RIAA sues a 12 yr old girl.

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by MacBytes, Sep 9, 2003.

  1. MacBytes macrumors bot

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  2. robbieduncan Moderator emeritus

    robbieduncan

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    #2
    Sueing a 12 year old is wrong (and probably impossible) but I found her mothers coment very interesting "It's not like we were doing anything illegal". Downloading music is illegal. Perhaps people need to stop and think before they break the law?
     
  3. big macrumors 65816

    big

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    #3
    what is the time limit on downloads? if its been over a couple of years since breaking the law, they coudn't get you, could they??
     
  4. patrick0brien macrumors 68040

    patrick0brien

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    #4
    -big

    You know what? That's a good question. I don't think that there is a statute of limitations on Intellectual Property theft as that would be a civil matter. AFAIK statutes of limitations only apply to criminal matters.

    This means there is civil jurisdiction as long as the copyright lasts.
     
  5. Mudbug Administrator emeritus

    Mudbug

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    #5
    yeah - I've got all kinds of issues with suing a 12 year old, but Momma should have known what her kids were doing (which it looks like she did, but was not aware enough to know it was illegal? wtf?)...

    but my biggest problem with this story is something that has run rampant in internet usage: teh for the.

    I saw a rant about this in the forums before, so I won't encourage another, but this bothered me:

    Apparently the author isn't an honor student, or just doesn't know how to use a spell checker.
     
  6. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #6
    I thought the RIAA was interested in people who were offering up music off their computers, not people who just downloaded it. Of course I gotta wonder how truthful that mother was being. Are people really dumb enough to think that a one time $30 fee (presumably for the ad-free version of Kazaa?) gives you unlimited access to music?
     
  7. big macrumors 65816

    big

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    #7
    well, it seems like this is ludacrious anyways.... but one could be sued for an illigal download made 5 years ago. How do they know someone is downloading music anyways?

    is there an illigal porn industry cop lurking somewhere, trying to catch you looking at pretty girls?

    this whole thing seems extremely unfigured out, suing a 12 year old little girl....that's just wrong
     
  8. chadfromdallas macrumors member

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    #8
    Or maybe just made a small mistake :eek: :rolleyes: ;)
     
  9. howard macrumors 68020

    howard

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    Nov 18, 2002
    #9
    its hard to believe but yes, i bet that alot of people are that ignorant of technology and law.


    as for the use of teh instead of the...in a form who cares but in a news article that should not happen. learn to proof read!...the author probably didn't even re read his own article...let alone and editor.
     
  10. patrick0brien macrumors 68040

    patrick0brien

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    #10
    -big

    You know what? That's a good question. I don't think that there is a statute of limitations on Intellectual Property theft as that would be a civil matter. AFAIK statutes of limitations only apply to criminal matters.

    This means there is civil jurisdiction as long as the copyright lasts.
     
  11. big macrumors 65816

    big

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    Feb 20, 2002
    #11
    umm, you just said that.....

    ok, so I understand that you could easily figure out who was sharing music, but how about downloading it, unless your doing for hours, its a little hard to catch users online, unless Kazaa was selling or giving out user IP's or names of who bought their software (or the RIAA created Kazaa!!)

    so how are people caught anyways??
     
  12. Mudbug Administrator emeritus

    Mudbug

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    #12
    well, I don't know for sure, but I know the ISP's can use carnivore or other packet sniffers to see what data is coming through their pipes. And if I'm not mistaken, the Kazaa usernames show in the list of download hosts (like bittorrent) so it's just a matter of watching the two together, or just following IP #s. You can trace down to specific networks then, and get the user lists from the ISP's to identify the users.

    that's how I'd do it, at least...
     
  13. big macrumors 65816

    big

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    #13
    hmmm, what privacy rights do people have in real life? can we apply these to online services?

    ie, if I want to walk around naked in my house, I have that right, and if someone looks through a window, its their loss/win, I can not be tried for public display of nudity...

    though if someone saw me chopping up another peron, that would be ok....

    no one can tap my phone with out a court order, so why can they tap my internet connection??

    whats the line between murder and nudity, or talking on the phone, where I could talk about either of these (free speech).
     
  14. jxyama macrumors 68040

    jxyama

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    #14
    if you walked around naked on your balcony - where the public can readily see you - you can be charged for indecent exposure, even if you are on your private property...

    i don't know about phone tapping. i don't know what kind of agreement you sign with the phone company, but as far as most ISPs go, you sign an agreement that your data and use history could be turned over to the authority. i don't know if RIAA asking ISP for your data would require a court order...

    privacy != anonymity... if you are doing something illegal, it's hard to argue that you should be protected as it's a private matter...

    as for the 12 year old being sued, it's media hype. it's not that RIAA is targeting 12 year olds. they are targeting file sharers... and one of the targeted happened to be 12 years old. it won't sell too many newspapers if all they reported was that the majority of file swappers were college/HS kids. (It's foxnews, figured...)

    it's a classic quote: "Out of all the people, why does it have to be me?"

    there are other things she said that are a little ridiculous and i really don't like the tone of the article. it's very sensationalized. for all we care, fox could have had this type of an article as a template and just filled in the details...
     
  15. Fukui macrumors 68000

    Fukui

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    #15
    They are, trust me.
    I have seen people tell others not to buy compaq computers...why? Because they are crap? No. Because they "only claim to be compatible with windows" I guess that means that they aren't (?)
    This is the average computer user.
     
  16. Knox Administrator

    Knox

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    UK
    #16
    "It turns out that Brianna's mum paid a $29.99 service charge to KaZaA for the company's music service. Brianna, however, thought this meant she could download songs at will. How naive!"

    http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/32731.html referencing http://nypost.com/news/regionalnews/5349.htm
     
  17. jxyama macrumors 68040

    jxyama

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    Apr 3, 2003
    #17
    i just want to bring up something...

    i realize it's far easier to label some companies as bad: RIAA, phillips morris, etc. but i'd like to mention that there are people involved at those companies.

    when CD sales go down, some low level workers at RIAA may be let go. (whether CD sales going down is due to p2p is a whole different matter. i'm just trying to point out that RIAA is trying to keep its business intact...) when some "i'm not responsible for anything" idiot wins a big lawsuit against Phillips Morris, some tobacco workers may be laid off.

    i have a very close friend who is from a country with a bad history of human rights issues. while it's easy to label the country as "evil" and "bad", but it's not so easy to do when someone you personally know could be affected.

    all this doesn't "excuse" the badness of those companies or countries, but i'd like to ask for some compassion for those that may be more personally affected by all these issues.
     
  18. cubist macrumors 68020

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    Muncie, Indiana
    #18
    People can get new jobs. We don't have to keep the Soviet Penal Colonies going out of sympathy for the guards employed there, do we?

    The price of CDs is rampant gouging, no matter what the RIAA says. The artist gets 25 cents, the disk and box cost 25 cents. The rest of the money for "promotion and distribution"? Give me a break. No other manufactured product has that kind of insane markup.

    And think of all the people who can't buy CDs because they need money for food or gasoline. These people might buy some if the price were lower. That, in turn, might lead to more people having jobs.
     
  19. Bunzi2k4 macrumors 6502

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    San Diego, California
    #19
    i think sueing a 12 year old girl is kinda wierd, but i also think that this is being advertised so we can all think the riaa is evil but they are defending themselves, like jxyama was saying... but i do agree that the prices are jacked the artist gets 25 cents... its unreasonable......
     
  20. Lord Bodak macrumors 6502

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    Chesapeake, VA USA
    #20
    It would seem they have to go after the owner of the ISP account (like the grandfather who is being sued, when it was his grandchildren using it when they visited).

    Most ISPs have an under-18 clause in the terms of service, so the 12 year old's case could get interesting.
     
  21. crazedbytheheat macrumors regular

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    Aug 23, 2003
    #21
    From what I've read about these suits, the RIAA went out and downloaded from available servers. Therefore, you'd have the IP and the proof that the files were being shared from the given IP. The girl may not have known she was offering the files for sharing, but I'm betting she was.
    :eek:
     
  22. pgwalsh macrumors 68000

    pgwalsh

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    #22
    I think Kazaa should be responsible as they are charging a fee for the service; in her case.
     
  23. Fender2112 macrumors 6502a

    Fender2112

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    Charlotte, NC
    #23
    I've never been to KaZaA. But if I was paying for a service, I would assume I could download whatever was offered on the site. I did it for years on AOL before I unstood shareware and freeware. If they didn't want me to have it they would not put it on the internet.

    I can easily see how some people would think this is legal.

    Here's something I learned a few days ago about how information can be used in court. If the information is not obtained in a legal or official way, it can not be used as effidence. If the RIAA is not following the proper proceedure, these folks they are suing may get away with what they are doing.

    This is a really touchy topic and I've been following for awhile. It puts one person's rights for privacy against another's right of ownership. Just because you suspect someone of a copyright infringment, does not give you a right to invade their privacy. Just because you have a right to privacy doen't mean you can do anything you want. It will be interesting to see how all of this pans out.
     
  24. chadfromdallas macrumors member

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    #24

    Why are they paying for Kazaa?!?!?! lol
     
  25. bennetsaysargh macrumors 68020

    bennetsaysargh

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    New York
    #25
    this is just stupid. the RIAA has no heart at all. the little girl must feel horrible right now. :(
    i just hope the RIAA pays in the end.:mad:
     

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