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GnrlyMrly

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Apr 23, 2006
565
70
Atlanta, GA
http://www.cnn.com/2007/TECH/space/04/25/habitable.planet.ap/index.html

story.gliese.afp.gi.jpg


WASHINGTON (AP) -- European astronomers have found the most Earth-like planet outside our solar system, and here's what it might be like to live there:

The "sun" wouldn't burn brightly. It would hang close, large and red in the sky, glowing faintly like a charcoal ember. And it probably would never set if you lived on the sunny side of the planet.

You could have a birthday party every 13 days because that's how fast this new planet circles its sun-like star. But watch the cake -- you'd weigh a whole lot more than you do on Earth.

You might be able to keep your current wardrobe. The temperature in this alien setting will likely be a lot like Earth's -- not too hot, not too cold.

And that "just right" temperature is one key reason astronomers think this planet could conceivably house life outside our solar system. It's also as close to Earth-sized as telescopes have ever spotted. Both elements make it the first potentially habitable planet besides Earth or Mars.

Astronomers who announced the discovery of the new planet Tuesday say this puts them closer to answering the cosmic question: Are we alone?

"It's a significant step on the way to finding possible life in the universe," said University of Geneva astronomer Michel Mayor, one of 11 European scientists on the team that found the new body. "It's a nice discovery. We still have a lot of questions."

There's still a lot that is unknown about the new planet, which could be deemed inhospitable to life once more is learned about it. But as galaxies go, it's practically a neighbor. At only 120 trillion miles away, the red dwarf star that this planet circles is one of the 100 closest to Earth.

The results of the discovery have not been published but have been submitted to the journal Astronomy and Astrophysics.

Alan Boss, who works at the Carnegie Institution of Washington where a U.S. team of astronomers competed in the hunt for an Earth-like planet, called it "a major milestone in this business."

The planet was discovered by the European Southern Observatory's telescope in La Silla, Chile, which has a special instrument that splits light to find wobbles in different wavelengths. Those wobbles can reveal the existence of other worlds.

What they revealed is a planet circling the red dwarf star, Gliese 581. Red dwarfs are low-energy, tiny stars that give off dim red light and last longer than stars like our sun. Until a few years ago, astronomers didn't consider these stars as possible hosts of planets that might sustain life.

The discovery of the new planet, named 581 c, is sure to fuel studies of planets circling similar dim stars. About 80 percent of the stars near Earth are red dwarfs.

The new planet is about five times heavier than Earth, and gravity there would be 1.6 times as strong as Earth's. Its discoverers aren't certain if it is rocky like Earth or if its a frozen ice ball with liquid water on the surface. If it is rocky like Earth, which is what the prevailing theory proposes, it has a diameter about 11/2 times bigger than our planet. If it is an iceball, as Mayor suggests, it would be even bigger.

Based on theory, 581 c should have an atmosphere, but what's in that atmosphere is still a mystery and if it's too thick that could make the planet's surface temperature too hot, Mayor said.

However, the research team believes the average temperature to be somewhere between 32 and 104 degrees and that set off celebrations among astronomers.

Until now, all 220 planets astronomers have found outside our solar system have had the "Goldilocks problem." They've been too hot, too cold or just plain too big and gaseous, like uninhabitable Jupiter.

The new planet seems just right -- or at least that's what scientists think.

"This could be very important," said NASA astrobiology expert Chris McKay, who was not part of the discovery team. "It doesn't mean there is life, but it means it's an Earth-like planet in terms of potential habitability."

Eventually astronomers will rack up discoveries of dozens, maybe even hundreds of planets considered habitable, the astronomers said. But this one -- simply called "c" by its discoverers when they talk among themselves -- will go down in cosmic history as No. 1.

Besides having the right temperature, the new planet is probably full of liquid water, hypothesizes Stephane Udry, the discovery team's lead author and another Geneva astronomer. But that is based on theory about how planets form, not on any evidence, he said.

"Liquid water is critical to life as we know it," co-author Xavier Delfosse of Grenoble University in France, said in a statement. "Because of its temperature and relative proximity, this planet will most probably be a very important target of the future space missions dedicated to the search for extraterrestrial life. On the treasure map of the Universe, one would be tempted to mark this planet with an X."

Other astronomers cautioned it's too early to tell whether there is water.

"You need more work to say it's got water or it doesn't have water," said retired NASA astronomer Steve Maran, press officer for the American Astronomical Society. "You wouldn't send a crew there assuming that when you get there, they'll have enough water to get back."

The new planet's star system is a mere 20.5 light years away, making Gliese 581 one of the 100 closest stars to Earth. It's so dim, you can't see it without a telescope, but it's somewhere in the constellation Libra, which is low in the southeastern sky during the mid-evening in the Northern Hemisphere.

Even so, Maran noted, "We don't know how to get to those places in a human lifetime."

But, oh, the view, if you could. The planet is 14 times closer to the star it orbits. Udry figures the red dwarf star would hang in the sky at a size 20 times larger than our moon. And it's likely, but still not known, that the planet doesn't rotate, so one side would always be sunlit and the other dark.

Two teams of astronomers, one in Europe and one in the United States, have been racing to be the first to find a planet like 581 c outside the solar system.

The European team looked at 100 different stars using a tool called HARPS (High Accuracy Radial Velocity for Planetary Searcher) to find this one planet, said Xavier Bonfils of the Lisbon Observatory, one of the co-discoverers.

Much of the effort to find Earth-like planets has focused on stars like our sun with the challenge being to find a planet the right distance from the star it orbits. About 90 percent of the time, the European telescope focused its search more on sun-like stars, Udry said.

A few weeks before the European discovery earlier this month, a scientific paper in the journal Astrobiology theorized a few days that red dwarf stars were good candidates.

"Now we have the possibility to find many more," Bonfils said.
 

Queso

Suspended
Mar 4, 2006
11,821
8
I like the fact they think it doesn't spin. I take it this means roughly one half of the planet is going to be frozen waste, if there's water that is.

I wonder how many others there are out there.

BTW, on a ever-so-slightly related astronomical note, has anyone seen just how big the star Antares is compared to our Sun? :eek:
 

dmw007

macrumors G4
May 26, 2005
10,635
0
Working for MI-6
Well, I suppose it looks like we found a replacement for our planet once we finally kill it. ;)

Actually, it is a cool discovery. Now we just need to figure out a way to get there. :)
 

Queso

Suspended
Mar 4, 2006
11,821
8
Well, I suppose it looks like we found a replacement for our planet once we finally kill it. ;)

Actually, it is a cool discovery. Now we just need to figure out a way to get there. :)
Hollow out Juno, set it spinning, name it Thistledown and send it off.
 

Queso

Suspended
Mar 4, 2006
11,821
8
wheres the jaw-dropping smilie when you need it...
Not to thread hijack, but here's a quick comparison off Wikipedia, showing our Sun, Arcturus and Antares to scale. That's one BIG ball of gas!!

551px-Arcturus-antares-2.gif


The black line BTW isn't the dimensions of Antares, but the orbit of Mars to the same scale. Antares stretches out to the edges of the yellow/orange circle. Sat at the centre of our Solar System, Antares would nearly reach the orbit of Jupiter.
 

PlaceofDis

macrumors Core
Jan 6, 2004
19,241
6
interesting. perhaps it has a very slow rotation though? suppose it'd take a while to figure out though.

and that picture is astounding dynamicv.
 

mattscott306

macrumors 68040
Jan 16, 2007
3,769
0
Not to thread hijack, but here's a quick comparison off Wikipedia, showing our Sun, Arcturus and Antares to scale. That's one BIG ball of gas!!

The black line BTW isn't the dimensions of Antares, but the orbit of Mars to the same scale. Antares stretches out to the edges of the yellow/orange circle. Sat at the centre of our Solar System, Antares would nearly reach the orbit of Jupiter.

I wonder how far in comparison to our sun does a planet have to be to sustain life...
 

QCassidy352

macrumors G5
Mar 20, 2003
12,028
6,036
Bay Area
I find it interesting, though, that Mars also satisfies the definition of an "earth-like planet" that is being applied to this planet. So it would not necessarily be suitable for human habitation...
 

Marble

macrumors 6502a
May 13, 2003
771
5
Tucson, AZ
If it doesn't rotate isn't it unlikely to have a magnetic field strong enough to shield the planet from solar radiation?
 

Keebler

macrumors 68030
Jun 20, 2005
2,960
207
Canada
i think it's kind of neat, but it makes me wonder how long it would take us to get there. maybe we need to make some 'how to dvds', set up an invetro tube and launch a baby or 2 or more ;) and launch it towards that planet :)

if we could only put half the effort into repairing this planet's problems, maybe we wouldn't need to worry about another one :)
 

notjustjay

macrumors 603
Sep 19, 2003
6,056
167
Canada, eh?
So is this a Class M planet? :D

I read in our local papers that with our current-fastest spacecraft technology, it would take us 5 billion years to get there.

We really need to work on lightspeed travel.
 

PlaceofDis

macrumors Core
Jan 6, 2004
19,241
6
I find it interesting, though, that Mars also satisfies the definition of an "earth-like planet" that is being applied to this planet. So it would not necessarily be suitable for human habitation...

i do too. but its probably due to the size, proximity to us, and other similar aspects. being in our solar system makes mars the most easily accessible planet for us to get to, and try to sustain life on at this point in time.
 

Eric5h5

macrumors 68020
Dec 9, 2004
2,489
590
I read in our local papers that with our current-fastest spacecraft technology, it would take us 5 billion years to get there.

Holy mackerel, the math skills of your local papers are going down the toilet, not to mention knowledge of science. Maybe it would take that long if you walked. :rolleyes: The speed of light is "only" 186,000 miles per second or so. That comes out to more like 90,000 years (give or take a few thousand) at 150,000 mph, which you could probably achieve with a slingshot maneuver using traditional rockets. Plus we have ion drive technology now, which has ten times the thrust-per-pound of fuel compared to those traditional rockets. As long as you don't mind the leisurely pace of acceleration...how does 0 to 60 in 4 days sound. ;) But the thing with space is, there's no friction, so you can accelerate forever as long as you have enough fuel. Or until you reach the speed of light, which is the only speed limit that matters. :) So I'm sure we could shave off thousands of years from that time.

Anyway, not anywhere near 5 billion years...what dingbat came up with that figure. But not quite an afternoon's drive, either....

--Eric
 

orangemacapple

macrumors 6502
Sep 1, 2006
442
0
Raleigh
so... we found a planet that has a temperate climate and can sustain life. with that info, it stands to reason there is life there already (given the same building blocks for life is abundant).

so, are we going to go there and war with them for the right to live there. i doubt they really want us any more than we would want an alien life to come take over our planet.

we would have to kill all the intelligent life there to take over the planet. look what we did when we found the new world (americas). we killed 160m natives either through war or disease and relegated the rest to uninhabitable regions. we'll have to do the same thing there.

why would they give up everything peacefully? we are not a peaceful race. we would not allow them to govern us. we feel we have a divine right to this universe. we are the best.

we've just about killed our planet, and rather than fix it we would rather go find another one to conquer and devastate.

WOULD YOU GO TO BE A SLAVE TO AN ALIEN RACE? of course not -- you would make them your slaves.

we would pillage their planet of resources. think about what america currently does for oil. look what europe did to america for gold.

we have a population explosion. the new planet probably does too -- or needs the room to expand on its own if it doesn't have that problem yet. why do we have the right to take someone else's home away from them. if there is a god, i don't think he'd very happy with our actions.

LEAVE THEM BE! but that's not how it'll be -- there'll always be that little niggling in our minds now that we've found this new "EDEN".
 

notjustjay

macrumors 603
Sep 19, 2003
6,056
167
Canada, eh?
Holy mackerel, the math skills of your local papers are going down the toilet, not to mention knowledge of science. Maybe it would take that long if you walked. :rolleyes: The speed of light is "only" 186,000 miles per second or so.

I admit that I did not really double-check their math. Granted, I also assumed speeds demonstrated by older spacecraft.

Assume the distance from Earth to the outer planets is about 5 light-hours.

It took our Voyager satellites some... 25-30 years to achieve this distance?

This new planet is 20 light years away, or about 175,000 light-hours.

OK, so that's about one million years. Phew. Perhaps there's hope for mankind after all ;)

... yes, you're right, there are probably ways to go much faster than Voyager satellites did.

Now I'm starting to wonder just where my newspaper got its numbers.
 

obeygiant

macrumors 601
Jan 14, 2002
4,178
4,095
totally cool
so, are we going to go there and war with them for the right to live there. i doubt they really want us any more than we would want an alien life to come take over our planet.

The odds are ok to find life on another planet, but to find intelligent life is another matter. By the time the human race actually gets to the point of exploring extra-solar worlds things will be much different. To live 581 c might require a change in the way we breathe air or a change in our physiology. They say 581 c has 1.6 times the gravity of the earth. So after a few generations of humans living there people may start to get shorter and have much denser muscles in order to adapt to the environment.
 
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