Recommend Boom Mic setup?

Discussion in 'Digital Audio' started by Sdashiki, May 15, 2008.

  1. macrumors 68040

    Sdashiki

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    #1
    This is for work, so bear with me when I say I need to buy this from BH (which im sure isnt going to be difficult)

    Anyway, Im no audiophile and we do not need anything over the top, but without any audio knowledge its hard to just search for something when you dont know what you need.

    Looking for a simple overhead boom pole mic setup.

    Like philip seymour hoffman's character in Boogie Nights...

    Our current setup only really allows for 1-2 mic inputs on the MiniDV camcorder(s)...and in some things I will be shooting in the coming months will require grabbing dialogue from multiple people together talking. I feel a boom mic is the best for this kind of capture. But, what mic to put on the boom is the real question.

    Any ideas, suggestions would be appreciated.
     
  2. macrumors regular

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    #2
    What's your budget? Why only B&H?
     
  3. macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #3
    when selecting the pole, the main thing will be the length of reach vs how compact it needs to be. also, i recommend against the kind with the cable inside; i've found that during movement the cable bangs against the pole and gets recorded. even worse are the ones where the cable comes out of the very bottom of the pole, so you can't stand the pole on its end.

    you might also want to get a pistol grip for the mic -- it will screw on the end of the pole when needed, but also gives you the ability to use the mic "handheld" but still in its harness. get a zeppelin and a fuzzy monkey if you'll be outside at all.

    the mic itself is dictated by budget. my favorite is the schoeps system, with the mk41 (hypercardioid) capsule. get the cut1 filter if you can afford it, and the elbow if you'll be inside with a low ceiling.

    if the schoeps is too pricey, check out the sanken mics. i hear they're good for the price, though i've never used one.
     
  4. macrumors 6502a

    AviationFan

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    #4
    Very true!

    I second this suggestion. Indoors, I don't know anything that sounds better ("better" as in "more natural, real") than the Schoeps 641 combo. Outdoors, I mostly use a Sennheiser MKH416 with excellent results.

    If it's outdoors, get a good windscreen. A full blimp system if great sound in very windy conditions is a must.

    And to top it off, a good field mixer (like any of the Sound Devices mixers) between the mic and the camera will help improve your audio. Good pre-amps, accessible gain controls, and reliable limiters are worth a fortune.

    By the time you add all this up, it's not a cheap solution by any means. But you'll have all the tools for very, very good sound recording.

    - Martin
     
  5. thread starter macrumors 68040

    Sdashiki

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    #5
    Very good advice all around, but I think its a bit much for our purposes.

    Its really just to capture good dialogue from a group scene with 3-4 people talking and not having individual lapel mics. I figured a hanging boom mic over the scene would grab the audio best. GOOD = anything better than the built in camcorder mic (not hard to beat)

    We are looking to spend under $200 on the mic/boom arm. I know it aint much in the field of audio capture, but its what I gots to work with.

    With that in mind, I am just stumped as to how to search through BH categories and all that looking for what I need.

    Oh, and it would be preferable (though is it even possible?) to have the mic be passive and not need any external power source? Direct connect to camcorder with a minijack. Im sure this makes me sound like the newbest audiophile ever.

    Am I going to be forced to use XLR inputs and a power pack of somekind inbetween the mic and camcorder?



    BH because its where we are purchasing all the other stuff for this project, and the dept like continuity...
     
  6. macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #6
    buy the boom and rent the mic until you can save up more for a mic.

    call BH and let them talk you through it. in general, i've found them to be knowledgeable and helpful.

    i would definitely not recommend a dynamic for this purpose. i'm not sure what the issue is with you're not wanting to use phantom power, but many mics are driven by internal batteries, if that route works for you.
     
  7. thread starter macrumors 68040

    Sdashiki

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    #7
    Not looking for anything that over complicates the setup. We arent shooting a TV commercial, no need for a mic that is considered Professional and costs $1000+

    Hell it doesnt need to even be a mic specifically for overhead dialogue pickup. Just a mic I could hang above the scene. Im not seeking fancy, just functional. Maybe I just need a typical handheald 1/8 jack mic, suspended from a good boom arm?

    I can not seem to locate thru BH boom arms that arent the kind that you put on the floor (like for a speech, assembly) and are the kind you just hold over your head. WTF am I looking for wrong?
     
  8. macrumors 6502a

    AviationFan

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    #8
    You should be looking for a "boom pole". B&H has lots of them:

    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/shop/8659/Boompoles_Fishpoles.html

    - Martin
     
  9. thread starter macrumors 68040

    Sdashiki

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    #9
    They hid that sh*t under

    General Video Equipment « Audio for Video « Portable Audio « Boompoles & Fishpoles


    and not

    Professional Audio « Recording « Microphones « Recording Microphones « General Accessories « Floor Stands & Boom Arms


    how odd.

    Are these boom poles only made to accept certain styles of mics? How do you attach it to the pole?
     
  10. macrumors 6502a

    AviationFan

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    #10
    You need a shock mount that holds the mic, suspended by rubber bands or something like that. The shockmount has a thread fitted for the screw at the end of the boompole.

    So yes, we forgot to add a shock mount to your shopping list in our previous posts. Here's your link to the B&H web site:

    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/shop/8709/Shock_Swivel_Mounts.html

    - Martin
     
  11. macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #11
    pistol grips usually have those built-in, yes?
     
  12. thread starter macrumors 68040

    Sdashiki

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    #12
  13. macrumors 6502a

    AviationFan

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    #13
    Yes, you are right, they do.

    - Martin
     
  14. macrumors 6502a

    junior

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    #14
  15. macrumors regular

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    #15
  16. thread starter macrumors 68040

    Sdashiki

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    #16
    Do mics with XLR outputs require a power source typically?
     
  17. macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #17
    it depends entirely on the kind of mic. condensers need phantom, dynamics and ribbons don't.
     
  18. thread starter macrumors 68040

    Sdashiki

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    #18
  19. macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #19
    that's a side-address mic; you want an end-address mic. an sm57 is an example of an end-address mic (though i wouldn't want to use one on a filmset, except for a gunshot maybe).

    on set, phantom power for mics will come from either:

    1. a battery in the mic
    2. a standalone, 9-volt powered box that sits between the mic and the XLR in
    3. the mixer
    4. the recorder
    5. the XLR converter attached to the bottom of a consumer digital camera
    6. built-in on a fancier pro digital camera

    depends on the mic and the setup.
     
  20. thread starter macrumors 68040

    Sdashiki

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    #20
    Well, thank you for all the help, i think my best bet is a "nice" handheld mic, dangling from a boom pole with a proper shock mount.

    adding the complication of XLR and power considerations is far too much for this tiny setup we have.

    though, in the future all this knowledge will certainly come in useful, when/if we get a bigger budget! :cool:
     
  21. thread starter macrumors 68040

    Sdashiki

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    #21
    Ok, i got a bigger budget. :p

    And I appreciate all the help I got in this thread, still alot is confusing to me, and I dont have the experience to know what the hell Id be looking for. Id much prefer a good kick in the right direction for our needs.


    Can someone recommend everything we'd need to purchase for:

    wirelessly capturing dialog from talking heads (clip on micl; someone talking directly to the camera, typically indoors but sometimes outdoors)

    wired boom mic (capturing group audio of more than one person talking where the number of people make clip on mics not the better choice)

    If the camcorder has a single audio input, and I want to have multiple mics feed it, how do I do that?

    The mics would need to work with a typical 1/8" audio jack for the Sony VX2100 or if I go with the Panasonic DVX100B, XLR. Again, bigger budget...trying to stay near $200-600 for the setup(s) described above.
     
  22. macrumors newbie

    mediacobbler

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    Aug 26, 2009
    #22
    setup solution

    how about a shure sm58 on a broomstick/ tripod setup total cost : $150 and as an added bonus you'll look uber professional
     
  23. macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #23
    fantastic for recording gunshots and explosions. not so much for dialog.
     
  24. macrumors G4

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    #24
    I've seen a great gadget that fixes this problem. It attaches to the camera's tripod and then the box has aother tripod socket on it. You can plug in XLR cables and it has 1/8th in out plus gain controls and a headphone jack. I'm sure B&H has this. Cuts down on the "rats nest effect"

    Funy thing is that when peole watch video they will put up with all kinds of poor video quality, poor lighting and not with poor sound. Even uneducated viewers will notice every audio defect and let the video glitches go by.

    Another way to fix this problem is to buy more mics and a mixer. Use a mic on ever person.

    I solved the problem of not enough inputs and no mixer a few times by using another miniDV cam. Just set it up on a second tripod and let it roll, un-manned.
     
  25. macrumors regular

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    #25
    That's because TV is radio with pictures.

    A large percentage of information is transmitted through the sound portion.
     

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