Please tell me this is a USA spoof

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by crap freakboy, Feb 12, 2004.

  1. crap freakboy macrumors 6502a

    crap freakboy

    Jul 17, 2002
    nar in Gainsborough, me duck
  2. d46799 macrumors newbie

    Feb 20, 2003
    This clip wasn't intended to be news reporting...its an *opinion* piece, which, yes, many of us agree with. What the BBC did was put out an opinion piece and pretend it was news. At least Fox was honest about it up front.
  3. crap freakboy thread starter macrumors 6502a

    crap freakboy

    Jul 17, 2002
    nar in Gainsborough, me duck
    ah well free speech is free speech i suppose

    although not wishing upturn any apple carts, it was the 'anti-american' paranoia editorial slant that ran through the entire clip that i thought verged on the insane.

    The facts of the BBC case werent in there thats all,
    no real facts at all. yeah the BBC messed up, they trusted a well respected reporter, who in turn had trusted his source, who inturn had trusted his government ....who we all trust...dont we? :eek:

    the Hutton Inquiry report key points
  4. virividox macrumors 601


    Aug 19, 2003
    Manila - Nottingham - Philadelphia - Santa Barbar
    its from fox, so its always inflammatory, but go check out the hutton report if you want the full background, but that is opening a whole can of worms in itself.
  5. candan9019 macrumors regular

    Feb 18, 2003
    Ontario-> Louisiana-> Colorado-> Ontario
    Fox news is a waste of a cable channel. So what if the BBC exaggerated, what does Fox think it does for the opposite side and they do it ten times worse.
    One BBC reporter may promote anti-americanism but everyone on Fox news promotes the hatred of the rest of the world. Everytime Fox talks about another country it's always in a very derogatory way.
    Yes this was an 'editorial' but how many Americans watching at home realize that? Most people belive whatever the news tells them regardless of if it's real news or a stupid opinion from some hatefull overly patriotic loony.

    And he needs to stop yelling!
  6. wdlove macrumors P6


    Oct 20, 2002
    Yes, the reporting was very upfront. The piece was that reporters opinion. I think we need more of that in our news. Too many reporters editorialize and claim that it is news. Giving an opinion is OK. We have a right to know which type of reporting that we are getting.
  7. Foxer macrumors 65816


    Feb 22, 2003
    Washington, DC
    OK. OK. I've never understood how people reflexivly beleive that FNC is some sort of reflexivly conservative organ when their evening line-up includes two unabashed liberals (Geraldo and Greta Van Sustran), a show with a lib and and conservative arguing (Hannity and Combs) and O'Reilly (who is some sort of kooky, almost liberatrian populist. It just doesn't add up. Fine, the morning show used to be hosted by a former Bush I staffer (Tony Snow). He's been replaced with Mike Wallace's son, and anyway no one is bothered by a former Clinton operative hosting ABC This Week and and a Carter guy on Meet the Press.

    The only channel I can think of that went out and hired a host simply beacuse he was a conservative was MSNBC with Joe Scarborough.

    American networks have a long, long way to go in the jingoism category to counter the deep-rooted anti-americanism of the BBC world service. Plus, no one outside of the US sees any US networks (CNN international is different than CNN domestic) and BBC reaches everyone.
  8. Chip NoVaMac macrumors G3

    Chip NoVaMac

    Dec 25, 2003
    Northern Virginia
    A couple of points in your post.

    American journalism is now thanks to Republican efforts under the control of a handful of outlets. Also you would find that American outlets would still not be brave enough to challenge whatever Administration in office in order assure they had access to to the White House.

    And who is to say that the American stance on the world as a whole is the only way to go? Just because we are willing to go in to a hole with the national budget does not mean that we are a nation to respected.

    Respect is earned not demanded. And we as a nation need to start to realize that. Your views are the reason that the US is not respected in the world community. We need to move past the 800 pound gorilla, and become a partner in the world community.
  9. BigRedBall macrumors newbie

    Jan 23, 2003
    A few corrections, folks

    Firstly, i would like to point out that Fox News IS available outside of the US. And it's the same as you see in the US, apart from the adverts which are replaced by 3-minute world weather updates.

    Secondly I'd like to point out some of the more glaring errors made by the person in the video.
    • The BBC did not insist that Andrew Gilligan had a 'right to lie because, well, the BBC knew the war was wrong and anything they could say to underscore that point had to be right'. What the BBC DID insist was that Gilligan and the BBC had a perfectly legitimate right not to disclose the identity of a secret source, barring a court order. I would have thought that everyone would agree that this is reasonable. And, I would have thought, perfectly in line with the 1st Amendment of the US Constitution, which I assume the presenter adheres to, being a 'flag-wearing patriot'.
    • The BBC was did not display any kind of 'anti-war' agenda during the war. An independent study by a British university (I think it was Cambridge, but I can't remember precisely) which analysed the language of news coverage during the war found that the BBC had a slight pro-war bias. So don't give me the old 'leftie Beeb' line, Mr Uninformed Never Heard of Newsnight My Word...
      Channel 4 News was one of the only major British broadcasters seen to have a consistent anti-war sentiment.
    • The BBC did make quite serious errors at the time of the 'Gilligan Report', including not checking Gilligan's notes from the interview with David Kelly, but is simply not true to say that they had were politically motivated. Yes, it was mis-management to let Gilligan run the story, but accusing it of anything more is beyond the pale. May you all also note that the BBC implemented many measures after this to put these things right.
    • The BBC has done a superb job of reporting on itself without bias throughout all of this. It is simply not the job of broadcast news media to broadcast opinion and present it as news, which I have seen Fox and CNBC do very regularly. The BBC is not perfect, this is clear, but at least it has the journalistic confidence to report the facts, not the facts as it sees them. I very much doubt that if a similar situation were to involve Fox, they would be able to hold back their irresistable urge to put a 'spin' on it.
    • Going on about which presenters are liberal and which are conservative is missing the point. Broadcast news media should be balanced and fair - it should NOT defend what's 'right', 'wrong', or anything else. This, though you may not believe me, is pure and simple bias. Fox, throughout the war, consistently presented Pentagon footage, and Pentagon reports of action as 'truth', and in the film listed above the presenter does just that with the cameraman in the tank (who, don't forget, is probably 'embedded' and therefore is under some duress from the military). During the BBC's war coverage, viewers were always told the source of footage and data, so that they could make up their own minds as to what degree it showed the full picture. Note, however, that that doesn't imply that the BBC didn't believe what the Pentagon and the MoD told them - it just shows their attempt to be balanced. Which is hell of a lot braver than Fox's approach, especially when you consider the tools the Government could use against the BBC if it wanted (e.g. reducing the license fee, imposing an outside regulator, sacking the board of governers)
    • The Hutton report (the report which 'exposed' the BBC's 'lies' was a load of MINCE (or BALONEY, if you prefer). The word 'whitewash' is not innaccurate here. Every time Hutton came up against a difficult question, he simply decided it was outside of his 'terms of reference'...
    • Most of Britian's media were for the war. They were mostly just shakey about supporting Bush as he's not too popular over here (as you may have gathered). In principle, most newspapers supported removing Saddam. The only major exceptions were the Guardian, the Mirror and the Observer (and remember, we have TONS of newspapers).

    I probably have more to say but I'll add more later.
  10. MrMacMan macrumors 604


    Jul 4, 2001
    1 Block away from NYC.
    :slaps self in face:

    I -- hate Fox.

    Such Blatent POS... arg.
  11. Dippo macrumors 65816


    Sep 27, 2003
    Charlotte, NC
    It's a free country, if you don't like Fox News, then don't watch it.

    I on the other hand, think Fox is the only news orginzation that doesn't slant the news to the far left. There are plenty of liberal news organizations out there (CNN, CBS, ABC, NBC, MSNBC, etc.) I think a news organization that doesn't follow the liberal left in all of it's reporting is good for the country.

    Of course Fox News is the number one watched cable news network for a reason.
  12. rainman::|:| macrumors 603


    Feb 2, 2002
    in my experience, the only way to identify what's on FNC is that if it's a woman, it's giving the news; if it's a man (or ann coulter) it's giving opinion. their hosts readily sympathize with conservative guests in discussions and attack anyone remotely liberal. they do in fact lie, quite a bit, both hosts and guests, and get away with it. hannity and colms is a joke, they're both extremely conservative... but hey, this is from a news company with the slogan "fair and balanced". News reporting by very definition (you know what i mean, don't start defining it) cannot be fair and balanced, because news is not fair or balanced. it's just news, real reporting of events that have occured without distortion, speculation, partesan rhetoric, or detail repeating/omission. No news network that i've seen lives up to that, but some are closer than others. Fox is at the bottom of that list.

    Read Al Franken's latest book for a researched look into FoxNews. Admittedly it's got a liberal bias, but then, it doesn't claim to be "news".

  13. Sayhey macrumors 68000


    May 22, 2003
    San Francisco

    thank you for a very good and informative post.

    Personally I stay away from Fox News as much as possible because they give me the irresistible urge to throw things at my television. Which can get very expensive. ;)
  14. BigRedBall macrumors newbie

    Jan 23, 2003

    Yeah, I've been there lol. Plus, they shout too much.

    P.S. - the university I couldn't remember was Cardiff University (Wales).
  15. iMeowbot macrumors G3


    Aug 30, 2003
    Well... it's a Murdoch property. What else would be expected? Next thing you know, he'll run off, buy the Times and turn it into a tabloid... oh, wait....
  16. coolsoldier macrumors 6502

    Jan 7, 2003
    The 909
    "Balanced" is not a word that should even be used to refer to news. News should be neutral, as in expressing no point of view at all. Expressing two points of view is balanced but still not neutral, because when all is said and done you still are limited to choosing from the most compelling of the two arguments, rather than coming to your own conclusion.

    Furthermore, balance is completely subjective. Almost everybody draws the line between "left of center" and "right of center" at their own political position, and will only perceive the news as balanced if they agree politically with whoever is determining the "balance". Neutral is pretty easy to define -- as a general rule, if anybody can claim a report is not neutral, it usually isn't.

    As for NBC, ABC, etc. having a liberal bias, I don't see much of a political bias in the news. The biggest bias in the news is towards "shock stories". The news media generally will distort otherwise unimportant stories into sensationalism, but in general, this is more of a cheap pull for ratings than any political slant.
  17. Jerry Spoon macrumors 6502a

    Jerry Spoon

    Jan 8, 2002
    Historic St. Charles
    Re: Please tell me this is a USA spoof

    Yes. Fox News is a spoof of real news. For your convenience, they put their logo in the corner of the screen so you know that it's a spoof. They do the same thing with The Daily Show on Comedy Central, but in my opinion, that's a smart and well thought out spoof show while FNC isn't.;)
  18. diamond geezer macrumors regular

    Jan 26, 2004
    What vomit-inducing ****e.

    It's that sort of crap that just helps reinforce the world's view of America.
  19. numediaman macrumors 6502a

    Jan 5, 2004
    Chicago (by way of SF)
    I think that viewing Bush's State of the Union speech, Survivor, and arena football do a damn good job of reinforcing the world's view of America.

    Between Fox News, the National Enquirer and Rush Limbaugh, America has plenty of high-quality news outlets.
  20. BigRedBall macrumors newbie

    Jan 23, 2003
    I wouldn't worry about "the world's view of America" - Europe's media is fast becoming just as bad in some ways. The BBC, as much as anyone, has subscribed to a sort of cartoonish portrayal of news stories as involving only tragedy, celebrities and terrorists. This sort of lazy, star-gazing journalism is rife at the moment in media outlets as diverse as The Sun and the Observer. The propensity of crappy magazines like Heat, and crappy channels like E!, don't exactly help.

    What's scary is the degree to which people have taken their eye off the ball when it comes to monitoring their governments. People think that once they've read Stupid White Men, they've got the Bush 2.0.1 all sussed out.

    Hopefully, the BBC won't completely castrate itself - though as an excellent article in this week's New Statesman states, the new acting Director General has dug his own grave (if you'll pardon the expression) by apologising so unreservedly. There's also the risk of the Government dismantling the Beeb to some extent - though if they try that, they can consider themselves f---ed at the next election.

    I'm considering preparing my placards now....

  21. amnesiac1984 macrumors 6502a

    Jun 9, 2002
    Yes because the machine is working maybe?
  22. whocares macrumors 65816


    Oct 9, 2002
    IMHO, Fox News in the same sentence as honest qualifies as an oxymoron :rolleyes:

    And just because a majority of americans watch it, doesn't make F News a good reliable news source :rolleyes:
  23. jayb2000 macrumors 6502a


    Apr 18, 2003
    RI -> CA -> ME
    Because they do stuff like this:

    Senate debate on judicial nominees has fractious start
    By Klaus Marre, The Hill, November 13, 2003

    The 30-hour debate on President Bush's judicial nominees began on a testy note Wednesday night.

    After Republicans walked into the Senate chamber together to begin the extraordinary session, Democrats argued that their move was not a show of unity but rather a television stunt orchestrated for Fox News. They pointed to a memo from Manuel Miranda, a staffer for Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist (R-Tenn.), which said:

    "It is important to double efforts to get your boss to S-230 on time ... Fox News Channel is really excited about this marathon and Brit Hume at 6 would love to open with all our 51 senators walking onto the floor -- the producer wants to know will we walk in exactly at 6:02 when the show starts so they get it live to open Brit Hume's show? Or if not, can we give them an exact time for the walk-in start?"

    Also, because they get memo's every day on what talking points of the Bush administration they should work with.

    Roger Ailes, CEO of Fox News, was Nixon's media strategist and worked on Bush 41's campaign, among other unsavory jobs, like pushing cigarettes.

    Gee, I wonder why people think they are conservative? :rolleyes:
  24. Sparky's macrumors 6502a


    Feb 11, 2004
    Can someone instruct me as to how to properlydo a quote.

    originally posted by: Paulwhannel

    I mentioned this to my wife and she stopped laughing long enough to say that Al Franken is probably the stupidest Liberal Comedian out there, and I tend to agree.

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