UK: Motorists 'must pay for road use'

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by bigandy, Dec 1, 2006.

  1. bigandy macrumors G3

    bigandy

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2004
    Location:
    Murka
    #1
    i think it's a bit cheeky for the government to be asking motorists to 'pay to use roads' - we already pay. in case they didn't realise, there's this thing called a 'tax disc' that covers this, and costs some people, including myself, almost £200 (US$400) a year.

    more here.


    grr. :mad:
     
  2. spicyapple macrumors 68000

    spicyapple

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2006
    #2
    Errr... that sucks. I was also surprised you guys have to pay a license to own television sets. Cost of living in UK must be really expensive.
     
  3. R.Youden macrumors 68020

    R.Youden

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2005
    #3
    I think this is a great idea. I live in Bristol and very rarely use my car (probably less than 1500 miles per year) and for me this would be a great solution. Also it would ease traffic congestion and get people out of their cars. I imagine that many peoples journys can easily be made using public transport. This may be an "rose tinited glasses" solution but people do need to realise that we are causing ireperable damage to this planet. I, for one, dont want to be known as a member of the generation which used up all the natural resources and killed this planet. I am not a tree hugger or anything like that but i think people need to start taking responsibility for their actions. Just because they cant see the end result doesnt mean it is not happening.

    My only concern is that public transport cannot withstand an increased volume surge that this would cause so it has to be thought about very carefully.
     
  4. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #4
    wait...a license to own a TV?
     
  5. R.Youden macrumors 68020

    R.Youden

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2005
    #5
    We need a license to watch TV. We get some channels without adverts so we have to pay for that. Just over £100 per year I think.
     
  6. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #6
    Ok how does that work exactly, Is it like cable TV?
     
  7. R.Youden macrumors 68020

    R.Youden

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2005
    #7
    Your basic setup is:

    BBC1
    BBC2
    ITV
    Channel 4
    Channel 5

    BBC1 and BBC2 dont have any adverts so you pay a fee for them (even if you dont watch them you still have to pay). All the others get adverts ever 15 minutes or so. This is through a standard aerial. If you dont pay the license they can come round and check to see if you have a TV. They even have vans which can check to see if you are watching TV.
     
  8. spicyapple macrumors 68000

    spicyapple

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2006
    #8
    Sounds like extortion. So if they catch you without a licence, do they break your knee caps? :p

    luv ya bunches! xoxoxo
     
  9. R.Youden macrumors 68020

    R.Youden

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2005
    #9
    Just your thumbs to start with...

    You get finned upto £1000 or so. If you are really that interested on Friday click here. Enjoy!
     
  10. Osarkon macrumors 68020

    Osarkon

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2006
    Location:
    Wales
    #10
    For goodness sake, as if it doesn't cost enough to keep a car on the road as it is, what with insurance, MOT and tax. This proposed scheme will also help keep younger drivers off the road. Or just have more people breaking the law.

    Just passed my test, this isn't exactly what I want to hear. :mad:
     
  11. R.Youden macrumors 68020

    R.Youden

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2005
    #11
    I just passed my test. I imagine that this will result in the removal of road tax and a set up with insurance being handled in the same way as road tax, per mile. I would also expect that this would result in a reduction in fuel duty.
     
  12. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #12
    I dunno how you people can live over there. And they say its bad here.
     
  13. Queso macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2006
    #13
    I'm going to rant about this. I can feel it coming.

    Successive British Governments have failed to invest in our public transport whilst demanding that the systems are modernised. So to pay for it the train companies, bus companies, London Underground etc. have been putting their prices up by far more than inflation for years. At the same time, the completely out of touch s**theads in Westminster are telling us we need to give up our own transport and use the ridiculously expensive public alternative, or work closer to home even though the jobs are all in the middle of the cities where the average house price is now something like 12 times the average wage.

    And now, despite road vehicle tax and more importantly a HUGE tax levy on petrol, they also want to introduce a pay by mile scheme for the motorist and monitor where our vehicles are at all times to ensure compliance. In the meantime what are they spending the tax money on? Wars nobody wants, more CCTV cameras, ID cards, and a centralised database so they can track every aspect of our lives.

    The Government can fsck off. Britain can fsck off if it thinks I'm going to be a part of this. I'm sick to death of Whitehall thinking that Orwell's 1984 is a policy outline rather than a warning. If they introduce this I'm out of here, and that nice big sum I pay to the Exchequer every year goes with me.
     
  14. bigandy thread starter macrumors G3

    bigandy

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2004
    Location:
    Murka
    #14
    I think it's utter crap. according to the article it's not an absolute that it would replace the existing car tax - that it would be more like the M6 Toll. And on that note, why the hell am I being charged to drive down a road I've already paid for?

    In the UK, the roads are crap. The public transport is crap. The government makes, on average, £150 a year from each and every car on the road. They also take about £0.70 of the £0.839 average fuel cost in more tax. And where does all this money go? The only huge development that I've seen in the infrastructure of this country since I started driving almost eight years ago is the construction of the Midlands Bypass - the M6 Toll - which is that - a toll road.

    I mean it's not exactly like we get the benefits instead on the NHS :rolleyes:


    -----------------------------------

    And on the TV note, yes, we have to pay a license of £131.50 to have a TV, DVD Recorder or anything. It's a license paid to fund the BBC's services. More...
     
  15. theBB macrumors 68020

    theBB

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2006
    #15
    I understand everybody loves everything to be free, but there is nothing wrong with toll roads. You use it, you pay for it. It is not fair to get other people to pay for the road you use. You save money by buying a house far away from where you work and then demand that government subsidize your choice by building free roads to your door. I'd rather pay less income taxes and more usage fees, so the cost of everybody's lifestyles become transparent. Why should I pay (through my taxes) for the water you use for your lawn or the road you use for your commute? Would you like the government to pay for your phone calls as well?
     
  16. Queso macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2006
    #16
    See my earlier post. Wars nobody wants etc....

    I'm all for reducing road use, but to do it at the same time as increasing the cost of public transport smacks of the surveillance society and discouraging people from travelling just to keep them under control. Rail fares should be half what they are already. Instead this Government would rather increase the size of the Civil Service to the point where it is collapsing under its own weight, then try and justify it by increasing the amount of information they hold on the population.

    Bastards.
     
  17. killmoms macrumors 68040

    killmoms

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2003
    Location:
    Washington, DC
    #17
    If by "extortion" you mean "essentially a tax that funds one of the best publically-owned media services in the world," then... yes? Do some research on the history of radio and television development and see why MANY people in the U.S. wish we had gone with a publically-funded model of telecommunications rather than a privately-owned one (which has netted us our current media landscape with all its MANY faults).

    As for the toll road thing... I know taxes in the U.K. are higher than they are in the U.S. (cost of having so many public services), but we pay taxes here AND still have toll roads. Driving from D.C. to New York used to cost quite a bit in tolls, know why? Because the cost of maintaining those HEAVILY travelled stretches of I-95 is higher than the local taxes collected from people who reside in areas they run through. It makes sense to collect extra money from motorists to maintain the road, especially since without them there wouldn't be enough (or they'd have to divert inordinate sums of local transportation tax money, leaving little for improvements to roads in those local areas besides the interstate). I don't see what the big problem is, I guess. :confused:

    dynamicv has his tin-foil hat on a little too tight. :p
     
  18. MacRy macrumors 68040

    MacRy

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2004
    Location:
    England
    #18
    This sucks big time. When they announced plans for this a while back they gave an example of charges that would be levied and it worked out that it would cost me about £60 per day to get to work and back (that's a 60 mile round trip). My alternative would be to get a bus to the train station 10 miles in the opposite direction to my workplace and then a train to the town I work in, followed by another bus to my workplace......Well that's all plausible I hear you say, but I live in a village which isn't on a bus route and work in a building that also isn't on a bus route. So that's a 10+mile walk to and from public transport. So how is this helping me then? My journey time just went from 35 minutes to....well, god knows because I don't know how long it would take me to walk 10+ miles in the morning. It's all very well supporting these schemes when you live in a city but not quite so marvelous when you don't. I have to live here too because my partner has a job which means we have to live where we do. Unless there is a viable alternative to me using my car then this hair-brained scheme is total bollocks.
     
  19. thewhitehart macrumors 6502a

    thewhitehart

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2005
    Location:
    The town without George Bailey
    #19
    I certainly agree with dynamicv - the rail fares should definitely be halved, although I found public transportation in Britain to be far more comfortable than New York, aside from the cost, which stretches far beyond the inflation rate. There's something to be said for the social welfare state in this respect. There comes a point though when the price far exceeds the level of service, and I'd rather pay $2 to ride the NYC subway wherever I want in a crappy rickety old train than £3.60 or what not to get to Heathrow from Camden. New York is heading in the same direction, but the level of service isn't increasing.

    I do however find the quality and upkeep of the roads in Britain to be quite excellent compared to New York.
     
  20. Dont Hurt Me macrumors 603

    Dont Hurt Me

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2002
    Location:
    Yahooville S.C.
    #20
    Doesnt the Uk tax gas for roads? Just more Govt throwing tax on top of tax on top of tax. When do they start taxing the air your breath because this kind of thing wont stop until everything you do will be taxed. Uk is a bigger mess then I thought.
     
  21. Applespider macrumors G4

    Applespider

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2004
    Location:
    looking through rose-tinted spectacles...
    #21
    The BBC I'd pay double the current licence fee for since I do think that they're one of the few broadcasters to offer me the choice of watching online/normally etc. I listen to their radio and I watch their TV. And, surprisingly, I have slightly less disbelief in what their journalists produce than other stations.

    Motorists - yup, keep charging! Although I say that as a non-car-driver. I'd rather see a system that charged by how many miles you're driving rather than type of car. Public transport has improved (at least in London with bus routes) in the last 5 years but intercity travel is extortionate unless you fly. It's half the price to fly than to catch a train from London to Scotland which is ridiculous. But, there are too many cars on the road with a single occupant snarling up the roads and slowing everyone else down. Charge them to the hilt if they've got an option they're not taking - especially the 'school run' drivers.
     
  22. Counterfit macrumors G3

    Counterfit

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2003
    Location:
    sitting on your shoulder
    #22
    That's what we said! :D

    Yeah, that wouldn't work here. To take the only public transportation available to me, I would have to drive halfway to school anyway, then take that bus twice as far as I need to (downtown Providence), then take another one back to school (Prov./N.Prov. border, in the NE area). RI needs a subway system. :p
     
  23. sohosid macrumors member

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2006
    Location:
    Portland
    #23

    Drivers already are paying for it. Road tax. Massive petrol tax.

    UK Drivers have paid for the roads they use many many times over. No-ones tax goes to pay for roads, quite the opposite. Tax from petrol goes back to the treasury to pay for all those wonderful wars no-one wants or needs.

    One more reason I moved to America (No, it's not perfect, but it's (so far) waaaay better than living in London.)
     
  24. Maxiseller macrumors 6502a

    Maxiseller

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2005
    Location:
    Little grey, chilly island.
    #24
    The problem is, there are already roads with toll, but this plan would bring them widely implemented. Petrol is approx 70% + tax, which is why in american terms we pay $1.80 per litre. Throw in Car Tax, expensive insurance and an MOT and you've got yourself quite the expensive bundle.

    I wouldn't mind, but it's the Government who should have advocated greener cars which are out there years ago - for exaple putting money into developing Hydrogen Power and other sources. Instead, they conveniently carried on with petrol, and are now making US (The idiots) pay for their mistakes under the delusion of ut being "greener".

    If One Million people refused, they're not going to put them all in jail are they? There will be a revolt soon, mark my words.
     
  25. Queso macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2006
    #25
    Which is why I have no problem with the Congestion Charge type system as we have in London, but there's a move in Government at present to install little black boxes in our vehicles so they can get this pay per mile system to work. That I really think crosses the line, and if any Government official tries to tell you they would only use the info for traffic management, they are lying to you. This country has proved time and again that the Government will abuse any power you give it. The movement data will be recorded and passed automatically to your centralised database records, which the Inland Revenue, the Police, and the security services will be able to dig into with a key press.

    Don't trust them one bit, or the moment you make yourself heard they'll use everything they've got against you.

    BTW, to those Americans who don't realise it, we don't have proper Freedom of Information in this country, we also don't have a written Constitution to fall back on. It's basically a few "Activist Judges" and Civil Rights groups that keep the system steady. The politicians are constantly trying to take our rights away, and waste billions of taxpayers money in the process both on failed IT schemes and court cases. That money could easily be used to subsidise the public transport to the point where more people will voluntarily give up their cars. But then they wouldn't have their Big Government.
     

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