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Discussion in 'Current Events' started by Thomas Veil, Nov 13, 2004.
Couple planned to "sacrifice" children
At least they're extremely devoted and faithful to their church, can't really say that about the rest of their neighbors.
Not too many people are willing to do this much for any church.
Even if they aren't the sanest people on the block.
If thats the case her and her boyfriend should have just sacrificed themselves.
Agreed. I'm religious, but I'm not crazy...
Way to go church workers -- good for them for taking action on this. This definetely could have been something awful.
you do know alot of non-religious people look at religion as a form of delusion right? to them, you are most definitely crazy, maybe not at the sacrificial level, but believing in a guy in a cloud and the extra-dimensional realities of heaven and hell would classify you as not the most rational of people either.
you have to be a little crazy to believe in something that cannot be proven, even in the most mundane sense, you may take that offensively, but it's not meant to be, just citing other's viewpoints of religion.
look at it this way, there are over 1000 religions, everyone believes THEIR's is the right faith, everyone else is wrong, well you would all agree that another religion is wrong, but none of you would support another religion...so you can't all be right...which would mean you are all wrong.
*Crosses fingers for the rapture* c'mon, any day now!
I'm religious because I don't know... I don't go to church tho. and everyone is a little crazy. Hell, people in Toronto think the Maple Leafs are good.
Strange thing is, the church was "St. Mary's", which means these folks belonged to a regular Catholic or mainstream Protestant church, not some wacko cult.
And I'll leave the "non-belief" thing to others. All I'll say is, I just don't know how atheists can be sure there isn't a God. Purely aside from it being impossible to prove a negative, how do they explain all the eyewitness accounts in the Bible which, even if they don't match up perfectly, certainly indicate that something supernatural happened...not to mention similar experiences in other faith systems?
Of being human
I think religion is less of a "crazy" thing than it is the natural combo of humanity's strong sense of curiosity and strong skill for creativity and invention. That combo naturally leads to religion. (Unless everything begins to fall into place for them to lead some to science, as it has in the last couple of hundred years.)
I do have to tap into the thought (that was mentioned) that everyone's obligated to believe other religions are wrong. While this is clearly what people tend to believe, I have faith that it some day won't be. Ideally, we'd all be able to say:
"Whelp - there can only be one truth. And it has to be true no matter where on the planet you are. I don't know what it is, and neither does anyone else. But, this is the set of beliefs that makes ME the best person that I can be and that leads me to take the best care of those around me. Another person may be able to do more good under another set of beliefs. And, no matter what god or gods are around, it should matter more to him/her/them that I was good to my fellow humans than that I guessed right on his/her/their name(s), history, or personality traits. And if he/she/they would punish me for being a good person who didn't guess the right name(s), history, or personality traits, then he/she/they really isn't a god worthy of my worship, anyway."
Be good to your neighbors - and the rest will follow.
Oh, and killing your kids (or anyone else) doesn't count as being good to them.
Hey Thomas - do you believe everything you read? Well, you shouldn't! the world is full of people who's trying to shape it in their own picture. In fact everybody does that to some extent, even if it's subconsiously... and remeber, even if people mean to be truthfull and objective, they are always limited by their own (limited) knowledge.
So what you should always remember when you read something, is to use your critical sense to judge how trustworthy the authors are and which motifs they might have to tell the story their telling the way their telling it. You also must try and understand the context in which the text was written. This is very important and it counts when you read newspapers, watch television, read macrumors, see advertisements for free iPods, etc. etc...
I don't understand how anyone can think that what is written in the bible is the pure truth! It's written by old, powerful men, living in a society of nomadic goatherders several thousands of years ago!! c'mon...
The bible is a fine book, it should just be taken for what it is... and, yes, be good to your neighbours.
Well, anybody who knows me from the Political Forum knows I can be plenty skeptical.
But the Apostles, well...they've never lied to me before....
That is very sad that their religious beliefs would lead them down this path. Just happy to hear that the three children are OK. They are lucky that the alert workers were around.
Something doesn't seem right here....
How were they going to sacrifice the children? There was no talk of weapons or rope - in fact they even mentioned there wasn't any...
And totally nuts - why did she think the sacrifice would cleanse her soul? What about the children's? This woman was obviously not right in the head....
he he, good to know... just wanted to make sure...
Their facts are hard to check up on, tho'
There is no scientific evidence of anything supernatural, proven fact.
Reference: "The Demon Haunted World, Science As A Candle In The Dark", Carl Sagan
Eyewitness accounts in the bible, a book of fiction? The bible says dragons, unicorns, serpents that can kill you by looking at you exist.
Eyewitness accounts in the bible, you mean like the books of the Apostles?
On the bright side, if you can prove the supernatural or paranormal James Randy will give you a million dollars!!!!!
To date, no one has ever passed the preliminary tests.
For the record, not an atheist; I am a secular humanist.
Well, apparently my little jest, meant to extricate us from a pointless "God-is-real/No-he's-not" argument, didn't work....
All of what's in that quote I've already acknowledged, in that it coincides with something we already know: eyewitness descriptions -- especially accounts written years later from memory -- usually differ. And sometimes descriptions aren't even eyewitness, they're second-hand.
More to the point, as I said, you can't really prove a negative. Prudence would seem to indicate that at least agnosticism is in order. I myself don't believe in ghosts and UFOs, but I'm not so bold as to say for an absolute fact that they don't exist.
But secular humanism is good. I always think of it as Christianity without the "Christ". It beats a lot of the evil that is done in His name.
Science isn't infallible either. Theories are constantly refined on the basis of new information. The lack of scientific proof does not negate the possibility of the existence of a thing, any more than the many errors and inconsistencies of the Bible have to be taken to mean that every last bit of it must be false.
There isn't any scientific basis for love, or hope, or idealism, or any other of the many things that separate man from the animals and give our lives humanity and meaning. The purpose of faith is not to make us right, it's to make us better.
Now that's a seriously messed up couple, there. It would take a giant Monty Python-style face appearing in the clouds and handing me a written declaration that there was a dang good reason I should be murdering my own kids (say, they were going to become the Hitler Trio later in life, but their souls could be saved by offing them now) before I'd even entertain the thought. Even then, I'd have my doubts about any God who would ask their own parents to do it instead of asking them directly or just throwing in a car accident or something.
I always find that classic argument amusingly illogical; by that line of reasoning, any time there was a disagreement about anything, it would be proof that both opinions were wrong, which obviously isn't the case.
I'd much rather believe that most world religions (not all--some are obviously self-serving power plays from the begining, not just after a greedy leader gets his hands on it) are manifestations of some greater power that is interpreted different ways by different people. That, at least, would be one way of explaining why almost every culture has some religion, and most share several basic points.
Hey watch it buddy! Just because you're a Sens fan doesn't mean you can get away with cracks like that!
These people need help, but you can view this is typical modern thinking; i.e. that sacrificing others is the quick way to solve your own problems.
BTW everyone here debating over the existance of Jesus, or the historical reference of the Bible should read Tom Harpur's The Pagan Christ
haha... don't go calling me a sens fan! I used to be a leafs fan back when they had wendal, the cat and killer... not so much anymore... I started rooting for ottawa, but then they went a ruined that when they signed Hasek - quite possibly the most hated player by me, next to ulf samulson...
for the record, I'm a bruins fan...