist etc.

I believe most of current 8Meg cell phone camera uses 1.4um or 1.75 um pixel size. This pixel size produce 8meg pixel camera with 1/4 inch optical size package, which is the sweat spot for cellphone camera.

Personally, I'd rather have 5Meg camera with 2.2um pixels size than 12Meg with 1.4um or even 1.2um. But, I know it won't happen since market won't allow that kind of product.

Great info. I'm aware of the physical size limits in general but if anyone can pull-off a more efficient sensor in a smaller space it's Apple. I'm just not counting on them to do it, at least not in 2013. Next year if we're lucky.

Yeah, don't hold your breath Phones with bigger sensors do tend to be bigger phones. I'd hope if Apple were going to release an iPhone with a larger screen they'd up the sensor size but even then I don't hold out much hope that they would. Either way, you can bet the iPhone 5S (or 6 because that's what I think they'll call it) camera will certainly be at least a little better than the one in the iPhone 5.

I think you got a good case to be made for calling the next iPhone "6", but I also think it'll be called "5S" this year if only to reserve "6" for next year if & when Apple makes the phone display bigger. Just a guess of course.

 

[mozumder]

Are none of you photographers?

The second flash has a tungsten filter to match the color of a tungsten lamp. The main flash is unfiltered and matches daylight color temperature.

You can get flashes with various filters to match different color temperatures & effects, for example, to match the flash color to flourescent lighting.

Example:

 

[janderson0719]

I'm glad I switched from the iPhone 'S cycle' upgrade to the 'new number cycle' upgrade.

 

[ValSalva]

Why does everyone keep saying this as if Apple doesn't know? During the 4S presentation, Phil Schiller explained this concept. They won't bump the camera up to 12mp without making sure it takes better pictures.

We know Apple knows. It's just that it would take even better pictures with a bigger sensor I know, it's not going to happen...

 

[mozumder]

I would guess that the reddish LED is for anti-redeye. It may also be used for color correcting flash for different white balance situations.

Redeye reduction is done by pre flashing to allow the pupils to contract ahead of time. It's not done by changing flash's color.

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What does a duel flash do? Why is that better?

One is for flash when using with tungsten lighting. The other is for flash when used with white lighting.

The different flashes matches the flash color to the color of the environment lighting, so you don't have a yellow background, for example.

 

[Liquorpuki]

One is for flash when using with tungsten lighting. The other is for flash when used with white lighting.

The different flashes matches the flash color to the color of the environment lighting, so you don't have a yellow background, for example.

I'm assuming that means you're either firing one or the other.

Which means 5s pictures will still be as dark and grainy in low light as 5 pictures

 

[captain kaos]

If that red/clear LED photo is true it will have better low light focusing (with the red LED).

I think we can say that the 5C will be a 5 in a plastic case, with a 5S with some upgrades, but to me its not looking great. Slightly bigger MP (doesn't mean particularly better photos), possible fingerprint sensor, maybe a faster processor?. Not exactly jump in technology is it, and all for the cost of $600-700?.....

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Are none of you photographers?

The second flash has a tungsten filter to match the color of a tungsten lamp. The main flash is unfiltered and matches daylight color temperature.

You can get flashes with various filters to match different color temperatures & effects, for example, to match the flash color to flourescent lighting.

Example:

Image

I disagree. See my above statement.

 

[lk400]

This means that the lense will let more light in, and more light means less time is required to capture an image, so images at night will be less blurry and brighter and less grainy (the grain comes from amplifying low light signals, also known as ISO in the photography world).

Also lower f-stops generally allow you to set up photos with a very sharp specific focus so you can have a subject in focus with a blurred background which looks cool.

Thats the basic theory, but on these cell phone cameras with tiny sensors and cheap plastic lenses, most of that theory stays as just that. A half (or less) stop difference in aperture on the kind of lenses that these cameras have, or a tiny bump up in sensor size is not really going to make an appreciable difference to these cameras. The software and internal image processing of what comes off that tiny sensor makes most difference.

Also, the depth of field on pinprick sized sensors is so huge that, absent putting a subject at your minimum focussing distance and having the rest of the frame very far off, i dont think opening up aperture is going to make any difference to the selective focus youve described.

 

[arsGBemp]

Repairability

First thing that I noticed is that the camera is now replaceable if it breaks without having to remove the logic board. Currently, you have to remove the board to get to the connector. This can allow the camera to be replaced with as little as removing the display. They're moving towards in-store repair instead of the swap mentality that they have had for so long.

 

[macs4nw]

.....My goodness... we don't even know what the overall quality looks like yet and we're already passing judgement on the fact it's only a 12mp camera... 2 MP bigger than my, what use to be a professional 10MP Canon 5 years ago. I'll hold judgement until it ships.

For quality, I'll take your 5 year old, 10mp Canon any day over that 12mp iPhone camera; it wins with a combination of optics, sensor size and image processor. The incremental improvements to cellphone cameras are nice, to be sure, and as a device category, cellphone cameras have all but wiped out p&s cameras.

However, in contrast, resolution, and low-light performance, amongst other parameters, they can't come close to what even a modest dSLR can achieve.

 

[mozumder]

For quality, I'll take your 5 year old, 10mp Canon any day over that 12mp iPhone camera; it wins with a combination of optics, sensor size and image processor. The incremental improvements to cellphone cameras are nice, to be sure, and as a device category, cellphone cameras have all but wiped out p&s cameras.

However, in contrast, resolution, and low-light performance, amongst other parameters, they can't come close to what even a modest dSLR can achieve.

dSLR's are largely useless outside of sports & action, because they're too bulky to carry around everywhere.

What good is image quality if you don't even get the shot in the first place?

Usability is far more important than image quality.

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If that red/clear LED photo is true it will have better low light focusing (with the red LED).

I think we can say that the 5C will be a 5 in a plastic case, with a 5S with some upgrades, but to me its not looking great. Slightly bigger MP (doesn't mean particularly better photos), possible fingerprint sensor, maybe a faster processor?. Not exactly jump in technology is it, and all for the cost of $600-700?.....

----------




I disagree. See my above statement.

You're incorrect. It's not red, it's amber- the exact color of tungsten matching filters.

 

[macs4nw]

dSLR's are largely useless outside of sports & action, because they're too bulky to carry around everywhere. What good is image quality if you don't even get the shot in the first place?

I'm not disputing convenience here, but merely making a comment about PQ.

Usability is far more important than image quality.

Depends largely on what your objective is.

 

[Michael CM1]

I'm definitely up for a better camera. The 4S is good, but I can tell it lacks quality when I'm using it to photograph the moon through my telescope. It looks great on the phone's screen, but then you open it on an iMac and you can't zoom in much without losing quality.

Yes, minority of the base here. But that's only one instance when more megapixels and better optics will help.

 

[verpeiler]

dSLR's are largely useless outside of sports & action, because they're too bulky to carry around everywhere.

Errr...right. When I take a picture of the grand canyon I'd never use anything but DSLR; not a crappy P&S or even worse: a smartphone camera. Bulky? There are so many DSLR-bodies around, you don't have to use the heavy pro ones.

Don't get me wrong, smartphone cameras are perfectly fine for snapshots and fun stuff. But I when I'm travelling I only use my DSLR.

If you don't see a difference, good for you...

 

[MentalFloss]

A dual-LED flash would improve the performance of the iPhone's flash, creating better lit, less harsh flash photos in low light conditions.

I always try to tell people that the purpose of a flash is not to light the scene in low light conditions, and then a statement like that comes up again.

 

[GuitarDTO]

I can reduce the image quality? You should be on the lumia 1020 forums. The sensor and image quality is a bigger detriment than megapixels on these cameras. My iphone 5 takes images on par in quality with my fujifilm digital 3.2 mp from 10 years ago. You'd have better images with a larger sensor. Increasing the mp without the sensor will degrade image quality.

Congrats, you understand the link between the image sensor and image quality. My comment was in regards to your note that "8 is plenty". 8 MP is not plenty for some, and yes the sensor is a big part of that.

 

[skinned66]

Slo-mo huh? I'm sure this will be software and not an increase in FPS. Or maybe a combination of both with a slight FPS bump at best.

 

[blitzer09x87]

very excited for the iphone 5s, i wanna know all the hidden features apple's going to offer, but one thing which makes me super-excited for the 5s is the new features in iOS7, the features which are being hidden for the 5S, those features would be awesome.