The BBC's take on Pol. Correctness in the US for Christmas

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Stelliform, Dec 23, 2003.

  1. Stelliform macrumors 68000

    Stelliform

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    #1
    I found this story quite amusing. I wonder why no reporter in the US has the balls to print something like this...

    Quote....

    Link....
     
  2. LethalWolfe macrumors G3

    LethalWolfe

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    #2
    Re: The BBC's take on Pol. Correctness in the US for Christmas


    Editorials about the de-religioning of Xmas are fairly common this time of year. I'm not sure why you think no journalist in the US hasn't said the exact same thing that that article did.


    Lethal
     
  3. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #3
    My feeling is that if the religious folks would be less forceful with things like putting the 10 commandments in courtrooms and classrooms, the secular folks would be more tolerant of things like the spirit of Xmas and not protesting every manger and wise man they see.
     
  4. LethalWolfe macrumors G3

    LethalWolfe

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    #4
    I think this is just another symptom of a larger PC trend. There are some people out there that are so wrapped-up in making sure that the rights of minorities aren't trampled that they trample the rights of the majority in the process.

    Of course this whole thing is part of a dumbing down of American, IMO. All of the lawsuits are another example. And some schools have eliminated various compititions (both physical and mental) because they are afraid the kids who don't win will be emotional scared for life. So instead of pushing our children to do better and strive for excellence we are making them all equally dumb and fat, and unable to cope w/reality.

    I could probably rant on and on but I'm at work and at least have to appear busy. ;)


    Lethal
     
  5. Sayhey macrumors 68000

    Sayhey

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    #5
    There are some amazing things that are done in the name of political correctness. Things like the renaming of "male" and "female" connections are just dumb. The campaign to keep one religion from inserting its beliefs into are public schools is not one of those "dumb" ideas even if some stupid things are done in the pursuit of that goal.

    I would like comparative religions taught in schools. I think it makes sense for an objective teaching of what different religious practices are to be part of learning what our society is about. That does not mean taking for granted it is ok to give those practices free rein over school activities. I was raised in an era when it was assumed everyone was Christian (and Protestant to boot.) Going back to those days is not a good idea.
     
  6. LethalWolfe macrumors G3

    LethalWolfe

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    #6

    I agree. This kind of goes along w/what I said in my previous post. Instead of pulling everyone down (trying to make believe religion doesn't exist) we should be pushing everyone one up (exposing/educating people about different religions).

    I don't think people should force their views, religion, or culture on other people, but at the same time people shouldn't be forced to hide their views, religion or culture. And if you are a minority expect to see a lot of things that don't pretain to you. That kinda comes w/the territory of being a minority. If I go to Isreal I'm not going to complain about all the Jewish symbols and traditions I'm surounded with and demand they take down some Star's of David and toss up a few crucifixes. If I'm in Germany I'm not going to expect people to speak English to me. When I was working at a store in a prodominantly<sp?> black area I wasn't telling people to speak "proper" English or to pull their damn pants up. Most of my employees and customers came from a very different backgrounds than I did but we didn't focus on how we were different. We found out how we were the same and, even though the job sucked, goin' to work everyday wasn't too bad 'cause we were all friends and, as much as we could, we tried to be there for one another.

    Live and let live. Educate don't legislate.

    Damn I just can't seem to not stopping ranting...:eek: ;)


    Lethal
     
  7. Dont Hurt Me macrumors 603

    Dont Hurt Me

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    #7
    i agree with you 100% except the being at work part
     
  8. LethalWolfe macrumors G3

    LethalWolfe

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    #8
    nevermind. I need to work on my reading comprehension skills. And probably my spelling.


    Lethal
     
  9. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #9
    The problem with American evangelicals is that they feel they they have been given a mandate by god to "spread the word" and many American religions in this day and age seem to have no idea of what "love thy neighbor" really means. I'm all for comparative religious studies in high school, but actual religious instruction does not belong in US public schools.

    The last few years I've noticed a trend around Christmas whereby not everyone says "Merry Christmas" or even "Happy Holidays" in greeting anymore. As someone who places much more emphasis on the winter solstice, which is the basis for most of Christmas anyway, I welcome it greatly. For those who don't believe that Jesus' birth was the be all and end all of western civilization, it is very refreshing.
     
  10. Sayhey macrumors 68000

    Sayhey

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    #10
    Ugg, I agree with the idea that religious training does not belong in US public schools, but I also think there should be room for a comparative religion class in the High School level. I have two reasons for this. First, I don't think one has an adequate understanding of society if one doesn't have a basic understanding of religion. Second, it would be very important for those who think that Christianity is the only way of looking at the world to be exposed, even in an elementary way, to other beliefs. I am an atheist, so I would prefer that none of these ideas are force fed to children, but a basic understanding of each other would do us all good.

    I hope you had a good solstice and enjoy the new year.
     
  11. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #11
    I agree with you wholeheartedly that comparative religious classes should be taught in HS. A class that outlines the basic beliefs of all major religions with emphasis on the major offshoots and current trends in religion would be very valuable in our society.

    I had a Jewish friend in college from whom I learned a lot about Judaism but he claimed to know very little about Christianity even though he went to public schools. I found that very hard to believe at the time (early nineties) and still do today. But it made me realize that schools are pretty secular already (he went to HS in Seattle) but through that secularization we are losing touch with something that, if we are to believe the pollsters, is very close to many Americans' hearts. Ignorance is not bliss when it comes to religion and I feel this country for the most part is very ignorant when it comes to anything outside of mainstream Christianity. I'll admit that the majority of my knowledge of Islam has occurred over the last year.

    Solstice was great, thanks!
     
  12. McToast macrumors member

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    #12
    I went to a private prep school and we had a comparative religion class (that everyone took - mandatory)..in the *8th Grade*...and that was in 1981!
     
  13. Code101 macrumors newbie

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    #13
    That's why it's time to drop public education and make it all private. It's time to give a full tax refund to all who take their kids out of public schools and put them in private schools.

    Here in Utah, there is a big push for private education. It's really taking off. Kids will get to learn about their own religion for once with out the ACLU thugs getting involved.

    If anything, it will be some stiff competition in making public schools do better with what they have. I know that if private schools managed money the way public schools do, they would be out of business on the first day of school.
     
  14. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #14
    i know if public schools had the same $/student private schools did, we'd all be a lot better educated.

    i also know that if parents had to pay private school rates to educate their kids, there'd be a big number of kids who would never even get to go to school.
     
  15. Sayhey macrumors 68000

    Sayhey

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    #15
    The existence of a universal non-religious educational system is a prerequisite for the working of a modern democracy. If we are to begin to pay for private religious training out of public funds we will have demolished the wall of separation of Church and State. Not only would Jefferson and Madison be turning over in their graves, but we would condemn our children to inferior classes that teach such foolishness as "creationism" as legitimate science.

    I know this has been a dream of the John Birch Society and others on the religious and political fringes of the right for many years, but even with Bush in the White House and majorities for the Republicans in both houses of Congress, they are not fool enough to openly adopt your agenda. At least not until after the upcoming election. If that day comes we will have taken a very large step back into the dark ages.
     
  16. Code101 macrumors newbie

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    #16
    What about the foolishness of Darwinism and the "big bang" junk that is pushed on students today against their parents will. That is a form of religion with the mask of science.

    I don't want my kids to learn about that. Where is the ACLU?
     
  17. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #17
    ha! you just outed yourself! hi-larious.
     
  18. Code101 macrumors newbie

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    #18
    No, I did not. As I said before, it is time for private schools. If parents want there kids to learn about Darwin, they can send them to that kind of school. If parents want their kids to learn about Jesus, then they can send their kids to that kind of school. The point is that it is private.

    It works for everyone. Even people with your viewpoint.
     
  19. Sayhey macrumors 68000

    Sayhey

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    #19
    You don't have to have your children go to public schools or have them learn the basis of most of modern biological sciences or astronomy, if you don't want. That choice has always been open to you. The need for a educated citizenry is, however not a choice we can afford to ignore.

    If you want to take this country back to the days of mass illiteracy and the religious veto of what is taught in our classrooms then I think you will find little support for your extreme ideas. Public education needs the support and the expansion of resources that it has been denied by ideologues like yourself for so many years. It will be a sad day if through the use of jingoism and religious intolerance you are successful in the destruction of a secular educational system that has made our country one of the great economic and political success stories of the last two hundred years.
     
  20. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #20
    you had just said you wanted to convert all education to religious, private school, because the education was better.

    but in reality, you're an anti-science jesus nut. and that's fine, you have that choice. i support that. but you're advocating lack of choice, and a religious one at that, and that's not what this country is about. even to people with "my viewpoint" (thanks for the laugh, btw).

    and fwiw, science isn't a religion.
     
  21. wwworry macrumors regular

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    #21
    -

    I want my kids to know that it all rests on the back of a turtle and I expect the ACLU to help.
     
  22. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #22
    awesome
     
  23. Sayhey macrumors 68000

    Sayhey

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    #23
    I've never been clear on whether that makes you a turtlian or a turtlist? ;)
     
  24. wwworry macrumors regular

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  25. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #25
    Oh man, you're killin' me!:D :p ;) :)

    Turtolitarian. I love it. Join the Terrapin party or DIE!
     

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