U.S. commander: No civil war in Iraq

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by obeygiant, Mar 27, 2007.

  1. obeygiant macrumors 68040

    obeygiant

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    #1
    cnn

    The commander says the Iraqis want better security, and that business is better when security is tight.
     
  2. it5five macrumors 65816

    it5five

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    #2
    Of course the commander says that. It's his job to say what the President wants him to. And we all know that reality and Bush don't mix well.
     
  3. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #3
    Agreed. Is this predictable or what?
     
  4. it5five macrumors 65816

    it5five

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    Well, you know. Bush wants people to believe that throwing more bodies in the mess will solve the problem. We're probably going to see more "reports" from commanders saying that Iraq is getting better. Unfortunately, the body count says otherwise.

    I had even heard on NPR how the US Military was reporting lower numbers of dead Iraqis than actually died. It's only the un-identified and un-claimed bodies they report as dead. All of the ID'd bodies don't count, apparently.

    It's funny, I'm at NPR.org right now, looking at the amount of dead Iraq civilians each different organization is reporting.

    Bush Administration: 30,000
    Iraq Body Count: 62,985
    Brookings Instution: 70,100
    Iraq Health Ministry: 150,000
    John Hopkins School of Public Health: 650,000

    Not to mention the millions of Iraqis that have fled their country. Last I heard that number was in the millions.

    Anyway, here is the link for that.
     
  5. Queso macrumors G4

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    #5
    Of course there's no civil war in Iraq. For a start, if you're going to have a civil war you need a country to have it in. Iraq simply doesn't exist as anything other than territory nobody else is claiming.
     
  6. iPhil macrumors 68040

    iPhil

    #6
    Well the General of The US Central Command has found the stash of Bush Reality Koolaid .. ;) ;)
     
  7. BoyBach macrumors 68040

    BoyBach

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    #7
    Is this the 'Official' view or the commander's personal opinion?
     
  8. obeygiant thread starter macrumors 68040

    obeygiant

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    #8
    .
     
  9. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #9
    Hmm, would you prefer to call it anarchy instead?
     
  10. Queso macrumors G4

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    #10
    An anarchy is an absence of government, but the word doesn't imply bloodshed or violence. Shambles is closest word I could find.
     
  11. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    How about "quagmire"? You know where you are with a quagmire.
     
  12. Peterkro macrumors 68020

    Peterkro

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    #12
    Thank you dynamicv :D .Neither does it imply disorder,the circle in the Anarchy symbol is to represent order(via Anarchy).
     
  13. BoyBach macrumors 68040

    BoyBach

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    #13

    "Giggety giggety giggety, alright!"

    (Apologies, but I couldn't resist! :eek: )
     

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  14. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #14
    Shoot, I thought we were told that we were doing good if the violence was rising against us. Shows the enemy's desperation we were told.

    But hey, if a US commander said it, it has to be true!
     
  15. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #15
    look who's agreeing w/ the hopkins estimate:
     
  16. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #16
    Fine, what do YOU call it? A disagreement amongst friends?
     
  17. Dont Hurt Me macrumors 603

    Dont Hurt Me

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  18. obeygiant thread starter macrumors 68040

    obeygiant

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    #18
    I'm not sure. I'm just examining whats so "civil war" about it.

    Also I'm not convinced that a U.S. Commander lied to a CNN reporter about his findings.
     
  19. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #19
    Really? They never spin? Really?

    Um, who cares what we call it. It's a mess. That we're still stuck in. With no way out. Saying it isn't a Civil War doesn't make anyone less dead and us less angry.
     
  20. obeygiant thread starter macrumors 68040

    obeygiant

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    #20
    Spin is one thing, and of course that happens, but lying to a reporter who is watching and filming the same thing they both are looking at is another.

    I would agree that its a mess, there is no such thing as a tidy war. But calling it a civil war turn the tide of public opinion for political gain is something else. Why was this called a Civil war in the first place? Because NBC news decided to call it that? Remember that one? So now its just regurgitated everywhere without truly knowing what the actual circumstances are.
     
  21. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #21
    So I take it you rail against conservatives who re-named the estate tax the "death tax" in order to turn the tide of public opinion for political gain?

    I thought not...
     
  22. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #22
    So you're saying that the neither the Pentagon nor the WH has ever lied to the public in front of a reporter? You're living in some kind of a fantasy world, because they do it all the time, no matter what their party affiliation.

    There are three distinct ethnic groups in Iraq. The Kurds definitely have their own functioning government as do the Sunnis and for that matter the Shiites. While it may not follow the route that the US civil war took it's still pretty clearly defined by ethnic differences.

    In the end, does it matter what kind of war it's called? Is ethnic strife better than civil war or a war of illegal occupation? Let's face it, war just like life, evolves and just because this war doesn't fit some tidy preconceived idea of what war is, doesn't change the reality on the ground.

    It sounds like this general has spent way too much time in his ivory tower and too little time on the ground talking to the factions involved. There's also a good chance the Pentagon has been issued its own talking points memo to be regurgitated at every possible opportunity.
     
  23. atszyman macrumors 68020

    atszyman

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    #23
    It's sort of like a Civil War but more complex? And that's supposed to put my mind at ease?
     
  24. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #24
    Yeah, I don't get what they're trying to say. It's still as bad as a Civil War. Worse actually. I would think "everybody's killing each other all the time" sounds a lot worse than Civil War, but that would be a more fitting term actually.

    Or, are they trying to say NBC turned people against the war, because I don't think that's why that's happening. It's probably all the killing. After 4 years, when they said it would be quick and easy. And no WMDs, no ties to Al Qaida, gas prices going up...
     
  25. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #25
    What's going on in Iraq may not fit the dictionary definition of a civil war, but those two words describe it more closely than anything else anyone's been able to come up with.

    As far as sticking around longer so the country can become more secure so that basic services can resume...uh-uh. We've been hearing that for the entire war as the country instead descends further and further into chaos.

    These people wanna kill each other. Saddam had a lid on it, and Bush removed him. It's too late now. For four years we've been doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. And that, you'll recall, is the definition of insanity.
     

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