Should Kerry Be Jailed?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Desertrat, Sep 19, 2004.

  1. Desertrat macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2003
    Location:
    Terlingua, Texas
    #1
    I'm often told that gun control laws which have been passed are merely "reasonable". Hokay.

    Remember the photo-op of Kerry and the shotgun? Here are some legal ramifications (snippets from an email):

    A Gun-law expert, Alan Korwin, has written seven books on gun laws, including the unabridged plain-English federal guide "Gun Laws of America."

    A gun crossing state lines is heavily regulated, thanks to Congress.

    "There are so many charges Kerry might face," according to Korwin:

    1. Taking ownership of the shotgun gift, if he doesn't already have a valid Massachusetts Firearm Identification Card, could subject him to a two-and-a-half-year prison term in his home state. Since he has claimed publicly he owns firearms, chances are he has this critical piece of paper, Korwin says.

    2. Bringing the firearm back to Massachusetts, if he received it from a private party, would be a federal felony under the 1968 Gun Control Act (five years in prison, $5,000 fine, 18 USC §922).

    3. The only exemption that would allow him to bring it into his home state requires that he obtained it in a face-to-face transaction with a federal firearms licensed dealer (FFL). A private gift would not qualify.

    4. If Kerry did get it from an FFL, he would have had to personally fill out and sign a 4473 form, required by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE), before the gift was given, under penalty of federal felony. 'Rat note: Up to ten years and up to $20K.

    5. If Kerry did not personally undergo a "NICS" instant background check before the transfer from an FFL, he would have put the person conducting the transfer in some legal jeopardy, though the law contains a loophole that probably would save Kerry from additional harm (the dealer, not the recipient, suffers from failure to do the NICS check).

    See what ignorance of the law can mean? Innocent parties, with no evil intent, find themselves in jeopardy. But we're told that ignorance of the law is no excuse...

    (My answer to my rhetorical question is, No!" but Kerry, et all, might reconsider what's "reasonable".)

    'Rat
     
  2. takao macrumors 68040

    takao

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2003
    Location:
    Dornbirn (Austria)
    #2
    sorry to ask but what happened with kerry and shotgun ? (at least i don't remember it)
    if it was a present what sort of present was it ? private or 'public'..i mean did he get the shotgun as private person or in his position as senator ? that might change law...

    i don't think we have to discuss about that
     
  3. mischief macrumors 68030

    mischief

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2001
    Location:
    Santa Cruz Ca
    #3
    A little high on the drama but...

    I see your point.

    Honestly, I feel that Taxes, Guns, Mind Altering Substances, Prostitution, Gambling, vehicles other miscelany like explosives are subject to a mind numbing array of statutes both from the Federal and the State Gvts.

    Being a guy who likes his efficient 'nix based Mac OS and rends to prefer efficiency to feature-laiden crap I also tend to see the current legal statutes as more than a little haphazard and innefficient.

    I'd LOVE to see it all done right but I find that this Nation has entirely too many predatory oppertunists. The irony in my mind is that the whole ratsnest exists because people are paranoid about the Fed having "too much power" and yet the instances of Federal abuses have stemmed from that same kind of paranoia coupled with a system so cumbersome it's feifdoms can do heinous things without much trouble. (Attica, Waco, 1968(?)DNC, McCarthy, the FBI's "blacklist", etc.)

    If there's a solution it'd be a COMPLETE overhaul of the whole system. Not just a convenient re-org of "National Security" agencies into a Gestapo or a few well-hyped pieces of meaningless legislation.
     
  4. patrick0brien macrumors 68040

    patrick0brien

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2002
    Location:
    The West Loop
    #4
    -mischief

    Your point is phenominal. I think you've hit upon the actual problem the U.S. has today, rather than beating around on all of these 'little' symptoms that we all love to debate here in the Politics folum - items like "Kerry Flip-Flops again", and "Cheney Threatens We'll Be Attacked Again".

    However, having done organization changes before, one need to 'eat the loaf of bread' one slice at a time. If one tried to eat the whole loaf a once, well, we'd be dealing with a revolution, and a complete halt to governace, anarchy ("The Postman").

    I look at this reorganization of the National Security Agencies as one such slice. And I, for one, am glad that Bush is aquiescing finally.
     
  5. mischief macrumors 68030

    mischief

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2001
    Location:
    Santa Cruz Ca
    #5

    First off: Thanks.

    On to a response:

    I see the transition to an efficient, up-to-date model as being the same sort as that between OS 9 and OS X. You'd almost have to run them side by side for a while. The existing system is (if you will) designed for a long-dead architecture and obsolete set of user parameters.
     
  6. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2002
    Location:
    Republic of Ukistan
    #6
    What an appropriate analogy for these forums! :)
     
  7. patrick0brien macrumors 68040

    patrick0brien

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2002
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    The West Loop
    #7
    -mischief

    Heh. Absolutely. I run that paradigm just up 17 from you for a living. Ever think about getting into Organizational Change Management? :D
     
  8. mischief macrumors 68030

    mischief

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2001
    Location:
    Santa Cruz Ca
    #8
    Actually yes.. though the oppertunities in Santa Cruz are limited for a Mac Geek with my talents and expertise. I was raised by a Systems Analyst specializing in Employment Exposure Reduction and an Architectural Designer. Systems, flow, networks, business structure and Risk assessment are all pretty second nature to me. I'm under 30 with no impressive credentials so landing a good job based solely on my skills is next to impossible.

    Looking for new talent? :D

    If you are... please PM me and we can talk about it. I have a family to support and my current gig won't cut it much longer.
     
  9. Don't panic macrumors 603

    Don't panic

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2004
    Location:
    having a drink at Milliways
    #9
    Anyone publicly admitting to having seen "the postman" performs an act of honesty rarely seen on any public forum.
    My respect to you.
     
  10. mischief macrumors 68030

    mischief

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2001
    Location:
    Santa Cruz Ca
    #10
    (sheepishly raises hand...)

    Hi, I'm Mischief and I..... I've seen both The Postman AND Dances with Wolves. But I swear I couldn't find anything better to watch... it was a Saturday afternoon and I was pretty baked.... :eek:
     
  11. patrick0brien macrumors 68040

    patrick0brien

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2002
    Location:
    The West Loop
    #11
    -Don't panic

    Hah! Well, I appreciate your respect.

    Here's something scary though - I actually kinda liked the movie. Sure it could have been a bit better filmed and acted, but it does have interesting points to make.
     
  12. Don't panic macrumors 603

    Don't panic

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2004
    Location:
    having a drink at Milliways
    #12
    i guess that i'll have to admit that I have seen it as well... in a theater!
    It was probably the worst movie I ever paid to watch (but I might have removed a couple to mantain my mental sanity).
    I should have realized something was wrong when i walked into an empty theater. And I mean EMPTY. I was the only person in the room for the entire duration. But i endured it to the very end, always expecting them to shut it down and refunding me the ticket (it didn't happen).
     
  13. Chip NoVaMac macrumors G3

    Chip NoVaMac

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2003
    Location:
    Northern Virginia
    #13
    Given that Bush and Kerry are avid "sportsmen"; wonder how many guns laws Bush has violated? Maybe his Dad helped him avoid the real justice of the law....
     

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