political threads

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by jefhatfield, Apr 2, 2004.

  1. jefhatfield Retired

    jefhatfield

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2000
    #1
    i think from what i can tell, being here as a guest since may or june 2000 and member since july 2000, that i started the political threads just on a whim

    then eventually it got ugly sometimes and i felt like i messed things up and was waiting to get banned ;)

    but after reading them lately, i think while tasteless a lot of the time, they are a good political outlet though not realted to macs or to rumors related to macs

    but, as i mention every six to eight months, one thing i miss from the old days is the ability for regular members to delete a post or thread

    -jef
     
  2. Doctor Q Administrator

    Doctor Q

    Staff Member

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    Los Angeles
    #2
    Does it make much difference? You can always delete the text of your post, so you take back something if you change your mind.

    And if you delete a thread you started, wouldn't it be unfair to others who posted in that thread and perhaps wanted to continue the discussion?

    I don't necessarily disagree with you; I'd just like to understand.
     
  3. Dippo macrumors 65816

    Dippo

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    Sep 27, 2003
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    Charlotte, NC
    #3

    But what happens when the totally destroy your arguments, and make you go home crying to your mama? Shouldn't you have to ability to delete the whole thread as revenge? :p
     
  4. gwuMACaddict macrumors 68040

    gwuMACaddict

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2003
    Location:
    washington dc
    #4
    the political threads are interesting sometimes, but its seems as though most of macrumors tends to lean a bit left. i dont have a problem with this, only that sometimes the threads seem a bit, how to say it, weighted to one side? i would appreciate some intelligent banter from either side, but it mostly seems like postes just spout the respective rhetoric, and i can listen to that crap on the radio...
     
  5. Dippo macrumors 65816

    Dippo

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    Location:
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    #5
    The political forums aren't just a little bit to the left, they are far to the left.

    I have posted a few times in there, but it seems opposing views are not wanted.

    It is a place for Bush bashing and little else.
     
  6. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    Nov 14, 2003
    Location:
    Washington, DC
    #6
    I think the reason it seems like the forums lean to the left is because now is a bad time to be a Bush fan, and some people (above) might not be too happy about that. It's pretty hard to make any objective analysis other than: Bush made a huge mistake invading Iraq for which our country and all of us will pay for years to come. And Bush and his crew are liars about issues of national security. Not a good time at all.

    But in general, the political posts aren't as swayed as you're pretending. There are a lot of libertarians here, for example. I just think that right now the conservatives are hiding, just like Bush wishes he could (and when he testifies about 9/11, will be, behind Cheaney).
     
  7. gwuMACaddict macrumors 68040

    gwuMACaddict

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2003
    Location:
    washington dc
    #7
    see, without getting in to the debate right in this forum, this is the kind of hapless rhetoric that i'm refering to. no examples, no defense of the position you're taking, just spouting off. i wouldn't be so brash to blatently declare that 'it's pretty hard to make any objective analysis', I for one feel comfortable about the liberation of the Iraqi people and am happy to know that a ruthless dictator is out of power. political discusion forums can't really go anywhere or be all that interesting if people aren't up for inteligent debate... i know we there have been a few decent threads, and not all poster's are like this, but the above statement was just a perfect example of the point i was trying to make in my first post.
     
  8. eyelikeart Moderator emeritus

    eyelikeart

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    Metairie, LA
    #8
    Exactly. I don't see any purpose to drag this back out into the spotlight again. One member ruined it for everyone, and that's that.
     
  9. jefhatfield thread starter Retired

    jefhatfield

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2000
    #9

    but that poster was a PC vs Mac baiter and he's been banned...he he...and i don't miss him at all

    for the most part i think we can trust the posters and general attidude now of macrumors to make people have the same options they did in the beginning...basically, a little more freedom for the posters and less work for you guys

    btw, hats off to all you moderators...you have made macrumors a great and more civilized place
     
  10. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    Nov 14, 2003
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    #10
    Yeah, you're right. I went too far. I was feeling punchy when I woke up this morning.

    I agree with you that people shouldn't hide behind empty rhetoric. It's not very interesting, and it doesn't contribute to intelligent debate. That's often the problem with politics in general: the real issues are extremely complex and our politicians don't have the time, or really the opportunity to explain them to swaths of the population, so they use rhetoric that oversimplifies, but hopefully sounds good.

    Still though, on some level, I think that calls for civility can sometimes mask a weak hand. It's also an election year, so things are bound to heat up. I think that's the point that I was trying to make, if caustically. Bush is in trouble right now, and a lot of it traces back to the rhetoric. On some level, it seems to me, he's being called on his oversimplifications, which are something all politicians are forced to make.

    I also think there are a variety of voices here that can contribute to a fairly broad-based debate. No side has all the answers. I think that deep down we all know that. Political groups tend to represent legitimate interests.
     
  11. gwuMACaddict macrumors 68040

    gwuMACaddict

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    washington dc
    #11
    miloblithe
    i agree completely... hopefully we will see some intellignet banter now that election season is upon us... but i'm not gonna hold my breath ;) :D
     
  12. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    Nov 14, 2003
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    Washington, DC
    #12
    Well I'm glad we could agree to agree to disagree about our agreement, or something.

    Go Gee Dub! Next year we'll get further than the first round of the NIT.
     
  13. pseudobrit macrumors 68040

    pseudobrit

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    #13
    Rational, fact-based arguments are welcome from all. There is plenty of BS that gets tossed out from both the left and right, and the BS from the left is sometimes unchallenged, while the BS from the right is usually scrutinised and debunked.

    The Political forums run on facts. There is a strong core of posters who will hold your feet to the fire if you don't use them.

    Dippo, your recent posts have been non-factual and troll-like in nature.
    That is why your "views" are not welcome.
     
  14. wdlove macrumors P6

    wdlove

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2002
    #14
    It seems that politics and religion are the two subjects that are difficult to discuss in public. The majority have a strong viewpoint one way or the other as mentioned above by many. Both are very deeply held beliefs and bring up strong feelings. It really takes someone with strong beliefs and communication skills to really make a difference. Otherwise a person can get flustered and that is where anger arises.
     
  15. rugdude macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2004
    Location:
    New Jersey
    #15
    Bush people hiding?

    Why whold those of us that support bush hide? What do we have to be afraid of? Democracy in Iraq will turn out to be the best thing to happen to that region since Jesus.
     
  16. pseudobrit macrumors 68040

    pseudobrit

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    #16
    I'm a fan of sarcasm too.
     
  17. Frohickey macrumors 6502a

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    PRK
    #17
    Lets hope that Iraq gets a Constitutionally-limited republic instead of a democracy. Democracy can be bad if you are part of the minority.
     
  18. Doctor Q Administrator

    Doctor Q

    Staff Member

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    Los Angeles
    #18
    And two subjects where you are unlikely to change somebody's mind. I often wonder what the point of the arguments, I mean discussions, is. If everybody talks and nobody listens, does anybody benefit?
     
  19. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    #19
    Good point, and a realistic one. The US is trying to come up with some complex system to keep things in balance. It's gonna be tricky. But for those of us watching at home, it'll still be referred to as "democracy."
     
  20. JesseJames macrumors 6502a

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    How'd I get here? How can I leave?
    #20
    Good God. You all have got to be kidding. I hate to say it but this Iraq thing is doomed to failure. Those people have been at eachothers necks for centuries. It's still a tribal culture with no tradition of democracy.
    If they do pull it together, it will truly be a miracle.
     
  21. blue&whiteman macrumors 65816

    blue&whiteman

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    Nov 30, 2003
    #21
    I am 36. was a christian for most of my life. went with my mother as a kid. none of the church services ever made much sense to me, nor the people that went there. 6 years ago I turned to buddhism and I feel whole because of it.
     
  22. Dippo macrumors 65816

    Dippo

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    Charlotte, NC
    #22
    Well at least you are honest and up front that other views are not welcome.

    Would you like to point out any of my non-factual post????
    Here are my only three posts in the last weeks:

    I was was just expressing my views and adding to the discussion :rolleyes:
     
  23. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    Washington, DC
    #23
    It's not a good idea to use the term "those people." You know, on some level I agree with you. I think it's a mess and the chances for success are low. But, not to borrow too heavily from the Republican playbook (for fear of making myself sick), but the idea that "those people" are somehow incapable of anything other than tribal struggle is racist and unfair. 1000 years ago, the Islamic world was the cradle of civilization, far more advanced than anywhere else in the world. Success, unfortunately, breeds conservatism, and eventually they stagnated and fell behind. But things change, and this is a long term project. We've been in Japan (no tradition of democracy prior to US occupation) for 60 years and Germany (minimal tradition of democracy prior to US occupation) the same. These things take time.

    Of course, Iraq is not Japan. Nor is it Germany. It has it's own traditions that have to be built upon. But the idea that "those people" can do no better than go at each other isn't going to get any of us anywhere.
     
  24. Frohickey macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2003
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    PRK
    #24
    I'd rather believe that the Iraqis are going to succeed in creating a modern society. If its possible in Japan, then its possible in Iraq. The Arab civilization was the 'backup-tapes' for the multiple civilizations, Egyptian, Christian, etc. The Arab scholars translation of various texts into Arabic, and the organization of these into libraries predated Gutenberg's printing press.

    The only thing I hope that doesn't happen is when Iraq finally has a modern society, that they do NOT EVER CREATE AN ANIMATED TELEVISION PROGRAM WHERE THE MAIN CHARACTERS HAVE TAILS, SHOOT BOLTS OF ENERGY THROUGH THEIR HANDS AND ARE IN A STUPID SEARCH FOR SOME BALLS THAT SUMMON DRAGONS. ;)
     
  25. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    #25
    Thanks. I think this thread, and all of us, needed a good laugh.

    I know I did.
     

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